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Thread: Cleric Heals are NOT OP - End of debate

  1. #1
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    Default Cleric Heals are NOT OP - End of debate

    Sorry to break the news to you folks who thing that Cleric healing is OP, but its not. Think about it, if every class could easily kill a full blown healing cleric, healing would be pointless. What would be the point of being a full spec healer if you die by everyone that attacks you? There wouldnt be one.

    There would be no point to play a healer spec if you cant even keep yourself alive! DUH!!

    In addition, all of you complaining its OP becuase you cant single handedly kill them, the cleric your attacking WILL NEVER KILL YOU!!!!!

    Stop crying. End of debate.

  2. #2
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    Clerics still heal? I thought they all rolled cabalist.
    ~Quiescent

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zaros View Post
    Clerics still heal? I thought they all rolled cabalist.
    I roll Cabalist at times as well, sometimes healing doesnt matter when the rest of your team cant do damage... espcially on defiants side who dont know how to play any wf at all and just lose regardless.

  4. #4
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    OP, you are wrong on lots of points.

    But I'll reply to one of them. The way mmos used to support healing was to require teammates to help peel and keep them alive. MMO healers never used to be able to stand up to direct attack and heal themselves.

    But now, because everyone wants to be Rambo, they made these games not actually set up to encourage teamwork.

    In the traditional 3 roles mmo:

    Healers should be weak to direct attack and have only limited self-heals, but able to heal others well and be protected by teammates that know how to peel and protect.

    This encourages inter-dependence and teamwork. It is also more fun than having super invincible tank healers.
    Last edited by Snyrf; 08-22-2011 at 12:27 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Snyrf View Post
    OP, you are wrong on lots of points.

    But I'll reply to one of them. The way mmos used to support healing was to require teammates to help peel and keep them alive. MMO healers never used to be able to stand up to direct attack and heal themselves.

    But now, because everyone wants to be Rambo, they made these games not actually set up to encourage teamwork.

    In the traditional 3 roles mmo:

    Healers should be weak to direct attack and have only limited self-heals, but able to heal others well and be protected by teammates that know how to peel and protect.

    This encourages inter-dependence and teamwork. It is also more fun than having super invincible tank healers.
    Traditional is very subjective but whatever, traditional mmos had warriors doing mid tonlow damage, mages doing super high damage, ccs were an intregral part of pvp and healers, were rarely ever easy to take down and have multiple safeties as well as at least 1 high damage nuke in a heal spec. Thats not bringing the point of battle priests, which is on par with shaman quite honestly sans the holy damage.

    So traditionally speaking, clerics as a whole follow many of traditional fundamentals of RPGs and MMOs. The only feature for clerics which is bazaar is the Druid and it's whole theme and shamans being non holy elemented. The death abilities can be attributed to lichs which have bounced back between mages and fallen priests/angels for many years although they always and high def and resistance as well.

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    Yes, exactly IF and a huge big neon IF people pulled off of you, but they don't.

    So they need to make it so healers can heal themselves and a group as the groups just run around dps'ing whatever and don't plan strategy nor do they use their brain on who to stand by and protect etc.

    They just run in rambo style.

    There is no intelligence But its all good, I had fun, got my rep over the weekend, healed some, dps some....switched roles when needed.

    Just saying, you can't do that to healers because NOONE peels and if they do its so rare you could not design a game around it. The old ways are gone my friend.
    Last edited by rastaah; 08-22-2011 at 12:36 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eughe View Post
    Traditional is very subjective but whatever, traditional mmos had warriors doing mid tonlow damage, mages doing super high damage, ccs were an intregral part of pvp and healers, were rarely ever easy to take down and have multiple safeties as well as at least 1 high damage nuke in a heal spec. Thats not bringing the point of battle priests, which is on par with shaman quite honestly sans the holy damage.

