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Thread: No challenge @ Black Garden if you're defiant [?]

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    Soulwalker stalius's Avatar
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    Default No challenge @ Black Garden if you're defiant [?]

    So, i picked up defiant side and were in Black Garden about 5 times (lvl 10-13). And we win without any challenge or resistance even without trying all times about 50:500, although Guardians got high enough or higher level players and sides was well balanced, not 6vs3 or something. Guardians are not strong on PvP or what?

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    Ascendant Violacea's Avatar
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    Yep. Defiants are their Gods and stomp them for all of eternity to come.
    New round up of some high rank matches
    Chun-Li*E.Honda*Evil Ryu
    Abel*Ibuki*Dhalsim
    Gouken*Zangief*Ryu

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    Plane Touched Nakotix's Avatar
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    I blame PVE gear!

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    Soulwalker stalius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nakotix View Post
    I blame PVE gear!
    I don't think that gear is main reason.
    Actually, such situation is not very good. Without combat it's no fun in warfronts. Well, of course, farming goes good.
    Second place just means you're the first loser.

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    General of Telara
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    Quote Originally Posted by stalius View Post
    So, i picked up defiant side and were in Black Garden about 5 times (lvl 10-13). And we win without any challenge or resistance even without trying all times about 50:500, although Guardians got high enough or higher level players and sides was well balanced, not 6vs3 or something. Guardians are not strong on PvP or what?
    I play PvP alot. I was in Black Garden last night and went through time after time 50:500 games. I was on the Guardian losing side everytime. What I noticed is the game on the guardian side usually started with between 6 and 10 players, many of them mercs, who while the countdown to game proceeds, ***** about being mercs again....bla...bla...bla and how they hate this crap.

    The game starts and within a minute our side is down to 5 or 4 players as people leave the game or decide to sit out on the sidelines. New players pop in and then leave and we rarely get back up to 10 players until the game is almost over. By then we are so dominated that it is hopeless to win and the guardians don't even try to pick up shard. Instead they just run around trying to get a few kills because they know they are not going to win.

    So contrary to some popular belief, which doesn't make sense if you think about it, it is not that the Defiant are by some innate nature, better players than Guardian, it is the whole PvP system that Trion has put in that creates this problem. (Mercs, population of Factions, Twinks, XP locking, XP Gear, you name it)

    I have played PvP on MMOs for 10 years, and Trions PvP game is the worst...I hope they figure out how to fix it.
    Last edited by Riwijo; 04-26-2012 at 05:39 AM.

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    Ascendant spaceboots's Avatar
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    Stop playing with twinks............. Wait no p40 matches aren't ranked anymore since no p40s really play anymore so it's the same.

    Carry on for one more day.
    Last edited by spaceboots; 04-26-2012 at 05:39 AM.

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    Soulwalker stalius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Riwijo View Post
    I play PvP alot. I was in Black Garden last night and went through time after time 50:500 games. I was on the Guardian losing side everytime. What I noticed is the game on the guardian side usually started with between 6 and 10 players, many of them mercs, who while the countdown to game proceeds, ***** about being mercs again....bla...bla...bla and how they hate this crap.

    The game starts and within a minute our side is down to 5 or 4 players as people leave the game or decide to sit out on the sidelines. New players pop in and then leave and we rarely get back up to 10 players until the game is almost over. By then we are so dominated that it is hopeless to win and the guardians don't even try to pick up shard. Instead they just run around trying to get a few kills because they know they are not going to win.

    So contrary to some popular belief, which doesn't make sense if you think about it, it is not that the Defiant are by some innate nature, better players than Guardian, it is the whole PvP system that Trion has put in that creates this problem. (Mercs, population of Factions, Twinks, XP locking, XP Gear, you name it)

    I have played PvP on MMOs for 10 years, and Trions PvP game is the worst...I hope they figure out how to fix it.
    Yeah, excuse me, but what is "merc"[enaries]? I mean, how this thing works. Can somebody explain?
    After all, i must say, that i enjoy style of how PvP fights goes. It's somehow fast-paced and reminds me... Counter Strike or Quake III. Especially, when that voice says "unstoppable" or "first blood"
    Second place just means you're the first loser.

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    General of Telara
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    Quote Originally Posted by stalius View Post
    Yeah, excuse me, but what is "merc"[enaries]? I mean, how this thing works. Can somebody explain?
    After all, i must say, that i enjoy style of how PvP fights goes. It's somehow fast-paced and reminds me... Counter Strike or Quake III. Especially, when that voice says "unstoppable" or "first blood"
    Good question. I think it was put in by Trion to speed que times for warfronts. There was alot of complaining about the long wait time for warfronts to start. Partly, I think, from a population imbalance on some servers (many more defiant queing for warfront than guardian or vise versa)

    As it is now when you que for warfront you may end up on either side. For example if you are a defiant you may find yourself playing on the guardian side in the warfront. They call this the mercenary system. Unfortunatly you have no choice in the matter you may find yourself on the opposing factions side in any warfront. Many people hate the fact that they are forced to play for the 'enemy' and just will not do it. They either leave, sit on the sidelines, or natter alot in chat while the warfront plays. But to be honest most mercs will just play well regardless of what side they are on (red vs blue).
    Last edited by Riwijo; 04-26-2012 at 10:26 AM.

