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Thread: Another Reason Why Open PVP is The Way to Go!

  1. #1
    Rift Disciple
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    Default Another Reason Why Open PVP is The Way to Go!

    Simply put, dumber players, or players who don't try, don't take up space... they are actually useful, another body out there!

    I would like PVP just not to be instanced

    This is such a common topic so I won't go into specifics about my hopes, but figured I'd throw this in.

    Still a great game, crazy how good it is so early. I'm just waiting for some PVP!

  2. #2
    Shadowlander
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    I agree but there are a couple of factors that limit it here. Most players are afraid of dying. They will only go out to fight if they are pretty much assured a win. This leads to "zerging" and ambushes being the attack method of choice for "PvPers".

    The other factor is that the world is large and finding player's early on isn't all that easy. When you do if you kill them they can pretty much just run away or port back and come back later. Telara isn't travel friendly place at all. I have caught a few people on roads but catching them a second time is almost impossible.

    I'd love to see more open world PvP and maybe PvP objectives but it's not as straight forward as putting some objectives on the map and some rewards at an NPC.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fylkra View Post
    I agree but there are a couple of factors that limit it here. Most players are afraid of dying. They will only go out to fight if they are pretty much assured a win. This leads to "zerging" and ambushes being the attack method of choice for "PvPers".

    The other factor is that the world is large and finding player's early on isn't all that easy. When you do if you kill them they can pretty much just run away or port back and come back later. Telara isn't travel friendly place at all. I have caught a few people on roads but catching them a second time is almost impossible.

    I'd love to see more open world PvP and maybe PvP objectives but it's not as straight forward as putting some objectives on the map and some rewards at an NPC.
    Ya you are right it would need to be done right.

    How about battlegrounds? part of the zone you log into and fight over keeps and towers... just like daoc.

    Daoc seemed to do it okay. And if you are worried about the no 3rd faction thing... we can always use rift invasions

    IDK to me it seems easy, just a tweak here or there.

    battlegrounds, non-instanced zones... you fight, its fun you can even use the same maps I guess

  4. #4
    Soulwalker
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    You have to understand that if PVP is not instanced then it is never going to be fair. It is hard enough to balance it in warfronts. Open PVP normally means whoever get the most bodies to the battlefield wins.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by benefiter View Post
    You have to understand that if PVP is not instanced then it is never going to be fair. It is hard enough to balance it in warfronts. Open PVP normally means whoever get the most bodies to the battlefield wins.
    Am I the only one who thinks its okay if its unfair?

    lol I don't care... I understand the concern, but then u ask your guild to come help you out, or whatever.

    PVP can be non-instanced and be fun. Currently It isn't IMO.

    Last night I was trying to play codex. 3-5 people gave up and sat there, and the other times at lvl 40-49 they didn't know where codex was. That seems unfair to me.

    I really hope the Devs don't feel the way you do.. I mean that in all respect.

  6. #6
    Rift Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by benefiter View Post
    You have to understand that if PVP is not instanced then it is never going to be fair. It is hard enough to balance it in warfronts. Open PVP normally means whoever get the most bodies to the battlefield wins.

    It doesnt have to be equal numbers to be fun. Hell half the time I enjoy killing larger numbers of players using teamwork and skill and perhaps gear advantages. Things are NEVER going to be equal.. you think warfronts are equal pairing up rank 6 premades with fresh 50s that dont even know how to make macros?

    Its just a pain that you are forced to group with these bad fresh 50s when you join warfronts.

  7. #7
    Plane Touched Weakest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by benefiter View Post
    You have to understand that if PVP is not instanced then it is never going to be fair. It is hard enough to balance it in warfronts. Open PVP normally means whoever get the most bodies to the battlefield wins.
    And yet even with that thought, the other games that have O-PvP Zones have people running around solo, in small groups and full groups despite the disadvantage of having smaller numbers. It isn't always about the zerg.

    For objectives you could try one of these...

    A persistent zone with a queue (Very wide threshold, not 1:1) might not be too bad. No caps on the actual zone but if there are say 152 Guardians and 112 Defiant in Zone. No More Guardians can enter until 125 Defiant are in the zone. ( I really do not prefer this one)

    or

    NPC guards scaling with imbalance could also be used.