    So traditionally speaking, clerics as a whole follow many of traditional fundamentals of RPGs and MMOs. The only feature for clerics which is bazaar is the Druid and it's whole theme and shamans being non holy elemented. The death abilities can be attributed to lichs which have bounced back between mages and fallen priests/angels for many years although they always and high def and resistance as well.
    You missed the point of his entire post...
    ~Quiescent

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eughe View Post
    Traditional is very subjective but whatever, traditional mmos had warriors doing mid tonlow damage, mages doing super high damage, ccs were an intregral part of pvp and healers, were rarely ever easy to take down and have multiple safeties as well as at least 1 high damage nuke in a heal spec. Thats not bringing the point of battle priests, which is on par with shaman quite honestly sans the holy damage.

    So traditionally speaking, clerics as a whole follow many of traditional fundamentals of RPGs and MMOs. The only feature for clerics which is bazaar is the Druid and it's whole theme and shamans being non holy elemented. The death abilities can be attributed to lichs which have bounced back between mages and fallen priests/angels for many years although they always and high def and resistance as well.
    I understand this, but to clarify, I was talking about mmo pvp.

    Examples like DAOC in response to the OP stating that there was no way to handle mmo healing if a single healer could be taken down by a single dps.

    I was simply pointing out that there are, and have been systems that do this in different ways.

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    To summarize Smyrf:

    A). It was ggod enough for my father...
    B). Based on "you're spoiled" (see A) there should be no healers in WF.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rastaah View Post
    Yes, exactly IF and a huge big neon IF people pulled off of you, but they don't.

    So they need to make it so healers can heal themselves and a group as the groups just run around dps'ing whatever and don't plan strategy nor do they use their brain on who to stand by and protect etc.

    They just run in rambo style.

    There is no intelligence But its all good, I had fun, got my rep over the weekend, healed some, dps some....switched roles when needed.

    Just saying, you can't do that to healers because NOONE peels and if they do its so rare you could not design a game around it. The old ways are gone my friend.
    It is still possible, but it is the absurdly stupid DR system currently in place that cultivates the rambo mentality. If the CC was handled reasonably in this game, people would peel and work together more - because they would have to.

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    Quote Originally Posted by astrocanis View Post
    To summarize Smyrf:

    A). It was ggod enough for my father...
    B). Based on "you're spoiled" (see A) there should be no healers in WF.
    I'm not sure I understand you.

    To summarize:

    1: OP made a statement
    2: I replied that the statement was false and gave an example.
    3: Profit?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Snyrf View Post
    It is still possible, but it is the absurdly stupid DR system currently in place that cultivates the rambo mentality. If the CC was handled reasonably in this game, people would peel and work together more - because they would have to.
    Disagree almost completely. Look at all the " have fun any way you want to as long as it's my way" and " it's my $15 don't tell me how to play" and say farewell to heals (and much less importantly, me).

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    Clerics healing in PvP are just a liability to their team. The whole calling is disabled until they're dead by 1 button press from a dom.
    Their survivability is removed by healing debuffs, unlike bards and chloro/locks with tank cooldowns/blinks
    Chloro/lock healing spells hurt more than real DPS.

    Serious premades are warrior and mage only. Bard(s) for buffs (sometimes).
    Clerics are completely hard negated by a single button press, and bards are like the balanced version of the horrendously broken chloro/lock.

    1 Justicar might be good to run around keeping rolling with the punches up with reparation, but rolling with the punches is bugged and doesn't work, so there's that.
    Last edited by Valanceer; 08-22-2011 at 12:48 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by astrocanis View Post
    Disagree almost completely. Look at all the " have fun any way you want to as long as it's my way" and " it's my $15 don't tell me how to play" and say farewell to heals (and much less importantly, me).
    There are two ways to respond to the lowest common denominator.

    1: Accept it as fate and lower the standards (and thus quality of experience) for everyone.

    or

    2: Build something good, on solid foundation, and encourage people to get better, be smarter, and actually care about things.

    I'll stick with the second every day of the week.

  15. #15
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    The healers team is supposed to protect him, it's called team play. As a Rogue, if I pop on a healer against a good team, they are all over me in about 2 seconds, and I'll die way before that healer. THAT is what stops lone DPS from dropping healers.
    Last edited by Calo; 08-22-2011 at 12:48 PM.

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