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    Plane Walker Grimt's Avatar
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    All these threads about one faction or another having an advantage in WF's are pretty silly. I've done hundreds of matches and most end up being pretty one-sided, but not because of some inherent system bias. The losing side typically loses because of one or more of these reasons:

    a). They went up against a decent premade. A pug will almost always get slaughtered by a premade on vent with a good mix of roles.

    b). They didn't have any healers. I'm amazed at how often a 10 man or even 15 man group won't have a single healer among them, but then again healers typically don't get the credit they deserve so maybe they just say screw it. I've seen this happen equally often for both Defiant and Guardian (when I'm a merc).

    c). Too many members of the group only joined to get kills to see where they landed on the deeps leaderboard.

    d). Too many players either don't bother to read raid chat, or outright ignore it to avoid the trash talk.

    e). The random mix of the queue simply put a lot of low geared players on one side or the other. Luck of the draw.


    The bottom line for me, though, is kind of a big "so what". I would like to see Trion put a little more balance into the system but not if it meant I had to wait a long time to get into a truly balanced match. I do WF's for fun and gear, and while a really screwed up group isn't a lot of fun to be on that thankfully doesn't happen very often and the **** is typically brief when it does. Each WF is different without the canned mechanics of a raid, and face plant WF groups are just another part of that picture. If I feel the need to come out on top all of the time I can always join a PvP guild or organize my own premade.

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    Most of the talk is about the lower brackets where there are generally lots of people maxed in bracket with their XP turned off. They have the max faction runes because another toon makes their armor and applies the best runes to each slot. They than use, for example, flaring glyph (the level 2 fire attunement that you have to be 50 to use) and apply it to a bound-to-account weapon and mail it back to their low level toon. So now, you have a level 19 who should have 120 SP roughly, who has double that from flaring glyph. This is why the warfronts are a bloodbath for one side or the other. Basically, whoever has the most people "exploiting" something Trion should have seen coming, wins.

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    Ascendant Charlice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not Listing It Here View Post
    Most of the talk is about the lower brackets where there are generally lots of people maxed in bracket with their XP turned off. They have the max faction runes because another toon makes their armor and applies the best runes to each slot. They than use, for example, flaring glyph (the level 2 fire attunement that you have to be 50 to use) and apply it to a bound-to-account weapon and mail it back to their low level toon. So now, you have a level 19 who should have 120 SP roughly, who has double that from flaring glyph. This is why the warfronts are a bloodbath for one side or the other. Basically, whoever has the most people "exploiting" something Trion should have seen coming, wins.
    But of course you can't do that anymore since Trion changed it.
    Seriously wish players would keep up, and stop spreading such crap.

    Also please list the bound to account weapons.

    It's got to the stage where any players sees a toon on the opposite side, with a number 9 in his level it's a twink. Do any of you take it in that maybe your side lost because you were crap? Or simply because the other team was better?


    Den of Madness | Greybriar | Den of Badness | Derpwood

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    Plane Touched
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charlice View Post
    But of course you can't do that anymore since Trion changed it.
    There is still 1 left that I know of in Droughtlands. Level 40 leg rune that has no minimum gear level requirement.
    Was about 7 sets of dailys away from finishing rep for it, but not sure i'm going to make it there.
    Last edited by Ploter; 04-26-2012 at 08:32 PM.

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    Ascendant Charlice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ploter View Post
    There is still 1 left that I know of in Droughtlands. Level 40 leg rune that has no minimum gear level requirement.
    Was about 7 sets of dailys away from finishing rep for it, but not sure i'm going to make it there.
    All this crying about twinks is how 'we' used to react if we lost in 50's warfronts. Boohooo must of been a pre-made.

    If someone is going to grind out faction in Droughtlands for a leg rune good luck to them. I went to that zone once, did about 5 quests and got the hell out of there .. that was enough.
    That being said I do hope they change it so it can't be equipped on lower level gear.

    So much crying about twinks, is done by players that don't even play in these particular warfronts.

    I have rolled so many toons now, just to see what all the crying was about, and I'm still yet to see it.
    (I have to admit only in 10-19 bracket) My latest experiment was rolled on a EU shard so I had no other toons to 'feed' it. I took it to warfronts from lvl 11 and it did just fine. Didn't win every warfront I zoned in to, but that was because the other team was better.

    The best part about the 10-19 warfronts is they are FUN. You know fun? What you play a game for? No lvl 50 whining, no name calling, and best part of all, most of the players are actually trying to win.

    There is just as many 'so called twinks' on both sides. Most of it IN MY OPINION is a learn to spec, gear, try, play, issue.


    Den of Madness | Greybriar | Den of Badness | Derpwood

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    Quote Originally Posted by Charlice View Post
    But of course you can't do that anymore since Trion changed it.
    Seriously wish players would keep up, and stop spreading such crap.

    Also please list the bound to account weapons.

    It's got to the stage where any players sees a toon on the opposite side, with a number 9 in his level it's a twink. Do any of you take it in that maybe your side lost because you were crap? Or simply because the other team was better?
    Well, as I haven't pvp'd this week, it is possible it changed, but Sunday it was still true. Can't speak for anyone else, but the level is mostly meaningless to me. I look at bars/health/mana, than buffs, and if they end up merc on my side, runes. Or, I just listen to them as they BS in /yell about how awesome they are, how everyone else sucks and how they are just as awesome on their rank 40 - even though no one is having a conversation with them. Everyone knows /yell macros win warfronts and make your ***** bigger.

    Not disagreeing that when most of your team is lvl 11-15 and doesn't know/understand the objective you will lose, but saying that having people pimped out/maxed out in a bracket doesn't impact the outcome, seems (imo) silly.

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    Soulwalker stalius's Avatar
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    off-topic:

    Today i lost first time in Black Garden. Well, fight was strange. I have to wait about 30 min. to get in it. Then, it was 2vs2 only. Because of that, front was closed after 120 sec. But we lost 10:150
    Second place just means you're the first loser.

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