    1.58:1 Ratio in Defiant's favor. NPC guards protecting Guardian Wardstone at Objective A are 58% stronger/tougher. Make it scale based on pop imbalance. This doesn't effect skirmishes but it does make taking the wardstone for the Defiants a little more difficult.

    Hell you could also have a random NPC invasion that attacks only the Wardstones belonging to the overpopulated side. Make them do slightly more damage to the overpopulated side until the population imbalances are within the threshold. Some people from the larger side might get caught up and pre occupied with the invasion leading less to overpower the other side. Small groups of talented people could use these invasions as opportunities to strike at weakened areas of the overpopulated sides territority.
    Last edited by Weakest; 06-22-2011 at 01:08 PM.

  8. #8
    Shadowlander Aslem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sandpaper3 View Post
    Am I the only one who thinks its okay if its unfair?

    lol I don't care... I understand the concern, but then u ask your guild to come help you out, or whatever.

    PVP can be non-instanced and be fun. Currently It isn't IMO.

    Last night I was trying to play codex. 3-5 people gave up and sat there, and the other times at lvl 40-49 they didn't know where codex was. That seems unfair to me.

    I really hope the Devs don't feel the way you do.. I mean that in all respect.
    Yes agree!

    What fun is it if there's not some danger? This also encourages more of a sense of community.
    " The way to a man's heart is through his stomach...but only if you position the blade just right."

  9. #9
    Telaran
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    These discussions used to go on constantly in the Warhammer forums.

    World PvP will devolve into zerging if it's all focused into one area like taking out the active "tower" or "keep."

    That's cool, but if you want variety to the experience, which includes action during off-peak non-zerg times, there needs to be incentive for small groups which will create skirmishes.

    Normal leveling zone PvP creates small skirmishes already by having leveling quests in a huge PvE area. Enemies run into eachother when they both have a questing area in common. There's no reason for 40 to congregate there and create zerg play because there's no way or reason for 40 people to be on the same quest at the same time in the same area.

    When you create multiple mini objectives, solo quests, nodes etc with proper level rewards/consequences, people will go there and naturally find beef with eachother. It also avoids zergs because there's no way/reason to have an entire zerg devoted to complete a soloable daily or control 1 objective at a time when there are 10 on the map that could be assaulted at any time.
    Last edited by Mechchicken; 06-22-2011 at 02:45 PM.

  10. #10
    Rift Disciple Laiboch's Avatar
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    The only way to really create more opportunity for open world PVP is to remove the ability for groups to port into dungeons and raids. If you want to run RoTF you had better get off your butt and go there. The closer a dungeon is to an opposing factions controlled areas the better the rewards should be.

    So for instance IT would be the best gear etc for a guardian and RoTF would be the best for Defiant. By putting that carrot out there you would have lvl 50's moving around in open world all the time creating many opportunities for PVP instead of this insta-port no risk but getting all the rewards system they have now.

    On a PVP server you should have risk vs reward. As the system is now there is no risk at all.

  11. #11
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    just played 1.3 for abit....

    got no eggs for the event, my K/D was prob 2 / 18

    ...Was Awesome!!! lol I had a great time

    I think they've done it! Keep it up Trion!

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by benefiter View Post
    You have to understand that if PVP is not instanced then it is never going to be fair. It is hard enough to balance it in warfronts. Open PVP normally means whoever get the most bodies to the battlefield wins.
    Warhammer was great in this regard- the RVR (PVP) zones really worked. There was a constant stream of one team getting the upper hand over the other and vise-a-versa. An unbalanced situation could swing around the other way in a few minutes as new players entered the fray, and most of the time things just seemed to balance out somehow. Plus you could do cool stuff like ignore RVR lake objectives and run a ganking group, set up awesome ambushes: several times a few buddies and myself could hold a fort against an overwhelming force-at least for a while- and it felt great!

    I suggest that anyone who hasn't done so should play the free endless Warhammer trial on a PVE server (you can get into RvR from level 1) go and play in the RVR lake in the low level zone (its basic, has no forts, but is still better than what we have in Rift at the moment) and then come back and post some ideas. With the cool class system in Rift the addition of a Warhammer-like RVR lake system would be mind blowing.

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