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Thread: Instead of a set 40v40 (E3 rumour) - RvR style pvp instance idea

  1. #1
    Prophet of Telara
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    Default Instead of a set 40v40 (E3 rumour) - RvR style pvp instance idea

    I know I've posted this one before to varying degrees of feedback - but with recent rumours coming out of E3 for a new 40v40 instance (good luck getting that one to pop), I think it'd be better to see a permanent pvp instance with some pve goodies hidden away inside:

    Starting out, I'm working off the assumption that most that are asking for RvR or Open World PvP objectives are looking for the following:
    1. A free-flowing area (ie no manufactured start/stop times) that can be entered/exited whenever.
    2. Objectives which have an impact on gameplay outside this area.

    Based on those assumptions, the argument typically is that you need at least 3 factions to prevent one side from permanently outnumbering the other side as there are always going to be multiple fronts to fight a war on.

    So, regarding third faction and why we already have one...
    1. We already have cross-server WF technology.
    2. We already have lore which supports alternate timeline/dimensions.

    Therefore the 'third faction' is just other server-factions.

    So the idea is based around the original format of the DAoC RvR area:
    1. Each server-faction enters through their own little starting area.
    2. Objectives can be one of the three:
    a) server based (so both guardians and defiants work together from the same server against other servers)
    b) faction based (so all guardians vs all defiants from a cluster)
    c) server-faction based (ie Nyx-Defiant vs everyone else on the cluster)
    3. Respawn points are only in the starting areas, and objectives should be a ways out - meaning death in pvp means something, and battle rezzes now have a purpose in pvp. Respawn force should take a bit longer and be interruptable as well so it's a choice rather than a random right click.
    4. There will be some pve content added to this area as well, make it so that there are little out of the way (and not so out of the way) areas where there is content that makes the pve crowd want to come out and risk getting jumped (ie reward matches the risk). This means that the zone gets used regularly.

    Add in some choke points through the paths you have to cross from respawn to objective areas, and you now have an area with the capacity for open world PVP.

    The only major difficulty would be how to flag everyone - but I think to keep the 'faction' aspect interesting - everyone that's not of your server-faction is red (this may be the only major technical hurdle as currently everyone of your faction regardless of server is friendly). So even when you're working together on an objective it means you need to be careful of AE usage if you're working in a team.

    The other major technical issue would be building starting points in a way that's scalable.


    tl;dr version:
    - Introduce a persistant WF, with objectives that when controlled benefit your server-faction.
    - Objectives are either server-faction specific, faction specific, or server specific to create multiple fronts to fight on at all times.
    - Anyone not of your server-faction is red.
    - Entry points are away from objectives and all sides must cross a chokepoint to get into objective areas.
    - Add valuable pve drops in out of the way areas as well to draw out a regular crowd.
    Ceribaen, formerly of Nyx (D).
    Now residing on Seastone.

  2. #2
    Rift Master Leiloni's Avatar
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    I like the idea of having an Open World PvP zone with objectives that affect the entire server population, forcing a constant need to wage war in the zone and change up the PvP a bit. I came from a balanced server in Aion where we had three zones of fortresses that we constantly were attacking/defending and it was fun, but I don't want it to feel like just another WF because what would the point be of that.

    I would prefer Objectives to be faction based but I don't want it to be like WoW's Wintergrasp where you go if you felt like it and you could completely ignore it otherwise. There should be incentives for everyone to show up and something substantial to be gained if you win objectives and something substantial to be lost if you lose objectives. (Depending on what those incentives are it might need to be changed a bit for PvE servers, but for PvP servers you should be in that zone frequently once you hit 50.)

    I also think it would need something that forces people to communicate with each other and work as a team. Too often you join a random WF queue and don't know the people there nor care, communication is minimal, etc. and you can get away with winning that way. It's more fun when it's a group effort and not so anonymous - this is an MMO after all.

    As for the "third faction", why not just make it the various planar enemies from rifts and invasions? If they can take over objectives it gives the losing faction a chance to win a few objectives from them. That I think could be the PvE content - rifts and invasions throughout the zone like any other zone. Also, I think there should be no spawn points like your typical WF. Treat it like any other zone with small camps or towns. Provided the enemy faction and/or a planar faction hasn't taken over the town/camp, you can spawn there. That provides more possible strategy for the opposing team as well and a reason for battle rez to be used. Worst case scenario, you rez in a different zone in your own server and just go back (since it would be persistent, you can go in whenever you want). Although I doubt that would happen.

    Anyway, all in all I like your idea, but my two main concerns are this:
    1. Make it feel more like an actual zone instead of a WF
    2. Incentives for everyone to come out regularly and participate - so not only benefits for winning, but also something to be lost if you lose.
    Last edited by Leiloni; 06-13-2011 at 01:32 PM.

  3. #3
    Prophet of Telara
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    Regarding your second point - I feel that adding the pve incentive (think crafting augment drops on mobs that are off the beaten track, or in general crafting materials which are used to make items on par at least with t2 plaque gear) would help draw out enough regular people that you'll get those wanting to jump the pvers out in a large enough crowd that the anti-pks come out to deal with them, which means you get a large enough regular crowd passing through chokepoints that people travel in groups, etc... The 'objectives' are more of a macguffin to drive the achiever crowd - but they do benefit your side if you currently hold one (which would encourage defense, which means you need a few people keeping an eye out, etc). It really does follow the classic rvr zone concept of DAoC - just with a larger amount of entrants into the 'war'. Because it's persistant and not timed, raids/groups form up as people are willing... you aren't automatically added to one - which is part of where the communication will pick up. Similar to invasion events on the server, you'll get one or two people taking charge of a raid and some coordination eventually happens.
    Ceribaen, formerly of Nyx (D).
    Now residing on Seastone.

  4. #4
    dmv
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    Champion of Telara dmv's Avatar
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    A word of advice, don't believe anything trion says until you see it. They've a habit of being vague to avoid alienating their player base. Think of it this way, they can't just come out and say, "**** pvp, our game is pve centered, thanks for your money, now kindly **** off."
    Retired due to lack of PVP content and boring/repetitive game mechanics.

  5. #5
    Shield of Telara
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    Quote Originally Posted by dmv View Post
    Think of it this way, they can't just come out and say, "**** pvp, our game is pve centered, thanks for your money, now kindly **** off."
    sadly exactly that is what their actions say since release
    Last edited by Balduran; 06-13-2011 at 07:39 PM.

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