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Thread: Please fix natures fury..... breaks stealth when far away from teammates.

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ato View Post
    I disagree, we are still there just because they can't see us. No reason the spell can't find us, no need to pull one of the few effective stealth defences.
    The thing he is saying is that the range on it is incredibly far. I've been hit by it outside of the 30m range while in stealth and not even any team mates that class.

    Quote Originally Posted by GeekCrux View Post
    I use this ability a LOT.

    It branches out from the original target hit up to a distance 30m radius total, not each bounce. It is not 30m from each bounce in a line equaling something like 90m. That is just silly thinking. I never see it fly super long distances unless the target is moving fast and covers a lot of ground and the spell follows it after it is already going to hit the target.

    From what I can tell, it seems to check if you are in range from initial impact. I have seen mobs running through the area, that originally were not there and the spell ignores them even if the spell could have jumped again.

    So, if you see it flying and I normally do because it seems pretty destinct, move away from the person who is about to get hit. If you are out of the 30m radius of this person on impact, you will not get hit. If you are in range on inital impact, move out of range before it targets you, and you will not get hit.

    You can avoid this stealth break because you are never targeted initially. You cannot avoid a random aoe cast to break stealth.

    I agree that it is powerful spell and very good at breaking stealth, but I disagree with it being over powered.
    Again he's not saying the spell itself is over powered. Just it's ability to track down a stealthed target outside of what should be it's max possible range.
    Last edited by Reiz; 08-27-2011 at 05:07 AM.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeekCrux View Post
    I use this ability a LOT.

    It branches out from the original target hit up to a distance 30m radius total, not each bounce. It is not 30m from each bounce in a line equaling something like 90m. That is just silly thinking. I never see it fly super long distances unless the target is moving fast and covers a lot of ground and the spell follows it after it is already going to hit the target.

    From what I can tell, it seems to check if you are in range from initial impact. I have seen mobs running through the area, that originally were not there and the spell ignores them even if the spell could have jumped again.

    So, if you see it flying and I normally do because it seems pretty destinct, move away from the person who is about to get hit. If you are out of the 30m radius of this person on impact, you will not get hit. If you are in range on inital impact, move out of range before it targets you, and you will not get hit.

    You can avoid this stealth break because you are never targeted initially. You cannot avoid a random aoe cast to break stealth.

    I agree that it is powerful spell and very good at breaking stealth, but I disagree with it being over powered.
    30m radius is excessive. Nobody is saying it bounces up to 90m. I'm saying 30m is outrageous. That's an ENORMOUS radius. Think about it...that's almost the distance between the middle of the death creep in BG and the ledge leading down from the GY on either said. 30m is the max range of most ranged souls. If 30m radius is accurate, it means Nature's Fury cast on someone in the middle of the map in BG can hit 3 other players pretty much anywhere on the field between the stone walls and ledges.

    No way. If 30m is accurate, it needs to be toned down. 10-15m would put it in line with other AoE abilities.

  3. #18
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    bump......
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    Quote Originally Posted by Licentia View Post
    30m radius is excessive. Nobody is saying it bounces up to 90m. I'm saying 30m is outrageous. That's an ENORMOUS radius. Think about it...that's almost the distance between the middle of the death creep in BG and the ledge leading down from the GY on either said. 30m is the max range of most ranged souls. If 30m radius is accurate, it means Nature's Fury cast on someone in the middle of the map in BG can hit 3 other players pretty much anywhere on the field between the stone walls and ledges.

    No way. If 30m is accurate, it needs to be toned down. 10-15m would put it in line with other AoE abilities.
    - I explained how you can avoid it.
    - I explained how the targeting worked.
    - The spell does not bounce so fast that you cannot avoid impact.
    - The spell has a cool down that is enough time for you to back track to safety, then come back in across the danger area to attack the chloro.
    - This is an aoe that breaks stealth that can be "avoided". You cannot avoid any other aoe that breaks stealth. This is also the only aoe that has a larger radius.

    That said, I don't think it is unbalanced, but I don't care if they do reduce the range. It would give more control over the spells bouncing. I would like to use it more in pve without fear of pulling extra mobs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GeekCrux View Post
    - I explained how you can avoid it.
    - I explained how the targeting worked.
    - The spell does not bounce so fast that you cannot avoid impact.
    - The spell has a cool down that is enough time for you to back track to safety, then come back in across the danger area to attack the chloro.
    - This is an aoe that breaks stealth that can be "avoided". You cannot avoid any other aoe that breaks stealth. This is also the only aoe that has a larger radius.

    That said, I don't think it is unbalanced, but I don't care if they do reduce the range. It would give more control over the spells bouncing. I would like to use it more in pve without fear of pulling extra mobs.
    How can you avoid a heat seeking missile that randomly targets you even though the caster doesn't know you're there and outside of a range it shouldn't possibly have?

