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Thread: [Warfronts] Premades must be allowed to go ONLY against premades

  1. #1
    Telaran yaesir's Avatar
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    Default [Warfronts] Premades must be allowed to go ONLY against premades

    PUGS are getting rolled.

    Hard.


    You see TRION, you dont allow a full premade (20 people) to go against another premade, but you allow a 5 man premade to go against a complete PUG group, and it isnt suprising that the PUG group gets rolled hard. Very very hard (500 to 8 points? 1000 to 23?) without even being able to capture anything.

    Coordination in a premade completely obliterates any hope of a PUG winning, the premades look and see whoever is doing the most damage or heals and in time make it so they are unable to do anything (literally i have seen people, including myself, stunnned from 100% to 0%).

    This isnt fun and it reflects on how long the warfronts are taking to pop right now. They are far longer than they were at the start of March (i remember the week of 03/07/2011 being a week that i didnt see a single warfront take longer than 2min to pop, and i was lvl50).

    This game needs to make it so that a complete PUG warfront goes against a complete PUG (no premades whatsoever), and a premade (group or raid) can ONLY go against another full premade.

    No more PUGs versus Premades trion, this has killed pvp in multiple games and people dont wait long for this kind of stuff to be sorted out.

  2. #2
    Rift Master Sskzins's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yaesir View Post
    PUGS are getting rolled.

    Hard.


    You see TRION, you dont allow a full premade (20 people) to go against another premade, but you allow a 5 man premade to go against a complete PUG group, and it isnt suprising that the PUG group gets rolled hard. Very very hard (500 to 8 points? 1000 to 23?) without even being able to capture anything.

    Coordination in a premade completely obliterates any hope of a PUG winning, the premades look and see whoever is doing the most damage or heals and in time make it so they are unable to do anything (literally i have seen people, including myself, stunnned from 100% to 0%).

    This isnt fun and it reflects on how long the warfronts are taking to pop right now. They are far longer than they were at the start of March (i remember the week of 03/07/2011 being a week that i didnt see a single warfront take longer than 2min to pop, and i was lvl50).

    This game needs to make it so that a complete PUG warfront goes against a complete PUG (no premades whatsoever), and a premade (group or raid) can ONLY go against another full premade.

    No more PUGs versus Premades trion, this has killed pvp in multiple games and people dont wait long for this kind of stuff to be sorted out.
    There's no rule saying that a pug can't work together the same way a premade does. It only takes someone taking lead, and the rest of the group actually following a strategy.

  3. #3
    Ascendant Fujitasix's Avatar
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    *Insert the age-old "then form your own premade" reply*

  4. #4
    Telaran
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    Shame on those people, for working together as a team.

  5. #5
    Telaran yaesir's Avatar
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    You'll never work as well in a PUG if you're not using Ventrillo/TS

    it doesnt work.

    The premades are in the same ventrillo, have been playing other games together for a long time and *know* how each other play.

    The PUGs stand no chance.
    Last edited by yaesir; 04-08-2011 at 03:25 PM.

  6. #6
    General of Telara
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    The problem with this idea is that premades will have to wait forever for another premade to form on the opposing side an queue in the same BG as they are queued for.

  7. #7
    General of Telara Sunspots's Avatar
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    The compromise is that you still get rewards even for a loss. What else do you want? THere is no possible system that can balance both sides in a Warfront, and quite honestly, that would make for long boring matches constantly, rather than unexpectedly which is more fun. Take your loss against a premade, take your rewards, then q again for a different warfront, whats the big deal?

  8. #8
    Plane Touched Rhinoplat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yaesir View Post
    PUGS are getting rolled.

    Hard.


    You see TRION, you dont allow a full premade (20 people) to go against another premade, but you allow a 5 man premade to go against a complete PUG group, and it isnt suprising that the PUG group gets rolled hard. Very very hard (500 to 8 points? 1000 to 23?) without even being able to capture anything.

    Coordination in a premade completely obliterates any hope of a PUG winning, the premades look and see whoever is doing the most damage or heals and in time make it so they are unable to do anything (literally i have seen people, including myself, stunnned from 100% to 0%).

    This isnt fun and it reflects on how long the warfronts are taking to pop right now. They are far longer than they were at the start of March (i remember the week of 03/07/2011 being a week that i didnt see a single warfront take longer than 2min to pop, and i was lvl50).

    This game needs to make it so that a complete PUG warfront goes against a complete PUG (no premades whatsoever), and a premade (group or raid) can ONLY go against another full premade.

    No more PUGs versus Premades trion, this has killed pvp in multiple games and people dont wait long for this kind of stuff to be sorted out.
    How about never let premades into warfronts and make them all pugs. That would be my vote.

    You want premade PvP, start pushing for an open world, different server mapset and ruleset, where the PvP is very guild centric. Then you can have premade guild PvP that actually means something.
    The best End Game is always player created and never dev scripted

  9. #9
    Plane Touched Plaything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yaesir View Post
    You'll never work as well in a PUG if you're not using Ventrillo/TS

    it doesnt work.

    The premades are in the same ventrillo, have been playing other games together for a long time and *know* how each other play.

    The PUGs stand no chance.
    I've ran premades with, and without vent. The premades with vent? No huge influx of info on the vent aside from "lawl, look, he's running". You just need a large group with orders. You can do so in a pug, make a macro to herd the sheep into not doing badly.

    Also, the people I've been pre-made-ing with? Never played with them before.

    Invalid argument is invalid.

