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Thread: PvP Gear: More time to attain than PvE, so why the complaining?

  1. #61
    Ascendant Jaya's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KaiHeilos View Post
    You queue solo, you run around for a few minutes, you get prestige. The only roadblock to PvP gear is the amount of times you have to repeat this inane procedure to aquire the amount of prestige to gain r8.
    wasn't that the OP's point?
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  2. #62
    Ascendant Mulch's Avatar
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    My guildmates had rank 7/8 before anyone on the shard killed any HK boss. It's just not even close.

    and blah blah never need to win, welfare-epics with synergy... whatever... That's irrelevant to the speed question.

    Raiding guilds are looking at pvp gear as a *quick* way to BiS, so they can take down the raid targets easier.

  3. #63
    Ascendant Jaya's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madcroc View Post
    Atm you get 60 Mark IF you can join every raid a week!
    Then you have to wait for next week.
    The gear is: 50+50+80+80+100+100=460.
    480/60 = 7.67 WEEKS!
    Tell me you can't get rank 8 in 7 and a half week..
    (not counting the new guild perk)
    You're comparing apples (the time spent actually grinding prestige/etc) to oranges (the amount of weeks that have to elapse while actually raiding X hours).

    You should be comparing apples (the time spent actually grinding prestige/etc) to apples (the time spent actually raiding).

    Quote Originally Posted by Mulch View Post
    Raiding guilds are looking at pvp gear as a *quick* way to BiS, so they can take down the raid targets easier.
    I'm pretty sure that the reason is not that it's "quick" but that it's "not artificially slowed down due to lockouts"
    Last edited by Jaya; 08-24-2011 at 06:50 AM.
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  4. #64
    Ascendant Landru's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaya View Post
    You're comparing apples (the time spent actually grinding prestige/etc) to oranges (the amount of weeks that have to elapse while actually raiding X hours).

    You should be comparing apples (the time spent actually grinding prestige/etc) to apples (the time spent actually raiding)
    Ok, since the WFs can be effectively AFKd the time invested is only the time it takes to queue and re-queue. We can use that as a starting point, sure.
    I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant

  5. #65
    Rift Chaser Slacka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by solarbear View Post
    Unless you have got some super awesome farm group going or find some bug, it will take you 600 or more hours just to get to R8.

    Enough plaques drop off each boss, with only a couple of drops, I could have a full set of HK in far less time.
    Ok, so lets break it down. 600 hours you say? Well lets convert that to raid hours. The average progression guild raids ~6 hours a night (6 - 12 pm).

    600 / 5 = 100 days. that's a little over 3 months to go r1 to r8 by the numbers you provided. Compare that to the absolute minimum for the full basic hk set (4 months minimum if killing all 10 bosses, which remember, noone is doing yet so this will be significantly longer than this hypothetical time period) and this does not take into account all the time it takes to gear up with the 300+ hit/focus required in hk too, and you can quickly see where the statement that pvp gearing takes longer fails.

  6. #66
    Plane Walker Odnoc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madcroc View Post
    2-3 loot per boss.
    20 ppl in your raid. Your guild can only killl 1 boss. Cause the gear leap for tier 1 to tier 2 is quite big.
    Most of your guild don't even have full tier 1.
    gl hf
    I am talking /played hours not hypothetical

    4 weeks of 2 hours a day for pvp, = 54 raiding hours for HK.

    Don't think many people spent near that in HK yet.
    Last edited by Odnoc; 08-24-2011 at 07:55 AM.

  7. #67
    Champion Cinerus's Avatar
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    Can anyone tell me what the big deal is, really? A guy gets to R8 in PVP and uses the items in a raid, SO WHAT?! It will improve his raid performance, making it easier for everyone. I really don't see the problem here.

  8. #68
    Champion of Telara Veldan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaya View Post
    I'm pretty sure that the reason is not that it's "quick" but that it's "not artificially slowed down due to lockouts"
    3 weeks to get BiS isn't quick?

  9. #69
    Plane Walker Odnoc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Veldan View Post
    3 weeks to get BiS isn't quick?
    So nobody has any PVE BiS yet?
    and weeks is vague in /played time, get into something more relevant like hours. 3 weeks at 8 hours a day isn't quick by any means, in fact it would be a very long 3 weeks.
    Last edited by Odnoc; 08-24-2011 at 08:20 AM.

  10. #70
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    I didn't even read the wall of text that OP made.

    I just by the title can see that, he can't possibly win many WFs if he thinks PvE gearing is faster than PvP gearing.

  11. #71
    Ascendant Mulch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cinerus View Post
    Can anyone tell me what the big deal is, really? A guy gets to R8 in PVP and uses the items in a raid, SO WHAT?! It will improve his raid performance, making it easier for everyone. I really don't see the problem here.
    I don't think there's any problem at all with that. Or if by chance there was a justifiable reason for a pvp-er to do something raid-based, then for sure, go for it.

    A fundamental aspect of Rift is they push you to do a variety of things.