    I get what you're saying but my experience is that it tracks me down when I'm farther from people than it should. Deny it if you wish, but it doesn't change my experience with the skill.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reiz View Post
    How can you avoid a heat seeking missile that randomly targets you even though the caster doesn't know you're there and outside of a range it shouldn't possibly have?

    I get what you're saying but my experience is that it tracks me down when I'm farther from people than it should. Deny it if you wish, but it doesn't change my experience with the skill.
    How far away you are when it hits you is irrelevant. It's how far away you are when it hits the previous target ;) For example, it hits a guy 10m away from you and comes for you. You die before it hits and instantly respawn (got lucky on timer). It will now come across the map and smack you in the face at the respawn area or however far away you managed to move before it got to you. :P
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  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reiz View Post
    How can you avoid a heat seeking missile that randomly targets you even though the caster doesn't know you're there and outside of a range it shouldn't possibly have?

    I get what you're saying but my experience is that it tracks me down when I'm farther from people than it should. Deny it if you wish, but it doesn't change my experience with the skill.
    Its heat seeking.. It doesn't need to see you.. You still give off heat while you are stealthed....

    And its one of the FEW abilities that actually pull a rogue out of stealth (it needs more counters imho)
    "Power is neccessary because conflict will never dissappear"

  8. #23
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    I am unsure how i feel about this ability. I agree, 30m is a ridiculous range for it but just like the warriors disease spreading ability, I think its fair to hit stealthed rogues. Things like fork+spear and fan out however should not hit stealthed rogues. You cant target us so you shouldnt be able to hit us. Ground AOEs and the whirlwind attacks I have no problem hitting stealthed rogues.

    That being said, one way to avoid this ability is to stay away from your teammates. We are meant to be a gank class not a melee in the fray class. Ride away from your teammates and find people solo. Stealthy rogues are one man wolfpacks (until 1.5 comes along MUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Its our turn to be completely broken and OP. I am looking forward to making mages and clerics cry until we get nerfed)

    Just my thoughts

  9. #24
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    The range is indeed huge. Everyone who did AP with a chloro will know that if nature's fury is used when you just enter the cave after Icetalon, it pulls the mobs at the upper side of the cave about 100% of the time, wiping the group about 90% of the time

    But rogues shouldn't whine about this as a stealth counter, it's bad enough that they have in-combat stealth and stealth that (temporarily) doesn't break on damage. If you change the stealth counters, also change the stealth itself so it's fair for everyone.
    Last edited by Veldan; 09-02-2011 at 07:21 AM.

  10. #25
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    warriors can 'crit you' while stealthed with battlefield intimidation and put lingering wounds on you in stealth. but you complain about this? lol k.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LordOberon View Post
    Its heat seeking.. It doesn't need to see you.. You still give off heat while you are stealthed....

    And its one of the FEW abilities that actually pull a rogue out of stealth (it needs more counters imho)
    Stealth has a boat load of counters for anyone not playing stupid. Any argument about not being able to pull a rogue out of stealth are null and void. There are even counters that buff a whole raid to be able to see stealth from miles away.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Veldan View Post
    The range is indeed huge. Everyone who did AP with a chloro will know that if nature's fury is used when you just enter the cave after Icetalon, it pulls the mobs at the upper side of the cave about 100% of the time, wiping the group about 90% of the time

    But rogues shouldn't whine about this as a stealth counter, it's bad enough that they have in-combat stealth and stealth that (temporarily) doesn't break on damage. If you change the stealth counters, also change the stealth itself so it's fair for everyone.
    But it isn't a stealth counter, just a buggy skill. Your stealth counter as a mage is in your PvP soul.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by ururu View Post
    warriors can 'crit you' while stealthed with battlefield intimidation and put lingering wounds on you in stealth. but you complain about this? lol k.
    Wars and clerics just got nerfed, and its been a while since the pyro nerfs, so the rogues get to cry until mages get hit again.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Senji View Post
    Wars and clerics just got nerfed, and its been a while since the pyro nerfs, so the rogues get to cry until mages get hit again.
    Yeah, who needs a silly thing like balance. Lets just give everyone instagib abilities with 1000m range.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thickness View Post
    This isn't really a buff rogues or nerf other classes thread, it is simply a discussion to see if this mechanic is working as intended or is a bit more overbearing than it should be.
    I'd say it's working as intended. Targeted spells require more skill and effort to get off considering you need a target in the first place, you don't miss, they stay in range, they don't dodge, block, resist, or are immune. Then if everything works as intended, you get a decent AoE spell out of it.

    Stealth in MMOs has completely ruined tactics for generations of gamers. You all think it's an invisibility cloak, when really you're just holding a shrubbery over your face. You should have used a Fig leaf because that's where my mage always aims on rogues.
    Last edited by Trisian; 09-02-2011 at 08:33 AM.

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