    Just take charge, run the pug, you won't lose terribly unless you have a lot of stupid people within your group. If that is the case, too bad. It's unavoidable.

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  10. #10
    Rift Disciple
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sskzins View Post
    There's no rule saying that a pug can't work together the same way a premade does. It only takes someone taking lead, and the rest of the group actually following a strategy.
    There is also no rule saying just put together a basketball team from the local playground to go up against the lakers and win, it just takes coordination and someone to lead

    LOL

  11. #11
    Telaran yaesir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wenry View Post
    The problem with this idea is that premades will have to wait forever for another premade to form on the opposing side an queue in the same BG as they are queued for.

    It was their decision to go for a premade and take the advantage of being a coordinated team under one learship and even in the same ventrillo.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sunspots View Post
    The compromise is that you still get rewards even for a loss. What else do you want? THere is no possible system that can balance both sides in a Warfront, and quite honestly, that would make for long boring matches constantly, rather than unexpectedly which is more fun. Take your loss against a premade, take your rewards, then q again for a different warfront, whats the big deal?

    The problem is that premades dont just queue in once, they keep coming back. I have been going in warfronts for the past 3 hours against the SAME premade, and i have lost every single time because my group cant coordinate as well as a premade in ventrillo.

    I also noticed that each time i come back theres fewer and fewer people coming, and the warfront is taking longer and longer to pop.

    Like i said what i want is PUGs vs PUGs and Premades vs Premades ONLY, no Premades vs PUGs because the pugs stand no chance and the premades will come back and back and back until they decide to log off because they have no chance of losing.

    There will always be more PUGs than premades and premades should take longer to get in a warfront but thats the price they pay for having a better team composition (with HEALERS!!!!!) and coordination (Ventrilo!) than the PUGs that are lucky if they get a healer or two, not even going to talk about coordination.

  12. #12
    Telaran yaesir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DJahy View Post
    There is also no rule saying just put together a basketball team from the local playground to go up against the lakers and win, it just takes coordination and someone to lead

    LOL
    This is what i'm talking about.

    THIS is what is killing warfronts and its making them take longer and longer to pop with fewer and fewer people coming back.

  13. #13
    Plane Touched Plaything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yaesir View Post
    It was their decision to go for a premade and take the advantage of being a coordinated team under one learship and even in the same ventrillo.




    The problem is that premades dont just queue in once, they keep coming back. I have been going in warfronts for the past 3 hours against the SAME premade, and i have lost every single time because my group cant coordinate as well as a premade in ventrillo.

    I also noticed that each time i come back theres fewer and fewer people coming, and the warfront is taking longer and longer to pop.

    Like i said what i want is PUGs vs PUGs and Premades vs Premades ONLY, no Premades vs PUGs because the pugs stand no chance and the premades will come back and back and back until they decide to log off because they have no chance of losing.

    There will always be more PUGs than premades and premades should take longer to get in a warfront but thats the price they pay for having a better team composition (with HEALERS!!!!!) and coordination (Ventrilo!) than the PUGs that are lucky if they get a healer or two, not even going to talk about coordination.
    Warfronts are not so intense that they need massive coordination. In all honesty, a pug can combat a premade if people would just bleemin' talk about what's going on. "Giant man with axe heading for the farm of farm-ery, requesting backup preese" would save losing points, flags, etc. Take port scion for example- if you beat the sheepies into not rinkydinking below bridge and taking the church, you have a fighting chance. Make macros, spam em a wee bit, beat the sheepies into usefullness.

    <3
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  14. #14
    Sword of Telara corrin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Plaything View Post
    I've ran premades with, and without vent. The premades with vent? No huge influx of info on the vent aside from "lawl, look, he's running". You just need a large group with orders. You can do so in a pug, make a macro to herd the sheep into not doing badly.

    Also, the people I've been pre-made-ing with? Never played with them before.

    Invalid argument is invalid.

    Just take charge, run the pug, you won't lose terribly unless you have a lot of stupid people within your group. If that is the case, too bad. It's unavoidable.
    Emphatically agree.

    OP, you're basically trying to punish people for being good. ANYONE that gets into a PUG has an equal chance of being one of those pre-made leetists. They just need to get other people into it, and voila, pre-made. Unfortunately, people are usually too lazy or too self-centered to even bother. "Screw you noob, I know what I'm doing" seems to be the most-heard line in every WF I join. Granted, these are usually the same people who think Black Garden is a FFA, or they run the fang to the spawn area.

    I used to do pre-mades in WoW. Had a blast. Bunch of random people I knew nowhere else but in BGs. We didn't always win, but we DID always have fun. Once my guild gets big enough, I plan on doing this in Rift as well. For the record, I've never set foot (voice?) in vent, or any other program...I really hate the way guys react when they listen to or take orders from a woman.

    On a similar but separate note, I love laughing at the people that complain about twinks. They took the time and effort to get the gear/skill/etc to make them twinks in the first place, and you're complaining? THEY are going to stay in their bracket, whereas you will eventually outlevel them and get to THE most over-twinked level: 50. Fresh 50s don't stand a snowball's chance in hell against someone in full Rank gear. Don't care how skilled you are. But this is perfectly ok, because they're not really twinks...Amirite?

  15. #15
    Plane Touched Plaything's Avatar
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    Side-note;

    I've roflstomped defiant premades in black garden at least a dozen times, you just need to swap roles accordingly and inform others if the group needs more healers, less tanks, more ranged dps, more stealthers, more CC, less CC, more pinatas, etc.

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    Merintho- Lotham (PvP)

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