+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 21

Thread: Valor mitigation weapons

  1. #1
    Telaran
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    55

    Default Valor mitigation weapons

    Anyone else thinks this needs to be implemented along with valor? Kinda tired of seeing clerics shrugging off the strongest attacks of several players and healing through effortlessly with their mitigation + valor.

    I have a guildmate (r6 of course) who regularly runs stones in whitefall with 1/2 - 3/4 of the raid beating on him (self casted cc immunities ftw) and I do find it a -wee- bit overpowered.

  2. #2
    Rift Master GriffonHawke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    695

    Default

    You mean like weapons that let you do more damage to players even if they have buttloads of valor? I think its a pretty good idea.


    I mean what happens when your prestige 6 and with valor + your spec you can get like 40% damage reduction while having 7-8k health.


    As you go up in prestige, you become harder to kill, but you dont get anything that helps you kill anyone else easier.


    This is why someone made a post, "Does valor benefit clerics and warriors more than mages and rogues?", because it does. Warriors and clerics usually get targeted the most, and are classes with armor, so the valor helps them survive more.


    Rogues are either stealthy or long distance rangers, so they try to not take damage at all and put out good dps. Mages also do this.


    So if your a rogue or a mage, going up in the rank just gets you more survivability, when your still squishy and still probably ****ed when you get people attacking you.





    I think trion needs to do something similar to the PvE system with Hit/Focus/toughness. Mages only dps (or heal through damage), so they get focus. Other classes get 2 sets of purchasable gear with either Hit or Toughness, depending on if they tank or dps.


    I think PvP players should also have the option of purchasing gear that makes them do more damage/healing or gear that lets them take less damage.

  3. #3
    Soulwalker
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    12

    Default

    That's dumb. Make people harder to kill then negate it by gocong you weapons to make it easier. Think about. It's like +10 -10 = 0.

    Why even get valor. Might as well get your anti valor weapon and pve gear andhit like a truck.

    Just stupid.




    Posted via mobile

  4. #4
    Rift Disciple
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    131

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by dutchturbine View Post
    That's dumb. Make people harder to kill then negate it by gocong you weapons to make it easier. Think about. It's like +10 -10 = 0.

    Why even get valor. Might as well get your anti valor weapon and pve gear andhit like a truck.
    The only way those weapons would make any sense is.. if they were a lot worse against non-valor targets than other weapons.

    Normal weapon vs valored up guy, 100 dps
    anti-valor weapon vs valored up guy, 130 dps
    normal weapon vs non-valored guy, 130dps
    anti-valor weapon vs non-valored guy, 100 dps

    A bit silly if you ask me, but not quite as silly as simply having equal damage weapons that now bypass valor also.

    And then you have wardrobes usable in pvp so you can't even be sure of which weapon to use before you've seen some numbers in combat log.
    Last edited by Tizian; 05-28-2011 at 08:36 PM.

  5. #5
    Rift Master GriffonHawke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    695

    Default

    Im talking about weapons with a stat on them that makes it easier to kill people with valor.

  6. #6
    Ascendant Eughe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    7,420

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by GriffonHawke View Post
    Im talking about weapons with a stat on them that makes it easier to kill people with valor.
    Its understood what you are talking about. But its a dumb idea because it negates the point of even having Valor.


    All anyone would need is raid gear + valor weapon and they will pretty much wreck house on anyone.
    It would literally make having valor a liabi8lity in pvp instead of a necessity, and make PvE gear the once again, go to gear for anything in the game.

    All this again, just to kill a cleric, instead of just changing builds.
    Last edited by Eughe; 05-28-2011 at 09:25 PM.

  7. #7
    Rift Master GriffonHawke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    695

    Default

    grr nonono.


    Its not like if you have valor you take 30% less damage from normal players but the guy with the special weapon does 30% MORE damage to you...


    Its like if valor is giving you 30% damage reduction from players, this weapon lets you ignore 5% of that damage reduction, or 10% of that damage reduction



    Its not negating the effects of valor and its not making valor a liability. It simply makes it so if your prestige 6, you trying to damage someone with valor isnt the same thing as you trying to damage someone with valor at prestige 1.

  8. #8
    Telaran
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    55

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Eughe View Post
    Its understood what you are talking about. But its a dumb idea because it negates the point of even having Valor.


    All anyone would need is raid gear + valor weapon and they will pretty much wreck house on anyone.
    It would literally make having valor a liabi8lity in pvp instead of a necessity, and make PvE gear the once again, go to gear for anything in the game.

    All this again, just to kill a cleric, instead of just changing builds.
    1) PVP gear has been adjusted to be better than raid gear (not even counting valor). Not sure what you're smoking here.
    2) Why are you even posting when you clearly dont even understand how each class works?

    Mages have NOTHING against clerics aside from a weak passive heal debuff in the pvp tree (necro's is weak and removable and anyone who tries to dps while being specced high enough in chloro to get blight is simply stupid). Neither do mages have any effective purge skills. Stating that "changing builds" would solve it is ignorant. I would think non-MM rogues would be facing the same issue.

    As mentioned, valor benefits most classes that have high hp and/or can self heal. So why shouldnt there be an equivalent weapon to negate it? Why should dps classes get the short end of the stick? That is the question here, which you clearly avoided. And no, the gear buff does -not- balance it out. This will become apparent once you start facing R6 players.

