Marksman Needs Expert Help

[Aircool]

Ok. I'm having a tough time.

My build is 51mm/9nb/6ranger (ranger for snare and nb for damage bonus).

I'm kitted out in all the second tier of pvp gear except for the body/legs/shoulders of the top tier.

My valor is 1177 and my vengeance 150.

I've maxed out the attunement of war.

My health is about 6600, my AP & PhysCrit both around 880.

My source engine gives 100 str and 130 dex.

My rotation is basically:

Barbed Shot
Crippling Shot
Lightning Fury
Swift Shot

With Rapid Fire Shot and Hasted Shot as my finishers.

So why am I doing so little damage and getting killed so easily? I've tried kiting, but can't seem to outrun anyone as I get snared (even though I have On The Double and Break Free) or the other guy just teleports on top of me. I try and stay at the back of a group, although if I get separated, anyone 1v1 seems to have no trouble killing me. I've also tried using Retreat as soon as I start taking damage followed by On The Double. Whilst that does help somewhat, it means I spend more time out of the fight and running back to it, just to have to Retreat again.

Sword and Board Warriors seem to cause me massive amounts of damage, and even healing clerics seem to put out more damage than I can whilst being utterly unphased by what damage I can do myself.

I'm not whining about anyhting, I'd just like some sensible comment on what I have got wrong.

[Cedius]

Ok. I'm having a tough time.

My build is 51mm/9nb/6ranger (ranger for snare and nb for damage bonus).

I'm kitted out in all the second tier of pvp gear except for the body/legs/shoulders of the top tier.

My valor is 1177 and my vengeance 150.

I've maxed out the attunement of war.

My health is about 6600, my AP & PhysCrit both around 880.

My source engine gives 100 str and 130 dex.

My rotation is basically:

Barbed Shot
Crippling Shot
Lightning Fury
Swift Shot

With Rapid Fire Shot and Hasted Shot as my finishers.

So why am I doing so little damage and getting killed so easily? I've tried kiting, but can't seem to outrun anyone as I get snared (even though I have On The Double and Break Free) or the other guy just teleports on top of me. I try and stay at the back of a group, although if I get separated, anyone 1v1 seems to have no trouble killing me. I've also tried using Retreat as soon as I start taking damage followed by On The Double. Whilst that does help somewhat, it means I spend more time out of the fight and running back to it, just to have to Retreat again.

Sword and Board Warriors seem to cause me massive amounts of damage, and even healing clerics seem to put out more damage than I can whilst being utterly unphased by what damage I can do myself.

I'm not whining about anyhting, I'd just like some sensible comment on what I have got wrong.

Have you checked out Zyzyx's Rogue Bible sticky? You pretty much can't screw up 2 macro spam.

[Sariina]

So why am I doing so little damage and getting killed so easily?

Welcome to being a rogue. Try 44MM/22RS and at least you can take 5 hits instead of 3 . . . your damage will suffer a lot though. It also makes it easier to run away so you can keep absorbing favor and XP from all the useful players.

[Aircool]

Welcome to being a rogue. Try 44MM/22RS and at least you can take 5 hits instead of 3 . . . your damage will suffer a lot though. It also makes it easier to run away so you can keep absorbing favor and XP from all the useful players.

Ahhh. This is what I suspected, that the Marksman isn't really suited to PvP. Shame really, as I'm terrible in melee as I can't see the target reticle, so end up trying to fight someone on my own team.

I've checked out Zyzyx's Rogue Bible, but there's very little on pvp builds and my pve builds are very good.

Any more advice and comment would be much appreciated

[spaceboots]

message zaros or slic. Slic might be long gone, but i know Zaros is around still.

[-Shiva-]

Ahhh. This is what I suspected, that the Marksman isn't really suited to PvP. Shame really, as I'm terrible in melee as I can't see the target reticle, so end up trying to fight someone on my own team.

I've checked out Zyzyx's Rogue Bible, but there's very little on pvp builds and my pve builds are very good.

Any more advice and comment would be much appreciated

What? Marksman is one of the better specs we have for PvP. 44 MM/22 RS/0 BD is a good MM PvP spec, it has just about everything you need to do well, as long as you know how to kite. Learning how to stay 34 metres away from your opponent is also a good trick to learn. It's hard, but if you can keep a lot of distance on your target you can do very well. Even if your opponent does manage to close, you have On the Double, a teleport, and Retreat to help get away. With Quick Reload up you can use OtD, Retreat, QR, Retreat, OtD to get out of anybody's range.

Also, Eradicating an RB Warrior's Planar Blade buff off them helps keep them off your back, and whenever you see Riftstorm start up, use your KB or Retreat to get out of melee range immediately. That talent hurts... well atm anyway.

[Naesraen]

Ahhh. This is what I suspected, that the Marksman isn't really suited to PvP. Shame really, as I'm terrible in melee as I can't see the target reticle, so end up trying to fight someone on my own team.

I've checked out Zyzyx's Rogue Bible, but there's very little on pvp builds and my pve builds are very good.

