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Thread: Defiant tactic in various warfonts - My view from my part as a dominator.

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2011

    Default Defiant tactic in various warfonts - My view from my part as a dominator.


    I will start this thread off by saying, people need to stop QQ'ing just for the sake of it. Half your adressed problems are dealt with on the forums/youtube, solutions, styles, tactic and so on.

    Now, we've covered the extremes.

    For a set period of time, the warfonts was dominated by Guardians. They had prestige level 6, premade, we had prestige level 1-3.
    For weeks, we gained our levels simply by losing.

    This of course only goes for Scarwood, Scarhide, Imperium and Overlook, but this is how the premade that win against us looked:
    Mireha - Cleric.
    Erim - Mage.
    Takanashi - OP. (He's the one keeping their team up).
    They had random pugs around prestige level 4-5 but no need in listing them since any healer or pyro with a brain could fill their spots.
    When a cleric has 28-29% damage reduction, and a pyro infront of him in his strength has 58ish% damage reduction, it really doesn't matter what happens if you don't have the PvP soul yourself.

    However, the teams started to even out, we learned PvP better (didn't really get the hang of it before 250,000 favor earned, so don't argue about balance before then, please), tactics, how to nail clerics and so on.

    If your team does not: Consecutivly attack the same target, healer use hotkeys to tab through and heal teammates, you don't have macros set inplace to stun-free/stun/silence, you don't CC the healers consecutivly, use more than 10 bound hotkeys/macros, then you simply have nothing to whine about, because we're simply better than you on our own. Even when pugging, I get the team together with team-macros, leader tag healers and pyros and so on.
    If you don't change your role atleast 5 times during a warfront, you are most likely clueless to what is going on and dragging your team down.

    So, below is how the Overlook premade wins 8/10 matches, depending on who is on in the premade:

    Black Garden:

    51 dominator, 15 archmage.
    Nobody on our team plays Pyro, because we find pyro ********. Boring to play, it does indeed not require skill, besides avoiding reflective abilities and picking good spots to GOS.
    However, if you do have a pyro, he should flicker ahead of the teams, put up his GOS with vision to the fang, so he can AOE it, tank damage, and healers stay behind. Rogue with damage delay should pick up the fang.

    However, we've stopped doing that.
    Yours truly (as in I) go Dominator. I run straight into the ring and turn whoever is infront into a squirrel, then I confuse the rest of the team. I run past, I find the healer(s) and instantly cast silence, squirrel, stun and whatnot. In between this, it's important to shoot some instant damaging spells to build up charge.
    I also place a detection field on our carrier (doesn't matter who picks up, doesn't change anything).
    When charge is full, I use either reflective command (based on how many pyros there are), and if no Pyros I simply use that spell that lowers their damage/healing by 10% for every tick.
    As a dominator I'm extremely vulnerable, it sounds overpowered but it truly isn't. People just haven't figured out how to deal with it correctly.

    Then, we stand infront of the guardian side, trying to split the army. If we succeed, we've won the game since people are simply too bad in PvP to regroup, attack the same targets, heal consecutivly. Those are the main things that make the games so easy. No mage, with 4k hp, can survive 7 people shooting him at the same time.

    If the enemy carries fang, I cast reduce healing on him, I cast the silence spell on healer and I squirrel any dps, or stun healer before diminishing returns set in.
    Other than all that, I simply tab through all enemies and use squirrel to interrupt abilities I see has a casting time.

    Whitefall Steppes:

    32 dominator, 31 chloromancer and 3 on archmage.

    The teams run off. The team grabs fang. Our team take blue ball and hit for home.
    I stay behind and take all the balls when I see the guardians are at our ramp (I check map to see how far my own team is and estimate guardians is as far on our side) to prevent any rogue from grabbing it, run as hell then teleport with delay damage into their own base.
    I try to CC everyone as long as I can. I heal myself, use antiroot to get myself out of LOS (hide in stairs) from mages and/or rogues. With red ball, flourish and bloom is really sufficient to outheal anything.
    I use mouse hotkey to cast stun/confuse, and use squirrel when someone tries to pick fang. If not, I always tab through enemies while using mouse hotkeys to CC unselected enemies.

