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Thread: LFR TQF not working

  1. #16
    Champion of Telara Ongar's Avatar
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    Its better if an encounter has 4 mechanics only that do matter, than 11 where you can ignore most -or- they get trivialized with addons, macros, ui optimizations.

    If the visual readibilty of an encounter is bad, people that dont know how to deal with it, wont get any better over time. Thats something we saw a lot in NT where raid teams had to brute force/combat rez through overgeared/-nerfed raids.

    If the visual language is there people will eventually get the execution of the mechanics right at some point. OFC everyone "at their pace". While team A may take 3 tries, team B may take 50 and team C 300 tries.

  2. #17
    Plane Touched
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deeew View Post
    You have two mechanics.. Ones you have to do, and ones you can ignore.

    If they are going to focus on "mechanics" and not "dps/hps", then these mechanics need to dev-kill and unavoidable dmg that will kill you. What this becomes is a possible "very unforgiving" mechanic that will just destroy the casuals. If mechanics aren't dev-kills, then you just out gear it or heal thru the dmg and ignore mechanics. This becomes very boring and trivial.

    So how do you make fights "mechanic oriented" while not making them unforgiving to noobs and trivial to players who know how to dodge red circles?

    Gluk!

    not to mention if you make all mechanics one shots and un-ignorable doesn't gear itself become meaningless?

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobtheskull View Post
    not to mention if you make all mechanics one shots and un-ignorable doesn't gear itself become meaningless?
    That's what DPS checks and healing checks were for... but we saw what happened to those.

    Gear is basically meaningless in Rift now anyways.
    Lyrine@Deepwood <-Virus->
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  4. #19
    Prophet of Telara
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deeew View Post
    You have two mechanics.. Ones you have to do, and ones you can ignore.

    If they are going to focus on "mechanics" and not "dps/hps", then these mechanics need to dev-kill and unavoidable dmg that will kill you. What this becomes is a possible "very unforgiving" mechanic that will just destroy the casuals. If mechanics aren't dev-kills, then you just out gear it or heal thru the dmg and ignore mechanics. This becomes very boring and trivial.

    So how do you make fights "mechanic oriented" while not making them unforgiving to noobs and trivial to players who know how to dodge red circles?

    Gluk!
    Without two levels of raiding I can't see it working at all.

    Either LFR will fail big time because the Boss will be tuned for the good players so to speak.

    Or LFR it tuned to the masses and the "good" players just murders in in 5 minutes.

    LFR should drop gear let's say 25% less stats over a normal raid. LFR gear should be better than 5 man gear but not so call normal raid gear.

    I can't see this working if it's the same. One is either to easy. Or one is either to hard.

    Now I guess if Trion does what it should do with HM. They are tuned so lightly that's even 1 tiny mistake it a wipe. This let's Little Raider Boy have his fun. Give him a upgrade piece (a chance of) to use on gear. Not a 100% chance. This keeps the Raid Guilds raiding trying to get that piece to upgrade their gear.

    It leaves LFR and "normal" Raids alone.

    It's what HM should be. Tuned tighter than a Nun's........... Well you know

  5. #20
    Prophet of Telara
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jotunn View Post
    The problem is, if we look back at past raids and their mechanics, that it's either black or white. You ignore the mechanic cuse it doesn't do much or enough, or you do it, but most fall into the first category. We had that happenening inside the same tear even if memory serves me right (Fionn beeing the last example). Mechanics beeing punishing at start, but with more gear and/or practice could be ignored.

    Considering the the whole expansion is as far away form beeing ballanced alltoghether as it can be, i'm quite curious how they would achieve that.
    But every MMO is like that. WoW to Rift.

    Once you get the gear the Boss is very easy. But if the mechanic is a wipe no matter the gear level......

    AoE always gets easier the more gear you get.

    Fire Boss in ID comes to mind. Once you out geared it, it didn't matter what you did you'd win. In the beginning any mistake was a wipe. After that it really didn't matter much.

  6. #21
    Prophet of Telara
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ongar View Post
    Its better if an encounter has 4 mechanics only that do matter, than 11 where you can ignore most -or- they get trivialized with addons, macros, ui optimizations.

    If the visual readibilty of an encounter is bad, people that dont know how to deal with it, wont get any better over time. Thats something we saw a lot in NT where raid teams had to brute force/combat rez through overgeared/-nerfed raids.

    If the visual language is there people will eventually get the execution of the mechanics right at some point. OFC everyone "at their pace". While team A may take 3 tries, team B may take 50 and team C 300 tries.
    I know people to this day that can't do the second Boss in GP. It tells you what to do but they still fail. It tells you to point. Not real hard. But boy people couldn't do it. Just turn around. But they still can't.

    As the say you can't help stupid. But MMOs now have to be designed around them.

    In WoW last Boss in Nax. Just get out of a void that appears under you feet. We had a guy that died EVERY single time to it. And it didn't matter that we ran the raid every week for it seemed like years. If it appeared under his feet he was dead. Was sadly really. But it's life in MMOs then and now.

    Then only thing people seem to run out of is if they should be standing in it

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