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Thread: Truth about rogues from a P8 rogue

  1. #16
    Ascendant BishopX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Suplex View Post
    .

    Eradicate needs a cool down. Can any other class spam a buff remover?

    All heal debuffs should be single target. AE heal debuffs are plain stupid. Period.

    Your heal debuffs should not heal. At all. s
    forget about THIS game... name me any other game where you had a max range spamable no cooldown buff remover

    name me a game when you had aoe heal debuff and it didnt get wacked with the nerf bat



    the above i agree with. you seriously cant give awesome debuffs to the classes that deal the best damage. heal debuffs NEVER belong on classes with high damage.

    in a perfect world the classes with heal debuffs would be Cabbalist/Druid, reaver/beastmaster chloro/dom sab/bladedancer
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    Quote Originally Posted by Suplex View Post
    People don't erad your buffs, rogues erad your buffs.
    Erad was the wrong word. I have mages wipe all my buffs routinely. The smarter chlorolocks have realized they don't have a chance unless they purge me. And of course, MM are constantly spamming erad on me as well. So, bottom line is I don't think it's OP'ed at all -- people just have to L2debuff. That's all.

    Your heal debuffs should not heal. At all.
    Why not? Because you said so? Would you rather us rogues have some sort of cholorlock healing ability? Fine, I'll take it!

    Your argument (and anyone else who thinks the same thing) that it can be cleansed so its okay is lame. Try cleansing a debuff that is applied instantly in ae fights through x amount of other debuffs from x amount of other classes.
    It can be cleansed AND debuffed from the rogue. I am being defuffed constantly in WF's to the point where I can't keep FB up for more than seconds at a time.

    Rogues should not be able to self heal and sustain healing while dps'ing. Same goes for any melee class that doesnt take a dps loss to do said healing.
    Why not? Mages do it ALL THE TIME. I see mages in WF's routinely with the highest DPS AND the highest healing.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by BishopX View Post
    the above i agree with. you seriously cant give awesome debuffs to the classes that deal the best damage. heal debuffs NEVER belong on classes with high damage.
    Can't agree enough with this. Good pvp systems relegate the vast majority of CC and utility to the low dps classes, for two reasons: It keeps the high dps classes from being insanely OP, as they have been in one form or fashion since Trion launched this game, and two, it keeps all the classes in the pvp game. People will play tanks and support builds if they can cc and peel and debuff, etc. in ways to support their team. Right now, there's no point in not playing a dps or healer in pvp.

    With trion's design, you get what we see every night: A month ago warfronts had 11-14 parachamps in them, now they have 11-14 marksmen in them. When 11 of 14 players on a team are ALL marksmen, you know the pvp devs have dropped the ball.
    Last edited by Vember; 10-03-2011 at 08:04 PM.

  4. #19
    Plane Touched Mgrave66's Avatar
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    when I see 11 of 14 on the other team as MM, I think to myself. we are gonna roll these fools.
    Repine

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    Quote Originally Posted by AceinHole View Post
    It can be cleansed AND debuffed from the rogue. I am being defuffed constantly in WF's to the point where I can't keep FB up for more than seconds at a time.
    I find it far more likely that another MM on your team is overriding your debuff. You think it is being cleansed, but highly unlikely.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mgrave66 View Post
    when I see 11 of 14 on the other team as MM, I think to myself. we are gonna roll these fools.
    Win or lose, its more to the point that Trion creates these situations by their piss poor pvp development. Honestly, I've never seen this much seesaw balance in any game I've ever played, though I can't speak much for WoW, that game bored me to tears with a quickness. The warfronts are always flooded with the most OP specs every big patch because Trion can't balance to save their lives.

    One of those, we lost 1000 to 99, was a codex match.

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    I'd like to see VM nerfed. Soon. The number of spacebar mashing MM in warfronts these days is atrocious. And contrary to seemingly popular belief, Fan Out is not the only ability we have, it is not good damage, and it is not a substitute for mindful play and focusing appropriate targets. I've had BG in my journal for the PvP daily for two days now because I go in and 2/3 of our team is rogues who do nothing but spam Fan Out. I went into one match as assassin tonight. Our team scored a total of 7 kills...3 by me, 4 by the fang. All the other rogues just hopped around spamming Fan Out while the enemy team focused our two healers.