    Last weekend my gaming partner and I did some whitefall escalation in the 30-39 bracket. Ta-da, we have enough favor for the free mount. That's 70 plat saved, right there. You gotta do some rift/invasions to get essences. You *can* level up with quests, but your gear will suck. You gotta grind some notoriety... etc etc

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Odnoc View Post
    So nobody has any PVE BiS yet?
    A full set? No, not even close. BiS is most likely the Vendor gear, which at most the very top guilds have one piece.
    Hitme (W) - Byriel - Dark Horizon
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  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Odnoc View Post
    I am talking /played hours not hypothetical

    4 weeks of 2 hours a day for pvp, = 54 raiding hours for HK.

    Don't think many people spent near that in HK yet.
    The top guilds have easily spent 54 hours in HK. This shows you don't quite understand the issue.
    Hitme (W) - Byriel - Dark Horizon
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  14. #74
    Rift Master KaiHeilos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Odnoc View Post
    So nobody has any PVE BiS yet?
    and weeks is vague in /played time, get into something more relevant like hours. 3 weeks at 8 hours a day isn't quick by any means, in fact it would be a very long 3 weeks.
    As has already been shown, no. It is very unlikely, if not impossible for anyone to have aquired a full set of PvE BiS gear from HK. Even if by some chance someone had managed to beat the RNG of raid drops and aquired a full set, you're looking at one or two people.

    Amazingly enough, there are loads of people running around with r8 (which is actually BiS PvE, go figure).

    Quote Originally Posted by Cinerus
    Can anyone tell me what the big deal is, really? A guy gets to R8 in PVP and uses the items in a raid, SO WHAT?! It will improve his raid performance, making it easier for everyone. I really don't see the problem here.
    Because some (many?) of us don't want to have to grind out hours of warfronts just to do well in end game PvE, just like PvPers don't want to have to raid for top level weapons.


    Really the thread in itself is flawed, because it's not looking at the big picture of PvE vs PvP gear aquisition.

    For PvE gear, once you hit 50, you stick on some crafted gear and then have to grind through T2s, you have to rely on the RNG that you'll get a good item for your weapon, ranged, neck, trinket and ring slots. You also need to grind out enough plaques to get your 7 armor pieces. This is all dependant on getting a good group, people knowing how to kill the bosses, people not quitting/afking in the dungeon, not having to roll against others of your class and actually seeing the item drop.

    The problem with this, as with any part of PvE progression, is it is very, very RNG based. When people are calculating the amount of time it takes to get a full set of PvE gear, they always look at a best case scenario, i.e. you only need 280 item drops to fully equip a raid. This is not the case, at all. You'll be getting a lot of off spec item, a couple of junk items and a fair amount of duplicate items no one needs any more. These are all wasted and not helping you gear out while increasing the amount of drops the raid needs as a whole the gear.

    Once you've got that out of the way you need to enter Tier 1 raiding, you have to find a guild that is doing Tier one raiding, so you get into a random progression guild that is working it's way through raiding. For about 15 hours a week, every week from this point you'll be slamming your head against a wall trying to learn the bosses, attempting to kill the bosses, wiping repeatedly against said bosses because there's always one idiot who's half asleep and didn't notice his name flash up in the emote of didn't get out of the AoE in time. Once you managed to down the boss you then have to cross your fingers and pray an item you can use drops, Oh look, cleric tanking chain again. freaking awesome. Even assuming something you can use drops, you have four or five other people trying to get it as well, your chances are looking poorer and poorer.

    Even assuming you join a non-progression guild (haha, good freaking luck) you're look at at least two months to get enough marks for your full set of armor, and an unknowable period of time of praying the RNG doesn't hate you in the hopes of filling your other 7 slots.

    Hammerknell is pretty much the exact same as the paragraph above, except this time it's much harder, the fights are tunes better, the strategies harder, the gear requirements much more restrictive and it's impossible to join a non-progression guild because, shock, non of them exist. No one has cleared hammerknell yet, no one has it on farm. For tier one raiding you were looking at an absolute best case scenario of 50 drops and 60 marks a week. Now we're down to 3 drops and marks a week increasing slowly at a probable rate of 3 per week, but even if we ever get it on farm we still only end up with 30 drops and marks a week, so still going to take at least twice as long as the last tier of content because we still need the same amount of drops and marks as we did before. Good luck with that.

    In comparison to all of this group reliant, RNG heavy work that gives me nothing if i lose, if I want PvP gear I click join and run around like a headless chicken for a couple of hours a day. It requires no co-ordination, no group, no learning, practically no effort really on my part. There's also no RNG whatsoever, once I've clicked join enough times I'm gauranteed that BiS gear.

    Have a nice day.

  15. #75
    Shadowlander
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    The best combination of gear appears to be a mixture of both pve and pvp gear. Players who spend a lot of time doing both should have an advantage (although I would rather see them work for a living). Given that this is how the game is currently set up, it is balanced.

    /thread

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