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Thread: PVP Needs a better progression model - badly

  1. #1
    Rift Disciple
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    Default PVP Needs a better progression model - badly

    I've recently come back to Rift after a very long hiatus. I only have one piece of r1 gear, and the rest is epics from T2 experts.

    I've given it a good month of pvp now, and the situation in there is just ridiculous. Most of the people in warfronts are now in full r40 or at least some r40 some r20 gear. For a new player coming into PvP, they have no chance at all. There is no skill involved there, a r40 player in a decent PvP spec could go 10v1 against fresh 50 players and win without even thinking about it. How is that fun?

    During peak times I rarely will see a rated match for r1-20, but most of those people are full r1 gear also. Which isn't much better; and I only see rated matches one out of every 100 matches or so.

    There really needs to be a decent ranking system, and the queues actually need to use it. I'd rather wait an extra 5 minutes and actually have fun in the warfront then wait 1 minute and then not get a single kill.

    So what is the real progression path here for new PVPers? Just suck it up and get your *** handed to you for 3 months so you can get gear, and then have a shot at some actual PVP? Rift will lose a lot of subscribers if that is the model. Including this one real soon.
    Last edited by insodus; 03-19-2012 at 08:50 AM.

  2. #2
    Ascendant Credo's Avatar
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    No, you suck it up for 3 days and get your gear. Spec for survival when you're at low ranks and as you rank up put more points into healing/dps. Unless you're a Cleric, then you can do pretty much what you want
    Even free cost too much now

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Credo View Post
    No, you suck it up for 3 days and get your gear. Spec for survival when you're at low ranks and as you rank up put more points into healing/dps. Unless you're a Cleric, then you can do pretty much what you want
    Maybe if you play 18 hours a day. I'll get in a good 4-6 matches in a night; and since my side (guardian) is constantly losing, after a couple weeks I've still only been able to purchase 2 more pieces.

    But I'm not advocating for faster gear up, I'm advocating a ranking system so that fresh 50s play other fresh 50s. Why should you have to grind out gear the hard way and not be able to do it the way the current r40 players did it (i.e. against players of the same gear level).
    Last edited by insodus; 03-19-2012 at 08:56 AM.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by insodus View Post
    Maybe if you play 18 hours a day. I'll get in a good 4-6 matches in a night; and since my side (guardian) is constantly losing, after a couple weeks I've still only been able to purchase 2 more pieces.

    But I'm not advocating for faster gear up, I'm advocating a ranking system so that fresh 50s play other fresh 50s. Why should you have to grind out gear the hard way and not be able to do it the way the current r40 players did it (i.e. against players of the same gear level).
    The reason you're not seeing matched warfronts is because there aren't enough people in the queue to run matched warfronts. If you want to fight only fresh 50s, enjoy your 2+ hour queues. There's no rabbit to pull out of the hat. There's no infinite supply of players to draw from. The system uses what it has.

    You don't need to play "18 hours a day" to gear up. Your valor is bolstered now. Just for stepping into the warfront you're bumped up to 1000 valor until I believe rank 15. If you haven't earned enough favor to buy a full set of tier 1 PvP gear by then, you're doing something wrong.

  5. #5
    Plane Walker Azchire's Avatar
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    All of these problems wouldn't exist if the progression curve wasn't as steep as it is.

    1.7 did well by tightening things up a bit, but it didn't do enough to make low-rank pvp fun.

    PA doesn't help things either.

  6. #6
    Ascendant Ajax1114's Avatar
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    Hopefully the leaderboard additions Trion has mentioned will distract the hardcore PvP'ers long enough for Trion to sneak in some nerfs to the rank gap. 40 ranks doesn't look as daunting if you take it one rank at a time, but I'm pretty sure the prestige/favor totals have not changed.

    On the bright side, bolstering does make the initial ranks a lot smoother.

  7. #7
    Plane Walker
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    This is why traditional pvp games avoid this kinda system, it creates whines, cries, fairness. Not saying its wrong or right to complain.

    Remove ALL PvP gear / Raid gear and make all gear craftable.

    Problem solved..

    NEXT.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowboxerz View Post
    This is why traditional pvp games avoid this kinda system, it creates whines, cries, fairness. Not saying its wrong or right to complain.