    The longer I delay them, the less chance of success. Closer to our own spawn than theirs, so our dead can reach their carrier much easier than their reinforcement.
    This, combined with low geared enemies and unorganized teams, usually gives a 1-0.
    After that, depending on who we play against, we either defend (same tactic as to win on Black Garden, really) with a skrimishing team going out, or just go for the quick win if we're way ahead.

    If the flag is taken, one rogue can onehit most carriers, and return fang, before he dies (when the damage buff is on) aslong as he either gets one heal, or one other person to throw in some dps.

    If we're under, it's a free for all were 1/5th of team (roughly) stays behind to avoid a free point for them and increasing the number of people that has to leave.
    Again, cc AoE abilities against mages/melee is important.


    51 dominator, or dominator-pyro for burst.

    What to say? Rush for flag, get everyone except 2 to go codex (one instantly vault, one instantly TS).
    If we kill people (2+) then those two go for statue. If we are winning codex (in the long run) I go to statue with them.
    We can keep reinforcements off, and grab the statue, infinitely. CC, healer, dps. This is the point I change to dominator (still squirrel, aoe confuse and 2 stun abilities) but I also do 2+k without critting with my burst, which, coordinated, can onehit alot of people when a rogue bumps from stun and I have stunned/squirreled any other healer and/or person around.
    I change to healer/dominator if I am the only healer there.

    I wish there were any endgame to Codex, but there isn't. Once you're under, you get zerged, and you can't get out. Atleast not in time. Camp outside base, win. Whatever points my enemy had when we begin zerging, is how the game ends.
    That, or we get zerged ourselves.

    Port Scion:

    51 dominator, domi-pyro or domi-chloro.

    I will say this first: Port Scion is completely broken as a map. Ok thanks.

    I change every 2nd minute on this map. Keeping two enemies away while healing a rogue, stunning one while silencing to burst a healer, ccing mobs to take fang, ccing bridge, using AoE when I see alot of GOS/GOP, cast healing reduction on healers.

    The frag count on the server, fairly equal. Favor during the game, fairly equal.
    But guardians don't get stones. At all. Even if guardians get bridge, there's just 15 people standing on it defending.
    You don't get points for that. You get points from delivering Source Stones. It's as if you don't know.

    And those who do know, hope someone else does it.
    You don't get favor from delivering sourcestones, and your farther away from kills by doing it, so less Prestige. Doing what needs to be done for your team to win, will leave you infinitely far behind. You get more favor just farming on bridge, than actually winning the map for your team. (You lose out on so much by carrying fangs constantly).
    So we all pick up 2 each then QQ to other players.
    Stones increase your damage, and healing received, by 1% per stack.

    Eventually, we have 15 stones and guardians has 1-2. At that point, it stops mattering. I have -never- seen any guardian try to kill our wards (to remove the buff from the stacks) but if we're behind, we go to rogue it.


    We always have atleast one healer, two (or offheal) if we have 8 or more people.
    Don't whine about no healers, change to a healer yourself and shut up. Every time I see people whine about healing, all they have to do is change to healer themselves. Especially warriors.
    If you whine about their healers, change to a build with as much CC as possible. Simply stun them.
    If you target doesn't die without heal for the duration of a stun (14 seconds max I believe?) then you are disorganized and need to mark targets or talk through who to target.

    Our priority on targets (not necissarily to kill):

    Dominators must die. In a 5v5, a dominator turns it into 2v4 and reduce your damage output. Do the math.
    Clerics - CC, silence or push them back, kill after DPSer(s) are taken out.
    Rogues - Kill after healers are CC'ed or you LOS them.
    Mages - Healing mages can be taken out so easily it's stupid. We ignore pyros as long as any cleric or mage is still alive, since a P6 pyro, in GOS with any sort of heal can tank 5 players.
    Warriors - There is only one warrior spec that works at the moment, any others we just pity.


