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Thread: Ranks Are Stupid

  1. #16
    Rift Disciple Veiny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AintEvenMadBro View Post
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    tl;dr: I don't like the ranking system because i have to work my way up to have the best gear rather than having it given to me by default at level 50. PvP is a grind omg omg omg
    Grinding should still be a fun experience.
    What is the point in playing the game if your just going to afk in warfronts?

  2. #17
    Ascendant VirusDancer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Veiny View Post
    Grinding should still be a fun experience.
    What is the point in playing the game if your just going to afk in warfronts?
    That is the actual issue. Fun.

    Everything is grinding...the issue is whether or not you are having fun while doing it.
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  3. #18
    Soulwalker RiptidaL's Avatar
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    Fresh 50's think they should be able to jump in a WF at 50 and roll people. If you are crying because you can't kill anything then switch to a support or healing role and help your team that way.

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  4. #19
    Ascendant Ajax1114's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by VirusDancer View Post
    The PvP gear comes along to match a certain level of gearing done on the PvE side. You separate WFs based on that...what is the issue? The PvE design in this game (like many games) follows the meatier mob with the bigger club concept. The actual difficulty does not increase - the cost of making mistakes increases. You meet the gear check and don't screw up, you complete the PvE exercise. While PvP is not the scripted dance that PvE is, the gear check and costliness of mistakes does exist...enough so to mirror the PvE side in trying to tier the ranks.
    Yes, the PvP gear matches the level of gearing on the PvE side, but why should it, other than the reason that "I want the toy he has!" I don't know why you continue to insist that they should be alike. The only gear check and costliness of mistakes on the PvP side is caused by a great disparity between ranks. Furthermore, on the PvP side, costliness of mistakes decreases the higher you get, which is the opposite of PvE.

    Quote Originally Posted by VirusDancer View Post
    Why on Earth would I attempt to create tiers in Open World PvP? Outside of Soul balance issues, OWPvP is about who brings the biggest guns and the most guys that know how to use those guns. If you're a R1 and get rolled by a R8 in World PvP...that is going to happen. You show up with your 20 guys - they show up with 60 guys... dookie happens. That is World PvP. Tiers would obviously only apply to WFs.
    I guarantee you that 3 R8's could destroy 6 equally skilled R1's in open world PvP. You see no problem with this concept? Gear disparity in Player versus Player combat is a balance issue, period. Saying that open world PvP is about who brings the biggest guns is just an excuse and part of a larger issue that has little to do with ranks.

    Quote Originally Posted by VirusDancer View Post
    Karate Kid. Wax on, Wax off....
    I stand corrected. However, I still stick to the point that lore, storytelling, and real life are not the same as a game. Games are designed to be fun, first and foremost, not to get us to mindlessly repeat actions that teach us nothing outside of the game world. For some, that is fun, but boredom sets in very quickly.

    Quote Originally Posted by VirusDancer View Post
    How is that any different from anything else though? To improve a crafting skill - you are grinding. To level up - you are grinding. To increase notoriety - you are grinding. Improving anything is grinding.
    Yes, and I would agree that all of those examples are a type of "grind."

    Quote Originally Posted by VirusDancer View Post
    Way back when I was learning to type - guess what, it was a case of typing a lot of the same things over and over and over again. Grinding. Somebody that is learning to play tennis and looking to get better? Grinding. You name it, if you're trying to improve something - you're practicing it, you're grinding it.
    Now you're just comparing apples and oranges. I see the comparison you're attempting to make, but they are not the same thing. Learning to type is a practical skill in real life that requires rote memorization to become efficient at. PvP is a fantasy version of war games. In the current state of PvP, you can repeatedly mash keys in an inefficient and mindless fashion until you are given rewards, and that has even less correlation to either of your examples.

    Quote Originally Posted by Veiny View Post
    Grinding should still be a fun experience.
    What is the point in playing the game if your just going to afk in warfronts?
    Exactly. And that is the reason I'm coming up with these ideas; to try to improve the fun factor.

  5. #20
    Shadowlander
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    Quote Originally Posted by RiptidaL View Post
    Fresh 50's think they should be able to jump in a WF at 50 and roll people. If you are crying because you can't kill anything then switch to a support or healing role and help your team that way.
    We need to rename the pvp & warfronts forum to fresh 50 qq, it never ends.

