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Thread: So, It's Scion Weekend: Tips for the Newbs...

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    Default So, It's Scion Weekend: Tips for the Newbs...

    A few pointers for the newbs who never play the WF:

    There are several objectives that give points. They are as follows:

    1) The dragon at the south end of the map gives 50 points.

    2) The church boss gives 100 points (I believe this is still correct, though it might be 150. Someone confirm).

    3) Each idol (there are two) gives 100 points a piece

    4) Elite NPC's give 10 points a piece (these guys are found in the church, mostly upstairs).

    5) Trash NPC's give 1 point a piece.

    6) Shards give 30 points a piece if both of your idols are up, 20 points if one of your idols is down, and 10 points a piece if both of your team's idols are down.

    7) Your main boss. If he is killed you lose the game. If you kill their boss, you win the game. Simple as that.

    Now onto the do's and don'ts:


    1) While it's nice to have control of the bridge, it is FAR from the most important objective. If you're behind in points, ignore the bridge and take care of the other objectives first. Nothing's more infuriating than to be behind 500-100 and have your team fighting over the damn bridge. Don't do it. Just stop and zerg their idols. The bridge does not give any points.

    2) Start the match by doing one of two things: killing the church boss or killing the other team's idols. These are the ONLY things you should care about at the start of the match. Either objective is fine, so just pick one and do it. And, oh yeah, killing the dragon at the south end is fine too. He gives 50 points and can be downed in seconds.

    3) Kill the other team's idols.

    4) Kill the church boss.

    5) Run shards when you're ahead. Don't run them when behind unless you've already done #3 and #4. If you've killed both idols and you're still behind, then it's time to run shards and protect your own idols. Also, it's fine to fight over the bridge at this point since it gives you easier access to the church.

    7) Protect your boss if he comes under attack. Yes, that means stop attacking that Chlorolock on the bridge that no one can kill. Just walk away and defend the boss. Please.

    8) Kill the other team's idols.

    9) When you kill the idol, WAIT FOR THE MINI-BOSS and kill it. Why? Because if you don't the idol will respawn which gives the other team more points for each shard they turn in. The goal of killing idols is to A) get 100 points B) make the other team's shards worth less and C) weaken their main boss (don't bother attacking him if you haven't downed both their idols). Nothing irritates me more than a team that downs the idol and then walks away before the boss gets there. If you're going to do the job, then do it all the way.

    10) If you plan on attacking the main boss, then FFS do not cap the bridge. That's right, do not take bridge. You want their team respawning on the bridge and not next to the boss you are attacking! Don't be that guy who is chilling at the bridge and thinks "hmm no one's around, I will cap it." Don't do it if your team is at the other team's boss! You will forever be remembered as an idiot.

    11) Kill that damn mage that is sitting safely above the idol and slowly killing it. Please, just kill him. Don't let one guy solo your idol.

    12) If you're a healer and you see one of your idols low on health, spend a minute and heal it up.

    13) When you kill the church boss you launch a "hero." This is a robot for the Defiants and some big dude with a two handed mace for the guardians. The hero will automatically launch from your main boss and make his way to the other team's idols. He will help you take down the idols if you just heal him up and follow him around. Eventually he will go to the other team's main boss and help kill him (if he stays alive that long).

    14) Did I say kill the idols?

    15) If you start the match and notice the other team didn't go anywhere near the bridge, they are probably zerging your idols and planning to hit your boss (smart team). Be ready to defend.

    If you're a total newb and have no clue what to do, then just follow the people around who are not fighting aimlessly on the bridge. Go to the idols or the church. If you're a rogue, then just run shards as much as you can -- that's the best way to help out. If you're a healer, then you are pretty much forced to stay with the idiots on the bridge and heal them. If you're a newb warrior, try to gather some other noobs up and take down idols if the "veterans" are too foolish to ignore them.

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    How to win any warfront: More overpowered warriors than the enemy team. riftwalkriftwalkriftwalk

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    Quote Originally Posted by Valanceer View Post
    How to win any warfront: More overpowered warriors than the enemy team. riftwalkriftwalkriftwalk
    Scion is more about the 51 Locks with pocket heals and trippy raid buffs/debuffs.