    Remove ALL PvP gear / Raid gear and make all gear craftable.
    And then make players fight over the crafting materials areas. If you win, you get gear and cash from the players you sell to. If you lose, you have to buy your materials from the winners via the AH.

  9. #9
    Ascendant Credo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowboxerz View Post
    This is why traditional pvp games avoid this kinda system, it creates whines, cries, fairness. Not saying its wrong or right to complain.

    Remove ALL PvP gear / Raid gear and make all gear craftable.

    Problem solved..

    NEXT.
    Yuck.

    More on topic, the real...problem I guess...is that players can rank up very quickly causing the distribution of ranks that you'll fight to be pretty high. The matching put in place now can't work for low ranks if everyone ranks out of those low ranks as fast as they can.

    Best I can tell you OP is roll a Cleric, then you really don't have to worry about what rank you or anyone else is.
    Even free cost too much now

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qaedyan View Post
    And then make players fight over the crafting materials areas. If you win, you get gear and cash from the players you sell to. If you lose, you have to buy your materials from the winners via the AH.
    EXACTLY!

    OMG and a company with as much money as Trion is not figuring this out?

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Credo View Post
    Yuck.

    More on topic, the real...problem I guess...is that players can rank up very quickly causing the distribution of ranks that you'll fight to be pretty high. The matching put in place now can't work for low ranks if everyone ranks out of those low ranks as fast as they can.

    Best I can tell you OP is roll a Cleric, then you really don't have to worry about what rank you or anyone else is.

    Excuse me? Why yuck? What is bad about this? This is how most MMO operate .. Again, lets not use WoW as a reference as this is what Trion did with PvP in this game and we all see the cluster **** of a state its in from doing that.

  12. #12
    Prophet of Telara
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    Quote Originally Posted by insodus View Post
    So what is the real progression path here for new PVPers? Just suck it up and get your *** handed to you for 3 months so you can get gear, and then have a shot at some actual PVP? Rift will lose a lot of subscribers if that is the model. Including this one real soon.
    In other games you could have gotten together with your buddies and used teamwork to overcome any individual deficiencies, but the whiners had that option taken out almost as soon as they lost to a "premade".

  13. #13
    Ascendant Credo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowboxerz View Post
    Excuse me? Why yuck? What is bad about this? This is how most MMO operate .. Again, lets not use WoW as a reference as this is what Trion did with PvP in this game and we all see the cluster **** of a state its in from doing that.
    Because then all you do is end up grinding for hours on end, waiting your turn at a node, hoping you don't get zerged, all while you could be playing the game. No thanks, did my time with games like that and never liked it.
    Even free cost too much now

  14. #14
    Ascendant ShalarLight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ajax1114 View Post
    Hopefully the leaderboard additions Trion has mentioned will distract the hardcore PvP'ers long enough for Trion to sneak in some nerfs to the rank gap. 40 ranks doesn't look as daunting if you take it one rank at a time, but I'm pretty sure the prestige/favor totals have not changed.

    On the bright side, bolstering does make the initial ranks a lot smoother.
    Also, they removed rank requirement from gear, making it so leveling up through pvp actually helps getting into 50 pvp, as you will have a nice favor pool, so getting beyond the starting set is not terribly difficult.

    Unfortunatly, twinking a character basically exploits this feature. Trion should lock the vendors to only sell to level 50 players so the favor cap actually caps twinks, and prevents getting everything except weapons before actually fighting other level 50's.



    Because then all you do is end up grinding for hours on end, waiting your turn at a node, hoping you don't get zerged, all while you could be playing the game. No thanks, did my time with games like that and never liked it.
    Agreed, it would take a Ultima Online approach to material nodes, in that pretty much every piece of rock could be mined, every tree cut for lumber, so you didnt have to wait for "nodes" you could gather anywhere. Also the prospecting tool etc, which upped the quality of the gatherable resource in an area. Ultima really had it right with their crafting/gathering system.
    Last edited by ShalarLight; 03-19-2012 at 12:58 PM.


    Quote Originally Posted by Rizaz View Post
    FYI Riftstalker running isn't even pve. .... You might as well call riftstalker running PVE.

  15. #15
    Plane Walker
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qaedyan View Post
    In other games you could have gotten together with your buddies and used teamwork to overcome any individual deficiencies, but the whiners had that option taken out almost as soon as they lost to a "premade".
    LMAO!

    Man this is QFT!

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