Any more advice and comment would be much appreciated

Am0n's all-purpose Rogue PvP guide will give you all the information you need.

[Violacea]

51mm/14ranger/1rs - good if you can work with the casting times/have a set bonus to take them away (ranger abilities)

51mm/10nb/5rs - MM soul with aid from the other 2 souls. Stealth option.

49mm/17sin - with exposed weakness, higher crit chance and good crit bonus, it requires no build up to reach top damage. Ie. procing 51mm abil 10x on a target. While the 51mm/10nb/5rs and probably the other hit harder in the end. One is based around casting shadow fire, and the other is more or less based around getting good procs up unless you flatten them in 2 seconds. this builds top damage is very immediate and fast, esp with exposed weakness. Exposed weakness crits rival the top shots of the other 2 builds iirc. If not beat it was very same close ballpark. If you dump a little more points into sin for perma stealth, normal movement speed under stealth, you get a good sin style MM. In that you can camp and prep up attacks. Works same viability wise as Sin. Sneak attacks except with MM you can setup a perfect 30 - 35m range attack from far away. Also getting the jump with some shots is good too. I drop the spec a lot and had little use for it, but it is nice having a perma stealth MM for some situations. The art of finding amazing vantage points In the end though I think the pure sin does that job better, just thought I would mention though.

MM/RS mixes - Do less damage, survive way better. Much stronger chance of living down 1 v 1's that get personal. Depending how far you spec can get insane mobility. Probably the 2 most mobile rogue souls. Only problem is half the RS's mobility moves you closer to the target. So only half the ports work in a kiting manner imo. Although porting 20m to a target and bolting another direction I can see working out at times.

[Zaros]

Welcome to being a rogue. Try 44MM/22RS and at least you can take 5 hits instead of 3 . . . your damage will suffer a lot though. It also makes it easier to run away so you can keep absorbing favor and XP from all the useful players.

This is so inaccurate it's not even funny.
When played well, Marksman is possibly the most overpowered spec in the game.

@OP If you're playing 51 MM, the trick is awareness. As long as you know where your enemies are and can see them coming for you, you shouldn't ever die. Learning to play with a Greater Recon Vial makes this exponentially easier.

Make sure to utilize 35M range, you should be practically underextending. Be out of tab target range, don't throw yourself at the enemy.

Stay within a group, and play static turret DPS. Be indiscriminate with who you target, just focus on tearing up whoever's closest to you, so you don't extend into their line. If that means it's a tank Warrior, that's fine. You have Eradicate, you can effectively nullify any healing he takes.

On the off-chance that a melee DPS targets you, you have the abilities to get away. Any Marksman should have access to Shadow Shift, On The Double and Retreat, combined with Quick Reload which resets the cooldown on all your Marksman abilities. Getting away from most melee should be a cakewalk.

I could write a lot more, but I'll stick with that for now. But above all: STOP SPAMMING FAN OUT.

[Oblivion333]

This is so inaccurate it's not even funny.
When played well, Marksman is possibly the most overpowered spec in the game.

@OP If you're playing 51 MM, the trick is awareness. As long as you know where your enemies are and can see them coming for you, you shouldn't ever die. Learning to play with a Greater Recon Vial makes this exponentially easier.

Make sure to utilize 35M range, you should be practically underextending. Be out of tab target range, don't throw yourself at the enemy.

Stay within a group, and play static turret DPS. Be indiscriminate with who you target, just focus on tearing up whoever's closest to you, so you don't extend into their line. If that means it's a tank Warrior, that's fine. You have Eradicate, you can effectively nullify any healing he takes.

On the off-chance that a melee DPS targets you, you have the abilities to get away. Any Marksman should have access to Shadow Shift, On The Double and Retreat, combined with Quick Reload which resets the cooldown on all your Marksman abilities. Getting away from most melee should be a cakewalk.

I could write a lot more, but I'll stick with that for now. But above all: STOP SPAMMING FAN OUT.

They all spaam fan out like cabs spam Tyranny. It just an easy 1 press button that is convenient.

[Zaros]

They all spaam fan out like cabs spam Tyranny. It just an easy 1 press button that is convenient.

The difference is Cabalist AoE is actually worth a damn. You might kill someone.
Marksman AoE is useless.

[Misun]

I could write a lot more, but I'll stick with that for now

Please do! I would really value a guide written up by you. You're the best mm I've seen in pvp. My little rogue can use all of the help she can get

The guides on the rogue forums are alright..but they are more pve guides. (at least the rogue bible one is)

[Velkane]

Please do! I would really value a guide written up by you. You're the best mm I've seen in pvp. My little rogue can use all of the help she can get

The guides on the rogue forums are alright..but they are more pve guides. (at least the rogue bible one is)

Agreed. Quiescent is the only yellow name I truly fear on the opposing team. I could list a dozen red names. Can't think of any green names (in terms of dying from them).

[Mei]

nvm forgot i have less fanboys