    If you don't have the 51 Locks and heals, then yes - most definitely it is the Warriors.
    Kincayd (1)* - Omeki (1) - Comma (2) - Bugeisha (2) - Malphesiel (3)
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    *formerly Plague@Carrion
    DEFIANT

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    Ascendant Taptap's Avatar
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    Here's one of many PS Guide websites. It is typical in its advice on tactics, which its last paragraph sums up well. I've not found a single guide that recommends making the Church the very 1st priority. I'll be making more Favor and Prestige playing other warfronts, and PS only infrequently this bonus weekend, than joining with people who don't play the map according to conventional advice given in the various guides.
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    General of Telara phyraxian's Avatar
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    Didn't mention killing the idols enough.

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    So... are we supposed to ignore the idols or what?
    Cataclysm broke WoW, but resilience will fix it!

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    Shadowlander Sharzi's Avatar
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    Excellent post, thank you! Many of the other websites that cover the PS warfront are outdated (written before changes had been made) or the person was not fully informed, like forgetting to mention idols!

    Like you stressed, taking out the idols is **very important**, it is an instant 100 points/a piece, weakens their boss AND takes 10 points off of enemy shard turn ins. No matter how you play the game, zerging the boss or running stones, how can this not be a good plan?

    Only when and if you NEED to start running stones, the bridge is a good central location to the church. Period. No points, nothing else special there.

    Also, I completely agree with grabbing the south dragon (50 points in about 10 seconds) or the church mini boss (which btw is on the balcony deck on upper floor of church looking down on courtyard). He is easy to grab, easy to kill, gives 100 points and spawns a hero to help the team.

    Another thing to consider is that is takes a full 1 minute before you can cap the bridge after the game starts, so why not be getting these objectives done instead of fighting to get to the bridge to nowhere.

    One last point, is that by turning in a quest one elite and one regular mob is released that will help your team. If you happen to be over by the boss, might as well get a few elites released to be helping your cause.

    I read a post awhile back, a guardian was explaining step by step how they were winning this warfront over and over. He said a bunch of them would turn in their quests at the boss to spawn an army of elites then all ride down to the church to kill the boss and get the Hero, next the whole mob of them would attack and take out the idols. Meantime, the other team was fighting on the bridge losing points. Many people slammed his idea at the time, but actually, it sounds like a pretty good one, imo.

    Quote Originally Posted by AceinHole View Post
    A few pointers for the newbs who never play the WF:

    There are several objectives that give points. They are as follows:

    1) The dragon at the south end of the map gives 50 points.

    2) The church boss gives 100 points (I believe this is still correct, though it might be 150. Someone confirm).

    3) Each idol (there are two) gives 100 points a piece

    4) Elite NPC's give 10 points a piece (these guys are found in the church, mostly upstairs).

    5) Trash NPC's give 1 point a piece.

    6) Shards give 30 points a piece if both of your idols are up, 20 points if one of your idols is down, and 10 points a piece if both of your team's idols are down.

    7) Your main boss. If he is killed you lose the game. If you kill their boss, you win the game. Simple as that.

    Now onto the do's and don'ts:


    1) While it's nice to have control of the bridge, it is FAR from the most important objective. If you're behind in points, ignore the bridge and take care of the other objectives first. Nothing's more infuriating than to be behind 500-100 and have your team fighting over the damn bridge. Don't do it. Just stop and zerg their idols. The bridge does not give any points.

    2) Start the match by doing one of two things: killing the church boss or killing the other team's idols. These are the ONLY things you should care about at the start of the match. Either objective is fine, so just pick one and do it. And, oh yeah, killing the dragon at the south end is fine too. He gives 50 points and can be downed in seconds.

    3) Kill the other team's idols.

    4) Kill the church boss.

    5) Run shards when you're ahead. Don't run them when behind unless you've already done #3 and #4. If you've killed both idols and you're still behind, then it's time to run shards and protect your own idols. Also, it's fine to fight over the bridge at this point since it gives you easier access to the church.