    Please stop posting until you actually know what youre talking about. Misinformation contributes absolutely nothing to the discussion.

    dutchturbine's pointless ranting
    Reported both posts for stupidity. Not even worth a reply.
    Last edited by Ironhart; 05-28-2011 at 10:41 PM.

  9. #9
    Rift Chaser
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    348

    Default

    All this would effectively do is decrease valor. Pretty quickly, everyone (except the new players) would have these weapons, meaning that the gear gap between recent 50s and veteran 50s is even wider and the grind is even longer for an end-result that could have been achieved by just reducing valor.

  10. #10
    Telaran
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    55

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalos View Post
    All this would effectively do is decrease valor. Pretty quickly, everyone (except the new players) would have these weapons, meaning that the gear gap between recent 50s and veteran 50s is even wider and the grind is even longer for an end-result that could have been achieved by just reducing valor.
    Personally Id go for just making anti-valor weapons cost alot to get, which would either require raising favor cap and/or require high faction rep. Reducing valor reduces the incentive to get them, which defeats the purpose of buffing them in the first place.

  11. #11
    Ascendant
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    4,349

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalos View Post
    All this would effectively do is decrease valor. Pretty quickly, everyone (except the new players) would have these weapons, meaning that the gear gap between recent 50s and veteran 50s is even wider and the grind is even longer for an end-result that could have been achieved by just reducing valor.
    Except that valor would still offer an advantage for those who had "paid their dues" over those who were just entering the level 50 PvP scene.

    I'm not opposed to the idea. I just can't say I'm for it, either. There are bigger issue sin warfronts right now than valor.

  12. #12
    Rift Chaser
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    348

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ironhart View Post
    Personally Id go for just making anti-valor weapons cost alot to get, which would either require raising favor cap and/or require high faction rep. Reducing valor reduces the incentive to get them, which defeats the purpose of buffing them in the first place.
    Yes, but this is what these weapons will (effectively) do for fully-geared people. All you would be accomplishing is making the grind longer, and putting early 50s at a more significant disadvantage. Neither of these are good things.
    Last edited by Kalos; 05-28-2011 at 10:52 PM.

  13. #13
    Telaran
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    55

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Licentia View Post
    Except that valor would still offer an advantage for those who had "paid their dues" over those who were just entering the level 50 PvP scene.

    I'm not opposed to the idea. I just can't say I'm for it, either. There are bigger issue sin warfronts right now than valor.
    Yes, and I believe tanky healers (lol wut) are the biggest one. This would go some way to solving the issue without requiring massive changes to clerics and/or the pvp system in general.

  14. #14
    Telaran
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    55

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalos View Post
    Yes, but this is what these weapons will (effectively) do for fully-geared people. All you would be accomplishing is making the grind longer, and putting early 50s at a more significant disadvantage. Neither of these are good things.
    Well, as has been stated before in other threads, progression is part and parcel of an MMO. Otherwise we'd might as well scrap the valor system altogether.

  15. #15
    Ascendant Eughe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    7,420

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ironhart View Post
    1) PVP gear has been adjusted to be better than raid gear (not even counting valor). Not sure what you're smoking here.
    2) Why are you even posting when you clearly dont even understand how each class works?

    1) Mages have NOTHING against clerics aside from a weak passive heal debuff in the pvp tree (2) necro's is weak and removable and anyone who tries to dps while being specced high enough in chloro to get blight is simply stupid). Neither do mages have any effective purge skills. 3)Stating that "changing builds" would solve it is ignorant. I would think non-MM rogues would be facing the same issue.

    As mentioned, valor benefits 4) most classes that have high hp and/or can self heal. 5)So why shouldnt there be an equivalent weapon to negate it? Why should dps classes get the short end of the stick? That is the question here, which you clearly avoided. And no, the gear buff does -not- balance it out. This will become apparent once you start facing R6 players.

    Please stop posting until you actually know what youre talking about. Misinformation contributes absolutely nothing to the discussion.



    Reported both posts for stupidity. Not even worth a reply.
    If you arent going to say anything intelligent, please do not post.

    PvP gear is not better than PvE gear, stat wise. What PvP gear adds is survivability. You can not take PvP gear and use it in PvE. The reverse is untrue to an extent.


    1) How this has anything to do with why adding an anti valor weapon to negate the point of valor is a very big question.
    2) Pyro > Cleric, SC > Cleric. Just an fyi. But in any case, just as a cleric had to change build in order to function in pvp, and just as all players who do kill clerics had to change build in order to kill said cleric when they become a problem, you can too. Look, my first sentence gives you a bit of a step up.
    3) Again, what does mage build discussion has to do with the topic at hand?
    4) It benefits all classes. There is no class in game that is at a disadvantage with valor in pvp. Your following sentence is falsely stated in this context. All classes with valor and/or some form of mitigation that receives heals, benefits from valor, as long as your cleric is up, you receive just as much benefit from valor as they do.
    5) Because valor was put here so that classes that already do high amount of damage, especially in pve gear (like mages) do not 1 2 hit every and anyone. So that pvp matches last longer when gearing is relatively similar.


    And i do face r6 players, including mages. If you do not know how to build your class, or even pvp (which is evident) then thats on you. But your QQ is duly noted.

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts