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Thread: PvP P8 vs Raid-T4. Effort Vs Reward

  1. #1
    Plane Touched
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    Default PvP P8 vs Raid-T4. Effort Vs Reward

    Let's face it, this topic has been discussed, theorized and ostracized, with constant criticisms and justifications coming from every spectrum of the argument. So I'll keep it short and to the point with less room for the trolls and pyromancers (they like to flame things) to grab points and run away with them.



    The basic jist of the argument is that it simply takes far less to obtain PvP gear than it does PVE gear, which if you look at the minimum requirements is absolutely true.




    Raid T4

    Minimum Requirements for Rewards
    #1 A large continuous time investment (often many hours in a row) to fulfill the third requirement for reward. Result = Hundreds of hours of Raiding/Strategizing/Theorycrafting/Learning Content.

    #2 20 players, organized on an outside VOIP program (that they spend money to use) and a guild associated with organizing and arranging Raids.

    #3 A boss or mob kill, requiring skill/strategy and for the full raid to be participating (specially in hammerknelll)

    #4 (Optional): Skill of the raid drastically changes the rate you can obtain rewards.



    PvP p8

    Minimum Requirements for Rewards
    #1 A large time investment. Result = Hundreds of hours of PVP warfronts (or 4 hours of swapping guardian kills, har har)

    #2 (Optional): Skill drastically changes the rate you can obtain rewards.




    Compounded upon the fact that PvP gear is pretty damn good for PVE(+200 Spellpower synergy crystal anyone?), and it ends up a mite bit unfair for those PVE players.


    Hell, most raiders are experiencing an identity crisis seeing as P7-8 + Synergy crystal completely negates all the hard work they've been doing for months getting T3, it's just a better itemization choice and is far easier to get. (PVP gear is like the choice to AFK in hammerknell and get 2 marks an hour)


    Yet changing any PVP or PVE mechanics drastically would alienate entire portions of the playerbase, leave players with little-to-no incentive to keep playing and in the long term generate less money for trion. This is bad and means we shouldn't poke the angry PVP playerbase too hard.


    Which brings us to the best Solution (with the items at hand)


    Simply divide the items more eficiently between the PVP and PVE roles, namely we should scatter the Focus / Hit stats evenly across all pieces of PVE gear, so that to reach the focus/hit caps for Hammerknell you can't just get a Hat and some gloves, then swap in PVP gear for every other slot.

    All items would give an equal bonus of the hit/focus stats, meaning you would need a full PVE set to PVE, similar to how you get Valor on every piece of PVP gear.


    And this solution would be relatively easy compared to revamping the skill requirements for PVP/PVE. entirely while having other benefits as well (like smoothing out the transitions between PVE focus Tiers).

  2. #2
    Rift Master nacho's Avatar
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    Of course, PvPers need hit and focus to negate avoidance and resists, and it doesn't exist on PvP gear.

    Also, if anyone wants to grind out P8 and THEN spend more time grinding in PvE then more power to them. Their brain isn't developed enough to require stimulation.
    Last edited by nacho; 08-12-2011 at 11:43 PM.

  3. #3
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    horrible idea.

    I raid with mostly r5/r6 gear, and typically pull top dps at around 1400 single target. We often struggle getting the numbers to do 20 mans, but I've cleared bosses in every raid instance including HK. all of a sudden these changes you proposed go through and I have to start from square 1 because I have next to no hit? no thanks.

    It's not unfair at all, top guilds can easily bring a fresh 50 through any raid instance and gear them up much quicker than it would take for someone to reach r5/6 or r7/8 for that matter.
    Tankalron :: Fires of Heaven :: Deepwood (US) Defiant

  4. #4
    Ascendant Cromagis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nacho View Post
    Of course, PvPers need hit and focus to negate avoidance and resists, and it doesn't exist on PvP gear.

    Also, if anyone wants to grind out P8 and THEN spend more time grinding in PvE then more power to them. Their brain isn't developed enough to require stimulation.
    But every single piece of PvE gear that doesnt have focus (Like legs and ect.) Is Best in slot with a PvP item. That shouldn't be it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rizaz View Post
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  5. #5
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    I think the problem is PvPers complain too much and they got their way with better equipment and synergy crystals. Next Trion will make PvP relics because they are complaining they have none. This is a PvE game and they need to realize that.

    Start raiding.
    Last edited by Vindicit; 08-12-2011 at 11:55 PM.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cromagis View Post
    But every single piece of PvE gear that doesnt have focus (Like legs and ect.) Is Best in slot with a PvP item. That shouldn't be it.
    why shouldn't pvp items be along side with BiS raid gear?
    Tankalron :: Fires of Heaven :: Deepwood (US) Defiant

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vindicit View Post
    I think the problem is PvPers complain too much and they got their way with better equipment and synergy crystals. Next Trion will make PvP relics because they are complaining they have none.
    100% PVPers complain too much, however this has nothing to do with the original post - the OP is saying PVP gear should be useless in raid situations - I disagree.

    Also PvP relics would be nice
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tankalron View Post
    why shouldn't pvp items be along side with BiS raid gear?
    pvp armor should not be BiS for RAIDING.
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  9. #9
    General of Telara joker225's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheRealKillian View Post
    pvp armor should not be BiS for RAIDING.
    It's not BiS.
    Relic Raid gear is BiS.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheRealKillian View Post
    pvp armor should not be BiS for RAIDING.
    Good gear should be good gear regardless of what you have to do to acquire it. If I like to both PVP and raid, I should have to play twice as long to get both PVP and PVE gear?
    Tankalron :: Fires of Heaven :: Deepwood (US) Defiant

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tankalron View Post
    Good gear should be good gear regardless of what you have to do to acquire it. If I like to both PVP and raid, I should have to play twice as long to get both PVP and PVE gear?
    then give me valor on my pve gear

    im rank 6 anyway, but its silly that besides helm + gloves for focus, i can use my rank 5/6 gear on the left side and be better off than using my t1 raid gear...all because it lacks a synergy crystal while the pvp rank 6 crystal gives me an extra 100sp
    Killianx<Addiction> - Gnarlwood
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  12. #12
    General of Telara joker225's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheRealKillian View Post
    then give me valor on my pve gear

    im rank 6 anyway, but its silly that besides helm + gloves for focus, i can use my rank 5/6 gear on the left side and be better off than using my t1 raid gear...all because it lacks a synergy crystal while the pvp rank 6 crystal gives me an extra 100sp
    Why should you have valor on pve gear?
    PvP gear already doesn't have hit so seriously, QQ

  13. #13
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    When relics were better than any PvP weapon, PvErs were saying "Stop QQing, play all aspects of the game to get the best gear".

    Now it's the other way round and there is a lot of butt-hurt?

    for you people.

    Exactly those people said it's way easier to PvP than to get a 20-man raid together and start PvEing.
    So what is the problem again now if you start PvPing, if it's so easy anyway?
    Last edited by Wake; 08-13-2011 at 12:52 AM.

  14. #14
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    It takes far less to get PvE gear than it does PvP gear is the situation for me, who are you to judge?

    I would rather jump off a building and have my eye lid caught on a nail on the way down then keep hitting the same panata over and over and over and over again.

    Honestly I do not know how any human can do the same PvE raid over and over without being on drugs -BUT I DON'T JUDGE!

    You like repetitive mundane actions, its your dollar bud...I can't stand it.

    So you see, PvE gear -for me- is so hard and painful to get I think PvP gear needs to be buffed, we need ORANGE PvP items.
    Last edited by Riftrox; 08-13-2011 at 12:54 AM.

  15. #15
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    Lol.. Its not really bis, but its good. Pve weapons were way way way better than pvp previously, where you complaining about that?

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