    7) Protect your boss if he comes under attack. Yes, that means stop attacking that Chlorolock on the bridge that no one can kill. Just walk away and defend the boss. Please.

    8) Kill the other team's idols.

    9) When you kill the idol, WAIT FOR THE MINI-BOSS and kill it. Why? Because if you don't the idol will respawn which gives the other team more points for each shard they turn in. The goal of killing idols is to A) get 100 points B) make the other team's shards worth less and C) weaken their main boss (don't bother attacking him if you haven't downed both their idols). Nothing irritates me more than a team that downs the idol and then walks away before the boss gets there. If you're going to do the job, then do it all the way.

    10) If you plan on attacking the main boss, then FFS do not cap the bridge. That's right, do not take bridge. You want their team respawning on the bridge and not next to the boss you are attacking! Don't be that guy who is chilling at the bridge and thinks "hmm no one's around, I will cap it." Don't do it if your team is at the other team's boss! You will forever be remembered as an idiot.

    11) Kill that damn mage that is sitting safely above the idol and slowly killing it. Please, just kill him. Don't let one guy solo your idol.

    12) If you're a healer and you see one of your idols low on health, spend a minute and heal it up.

    13) When you kill the church boss you launch a "hero." This is a robot for the Defiants and some big dude with a two handed mace for the guardians. The hero will automatically launch from your main boss and make his way to the other team's idols. He will help you take down the idols if you just heal him up and follow him around. Eventually he will go to the other team's main boss and help kill him (if he stays alive that long).

    14) Did I say kill the idols?

    15) If you start the match and notice the other team didn't go anywhere near the bridge, they are probably zerging your idols and planning to hit your boss (smart team). Be ready to defend.

    If you're a total newb and have no clue what to do, then just follow the people around who are not fighting aimlessly on the bridge. Go to the idols or the church. If you're a rogue, then just run shards as much as you can -- that's the best way to help out. If you're a healer, then you are pretty much forced to stay with the idiots on the bridge and heal them. If you're a newb warrior, try to gather some other noobs up and take down idols if the "veterans" are too foolish to ignore them.

  8. #8
    Plane Walker GLopez's Avatar
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    AFK at your boss for the 50 percent extra favor and leech. This warfront is an abortion.

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    I hate PoS being the weekend warfront.

    1. about twice as long queue times..as the ting is 45 mins run time(though most matches end much sooner)

    2. Its premade bait

    3. people still exploit it with impunity

    so here is what you can expect from a pug....NOTHING GOOD, less being lucky enough to ride the tail of a premade.

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    Ascendant Taptap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phyraxian View Post
    Didn't mention killing the idols enough.
    Good catch, looks like that particular one needs an update. Still, no one can point to a guide that recommends going to the Church before obtaining control of the bridge?

    I've played a lot of PS now. There are 2 tactics that I see win most often. The 1st is conventional, the 2nd not so much.

    In the first, both sides head for the Dragon from the get go. There seems to be a slight advantage so that the Guardians get there and tag the Dragon before the Defiant can, and they usually do. The first big skirmish happens then, and pretty much whoever wins gets to tag the bridge cap and then a few of them split off and go do the Church so an invasion can get launched, while the rest defend the bridge and run the South Stone. Once the invasion gets launched then all but a very few runners abandon the Church and follow the invasion force, get the Idols down (and keep them from being re-spawned), and if all goes well then go kill the boss. Obviously, whomever gets control of the bridge has a central point on the map (in Rift there is always some spot that a team must control) and can more quickly launch assaults and defense from there at the bridge, and that's a big tactical advantage.

    If you don't control the bridge then how are you going to get past it if you run enough stones and finish enough quests to cause an invasion to launch? You're not likely to do so and the invasion will fail. Basically, whoever controls the bridge, from the get go, is the team most likely to prevail and win the match. That's why the bridge is so important: center map point advantage for quicker access to ALL points instead of having to fight all the way across the map every time you want to do an assault. This is the most common win tactic I see.

    The other tactic is: screw it all, at the start jump into the river and go take out their idols and and then go kill their boss. This is a zerg and everyone stays together without exception, and everything else gets ignored because it's a beat the clock tactic (do it before the opposition can do the same thing or realize what you're up to, take the time to get there and muster an organized defense). Kill their boss and it's 1k points and instant win, the idols have to go but they don't matter other than they have to go down.