  6. #21
    Shadowlander
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    I don't have an issue with uber-geared R8s, but I do believe that there should be tiered WFs. I failed to pvp at lower levels and, while getting stomped into oblivion doesn't bother me, failing my team (and tbh listening to btching) because I get rolled so easily does. I don't think there is downside to tiered WFs with the exception of longer possible queue times. And that may not even happen, if it makes more people want to queue up more in the first place. I don't have an issue getting owned in open world, as it only happens during pvp rifts and we're usually smart enough to pair low and high ranks together.

  7. #22
    Plane Walker Alder's Avatar
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    The entire concept of ranks is completely negated by not splitting them up in warfronts.

    Open world on the other hand is what it is and shouldn't be touched.

  8. #23
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    I can relate to the sentiment of the OP's message. The simple fact is, pvp is horribly unbalanced.
    It's mostly gear, not skill.
    Of course there are people that feel that this is fine cause you have to earn it, have to do the time etc etc.
    No pain no gain, so to speak. Seen some fine examples in this thread btw of that train of thought.
    It's not a game folks, you have to earn your stripes! It's boot camp.

    There are 2 solutions really, either they increase the valor on the lower rank gear, as someone else suggested in another thread (thanks for that, great idea I think).
    Or make different queues, split the ranks up.

    It's not about the painful journey, but the glorious destination. Brilliant game design really.

  9. #24
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    Rift's system is more like an actual war, except that in a real war if you know you're commanding undergeared scrubs you throw MORE undergeared scrubs at the enemy to attempt a brute force of numbers takeover. Or you surrender.

    If Rift insists on not balancing rank 1 vs rank 8 somehow, we need a vote surrender. At least then it'd be over quickly, losers would still get the loser favor, and no farming of noobs allowing the enemy to rank even quicker and make the treadmill seem even more pointless. You can then rank up more quickly to the point where matches are FUN. Obviously it would need safeguards against abuse too.

    Trion's already made it clear they want PVE gear out of PVP, and that gaining rank needs to get a gear reward. So the solution would be to send more scrubs vs elites. You wouldn't take on an elite mob alone in PVE, you'd get a group for it... but in PVP we're constantly seeing 1v1 of scrub vs elite when even 5v1 would still have trouble.

    Don't know why they're so attached to roflstomp mechanics. Fair fights are just WAY more fun - at least, to those of us with self-esteem.
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  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leiralei View Post
    Rift's system is more like an actual war, except that in a real war if you know you're commanding undergeared scrubs you throw MORE undergeared scrubs at the enemy to attempt a brute force of numbers takeover. Or you surrender.

    If Rift insists on not balancing rank 1 vs rank 8 somehow, we need a vote surrender. At least then it'd be over quickly, losers would still get the loser favor, and no farming of noobs allowing the enemy to rank even quicker and make the treadmill seem even more pointless. You can then rank up more quickly to the point where matches are FUN. Obviously it would need safeguards against abuse too.

    Trion's already made it clear they want PVE gear out of PVP, and that gaining rank needs to get a gear reward. So the solution would be to send more scrubs vs elites. You wouldn't take on an elite mob alone in PVE, you'd get a group for it... but in PVP we're constantly seeing 1v1 of scrub vs elite when even 5v1 would still have trouble.

    Don't know why they're so attached to roflstomp mechanics. Fair fights are just WAY more fun - at least, to those of us with self-esteem.
    In real war you also get paid instead of paying for it. It also isn't supposed to be fun, but this is.

    PVE has tiers for a reason, and that gear scales just as much as the PVP gear. I can't imagine why all the poopsockers content with the current system can't draw that simple connection.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by croon View Post
    In real war you also get paid instead of paying for it. It also isn't supposed to be fun, but this is.

    PVE has tiers for a reason, and that gear scales just as much as the PVP gear. I can't imagine why all the poopsockers content with the current system can't draw that simple connection.
    You know the main reason I'm still pvping is, that I'm hoping it will get fun once I reach higher ranks.
    And I do like pvp btw.
    So I can hardly wait to have some fun playing a game.

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