    About balance:

    I won't get into this, please don't argue about this small part it's just stuff I've noticed:

    - Should have their damage increased to match Valor. As Valor increased, Chloromancer healing diminishes to the point it's barely usefull.
    However, if healing for clerics were lowered by valor (as chloromancer healing is), atleast on themselves, it would make chloromancer abit more important to play at 44 points.

    Pyro GOS:
    Should be dispellable, or consume charge while active.
    That means you can't cast FULMINATE while in GOS. I don't care how slow it goes down, but it should consume charge so you can't hang in it infinitely, and fulminate can't be abused.

    Cleric healing: It's ok. But they shouldn't be able to heal themselves for as much as they heal others, it makes him too much a one-man tank and you need two healing debuffs and stun just to kill him (considering healing current and so on). That said, in exchange, clerics should do more AoE damage. No idea how to make it happen, but I'm thinking along the lines of hitting 2 targets.

    Just fix them already.

    Rogues: They are ok, but the immune and 4 teleports really needs a cooldown. They can run through entire whitefall, and not using a rogue for this is stupid since it's so overpowered. But then again, a class designed exactly for this purpose, should it not be allowed to do so?
    Stealth should consume charge while in PvP. Also, they should do increased damage based on armor type, since they are hit the hardest by damage reduction (per hit).

    So yeah. We win constantly. Not because of me, but because of how we team together. We win even when there's just 2 of us, it's enough to take down anyone if they don't cooperate well. CC, damage, reflect damage, stealth detection, being 2 healers to keep our pugs alive...

    Oh well... Enjoy this sunny Wednesday, and see you on the Warfronts.
    Last edited by Mocile; 05-04-2011 at 03:50 AM.

  2. #2
    Plane Walker
    Join Date
    Jan 2011


    Shouldn't this be in your respective server? These forums serve both EU and US and whatever you're describing is indicative of your situation in your specific warfront group.

    As for the more general observations, you got the cleric situation all wrong. They currently survive more not due to their heals, but to their superior mitigation builds. Of course, staying alive longer gives them the opportunity to heal more. Still, your observations on cleric self healing are off base.
    Last edited by Xasapis; 05-04-2011 at 03:51 AM.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2011


    Quote Originally Posted by Xasapis View Post
    Shouldn't this be in your respective server? These forums serve both EU and US and whatever you're describing is indicative of your situation in your specific warfront group.

    As for the more general observations, you got the cleric situation all wrong. They currently survive more not due to their heals, but to their superior mitigation builds. Of course, staying alive longer gives them the opportunity to heal more. Still, your observations on cleric self healing are off base.
    I won't argue about the balance.

    No, this has nothing to do with my servers. This is how we play in PvP in general, I was simply listing the servers to avoid people discussing wether or not they are enforced, never seen the names, never seen the premade or stuff like "we don't have prestige rank 6 on our server, what are you talking about".

    This is about dominator in a Premade of 2-5 people, and PvP adressing QQ in general, from people who go "lol I'm so good, anyone I can't take on 2v1 is OP" or don't know how builds work and so on.

    Edit: Also stating that one dominator can turn the tide aslong as he knows what he's doing.
    If you go to Codex, for example, you can be as good as you bloody want to, when 5 of your people has 30-80% damage and healing reduced for up to 24 seconds, since you don't take out the dominator running around your own ranks. (not adressing YOU, but guardians =p)

    Edit again: The cleric part was mostly about chloromancers having heals lowered by Valor (the synth ones), whereas clerics do not. I'm sorry if I have a wrong approach at my observation arguement.
    Last edited by Mocile; 05-04-2011 at 03:59 AM.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2011


    Hmm wonder why you can't edit after 5 min >.> /sense

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