    I almost never see the Church First tactic win, unless the opposition doesn't know how to play. Sure you get a quick few points but things come to a halt getting more points because you don't have control of the center and they can easily interrupt everything you try to do and launch invasions easier too.

    The bridge is key for tactical positioning, and it does give cap point by being controlled. At least in the hundreds of times I've played it, it seemed that way to me. And I do believe every single guide, up to date or not, says to control the bridge (and the good guides say why).

    I agree 100% with everything else the OP says about PS, except for not controlling the Bridge. Dragon, Bridge, then Idols and Church at the same time (you split your team). If you can't control he Bridge, or win the 1st fight at the Dragon, then your team is almost always going to be the one that is out classed and likely to lose. That's the way I've seen most of the PS fights go down.
    Specter
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    Plane Walker Rakkasa's Avatar
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    Excellent post - much appreciated

    I enjoy Codex and Scion - I've had a lot of fun in both.

    Sometimes they're not fun, sometimes your PUG is filled with surrender monkey QQ boys, but most of the time it's a damn good fight.

    See you there this weekend and if you hate it, like I hate Whitefall, don't get in it, nobody is timing you on how fast you get your rank 8 gear.

    One additional thing - boss races = crap favor

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    Telaran
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    So, it's insta rush to idols/planars and bosses, 2 minutes games.

    No pvp week-end, in other words.

    Nice way to completely **** up pvp.

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    General of Telara phyraxian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mance View Post
    So, it's insta rush to idols/planars and bosses, 2 minutes games.

    No pvp week-end, in other words.

    Nice way to completely **** up pvp.
    If you want to kill players then fight them at YOUR idols/boss

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    Plane Touched Cherrileigh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mance View Post
    So, it's insta rush to idols/planars and bosses, 2 minutes games.

    No pvp week-end, in other words.

    Nice way to completely **** up pvp.
    You don't have to play it.
    EVERYBODY DIES, BUT NOT EVERYBODY LIVES.

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    Shadowlander Sharzi's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=Taptap;3144685]Good catch, looks like that particular one needs an update. Still, no one can point to a guide that recommends going to the Church before obtaining control of the bridge?

    Well one good reason is that there is a one minute lock out on bridge after the game starts so getting a quck 50 pts on the dragon and 100 pts for the church boss (with a hero) is a good way to spend that time. But there is a more important reason why ppl should work on other objectives (besides the bridge) in the beginning of the game -- because the game dynamic has changed alot over the last few months. I'll explain the changes below and why the bridge USED to be important:

    Before various patches the idols were almost impossible to take out, but now it is easy, even 2 or 3 ppl can do it. Prior to this change, people were better off ignoring the unkillable idols, keeping the bridge for church position, and running in stones for a win. Stone turn-in used to give players very good buffs that would stack. By the 3rd turn in they were almost unkillable --->This is why they were almost unbeatable once they got a few shard turn ins. This has been nerfed for some time now, no more buffs are given, and the stone turn in has been nerf from 50 to 30.

    To sum up: before changes, if you didn't get the bridge you lost the church (and its 3 shardsstones), the buffs, and usually the game.

    Now, after some nerfing, it is easy to take out the two idols, and giving you fast 200 points lead. If the other team is on the bridge running stones, they now only get 10 points (with 2 idols out) instead of 30 pts for each stone turn in. So, think about it, even if you only ran ONE south stone in at 30 pts it would be the same as them controlling the bridge and running all 3 in the church. And thats not even considering all the other advantages of taking out their idols.

    When they see you are taking out their idols they scatter, making a bridge takeover even easier when you finally need it for running in stones in the very end.

    Finally, taking out the idols is NOT for zerging the boss. It for points, making their stone turn-ins nearly worthless, getting them running around - AND THEN for weakening their boss in case they zerg your boss and you need to do it. If you don't have their idols out, this is not even an option, and you lose.
    -------------------------------
    Last edited by Sharzi; 09-16-2011 at 06:33 PM.

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