    VM is too attractive for baddies right now, and I'm starting to wish it would just go away.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by ellej View Post
    After reading millions of misconceptions and outright fabrications about 1.5 rogues here is the truth.
    - FB and VM healing is rarely the 1.5 -2k heal these forums claim it to be (50-60 hp is the norm). However, it does need to be adjusted.
    - MM fan out is OP (all AoE in general needs to be toned down)
    - Twilight transcendence is the big rogue heal (50%) 2 min cool down
    - Slip Away was nerfed
    - MM burst was nerfed
    - Bladedancer is still garbage
    - "Stunlocks" are not happening with 30% valor reduction (you don't have P2 ANYONE will 2 shot you)
    - Chloro/locks can no longer type out insults while killing sins with warlock armor.
    Mhmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

    You should post about people claiming riftstalker/nb to be op too. Personally I just laugh because all I have to do is put a shield with rb/vk on and then just poke them to death slowly, well all rogues that is.
    Last edited by Noctisx; 10-03-2011 at 08:29 PM.

  9. #24
    RIFT Guide Writer Zyzyx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Licentia View Post
    I'd like to see VM nerfed. Soon. The number of spacebar mashing MM in warfronts these days is atrocious. And contrary to seemingly popular belief, Fan Out is not the only ability we have, it is not good damage, and it is not a substitute for mindful play and focusing appropriate targets. I've had BG in my journal for the PvP daily for two days now because I go in and 2/3 of our team is rogues who do nothing but spam Fan Out. I went into one match as assassin tonight. Our team scored a total of 7 kills...3 by me, 4 by the fang. All the other rogues just hopped around spamming Fan Out while the enemy team focused our two healers.

    VM is too attractive for baddies right now, and I'm starting to wish it would just go away.
    So you are saying VM isn't making you into a god - king and its op sauce isnt dripping from your mouth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Daglar View Post
    When time allows I'll be looking at the issue with the class guys.

  10. #25
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    Fan Out is not OP at all. It doesnt do any more damage then other AoEs. Thats basically saying every Mage is OP because they do non-physical damage.
    Vamp Munitions isnt OP either. It can be purged and only heals for 25% which doesnt do squat being only on one person.
    Last edited by Vindicit; 10-03-2011 at 08:31 PM.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vindicit View Post
    Fan Out is not OP at all. It doesnt do any more damage then other AoEs. Thats basically saying every Mage is OP because they do non-physical damage.
    Vamp Munitions isnt OP either. It can be purged and only heals for 25% which doesnt do squat being only on one person.
    Bear in mind, mage aoe's are only useable from 25 meters, some are channeled, and all are stationary. There's a huge difference.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vember View Post
    Bear in mind, mage aoe's are only useable from 25 meters, some are channeled, and all are stationary. There's a huge difference.
    different callings have different abilities more news at 11***

    Quote Originally Posted by Daglar View Post
    When time allows I'll be looking at the issue with the class guys.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zyzyx View Post
    different callings have different abilities more news at 11***
    Those are called limitations braniac. Something you don't currently have to worry about, while doing similar damage on the move from longer range and applying a heal debuff/siphon.


    But that's balance, right?
    Last edited by Vember; 10-03-2011 at 08:47 PM.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vember View Post
    Those are called limitations braniac. Something you don't currently have to worry about, while doing similar damage on the move from longer range and applying a heal debuff/siphon.


    But that's balance, right?
    similiar damage to who lvl 40's?

    fan out - 200-500 dmg


    Warrior - 1100-1400 aoe dmg
    DS - 1600 ticks can be double tapped
    cab - 2500-3500 dmg with whatever they do

    And thats WITH full valor!!!!
    Last edited by Zyzyx; 10-03-2011 at 08:54 PM.

    Quote Originally Posted by Daglar View Post
    When time allows I'll be looking at the issue with the class guys.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zyzyx View Post
    similiar damage to who lvl 40's?

    fan out - 200-500 dmg


    Warrior - 1100-1400 aoe dmg
    DS - 1600 ticks can be double tapped
    cab - 2500-3500 dmg with whatever they do
    Lets not inflate bs numbers on what a rank 8 can do to a non valor.

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