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Thread: Yo what's up with these insane raid pug requirements?

  1. #1
    Shadowlander Kythis's Avatar
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    Default Yo what's up with these insane raid pug requirements?

    Basically needing one-hundred EXTRA hit than is required which comes off as needing to outgear the raid you're even attempting to partake in. Reeks of gearscore-esque nonsense and seems to become a growing trend in themepark MMOs these days. I haven't played in almost a year and my gear sure isn't the best but I've got 436 Hit and ran TDQ before (which is easy as hell; 10mans in MMOs are usually only a step higher than experts) along with some brief EE/FT first two bosses of both. Now I can't even whisper somebody for a TDQ or IDH unless I have 500 Hit.

    Don't get me wrong; I'm not trying to run T2 raids or any of that. Only pugging T1 stuff. Hell, I used to do weekly Naxx10 full clears without so much as checking gear while also completing Heigan with only 2-3 others alive tops. Legitimate concern: I'm assuming these puggers are likely not very good at raid mechanics and looking to be carried with their insane requirements.

    Just makes me frustrated that this is a natural common occurrence.

  2. #2
    Ascendant Boase's Avatar
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    Join a guild is the only response.


    Everyone hates pugging so they want to overgear it and get it done as fast and easily as possible.
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  3. #3
    Ascendant
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    I've told people for ages that setting hit requirements is a really poor way to gauge skill level.

    Ask someone for their dummy parses, on the other hand, and you can get a better idea for how they'll do in a raid environment along with their DPS compared to their gear.

    I've only run pug raids a few times, and in each instance I don't say "Must have 520 hit." I'll say "must parse 18k+ on the dummy."

  4. #4
    Shadowlander Kythis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boase View Post
    Join a guild is the only response.


    Everyone hates pugging so they want to overgear it and get it done as fast and easily as possible.
    I'm in one, just trying to get mine done for the week. I prefer pugging as opposed to having a set schedule, regardless. Silly when people want rapid and/or hard-mode achievements linked first. You gotta do the instances to do the instances; it's all a paradox.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahov View Post
    I've told people for ages that setting hit requirements is a really poor way to gauge skill level.

    Ask someone for their dummy parses, on the other hand, and you can get a better idea for how they'll do in a raid environment along with their DPS compared to their gear.

    I've only run pug raids a few times, and in each instance I don't say "Must have 520 hit." I'll say "must parse 18k+ on the dummy."
    Yeah, I've seen tons of people in great gear fail easy mechanics over the years. Sure, gear is important but it isn't the end-all, be-all yet not everybody seems to realize that.

  5. #5
    Rift Chaser Aielma's Avatar
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    I agree that it's annoying that there are some groups that do ask for high amounts of hit on easy T1 bosses. Although I haven't (I ask for the achieve), I can understand why - people want to go quickly and hit usually shows what level of content you are raiding in. Gear does not equal skill but it's an easy filter. It's like when you look at 100 resumes for a job posting for someone right out of college and filter based on a certain GPA (don't overthink my example. I'm sure there are flaws to it lol). Agreed with people who posted about joining a guild but if that isn't an interest, there are still plenty of pugs out there that don't have those hit requirements. You could always just hope they don't gear check

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahov View Post
    I've only run pug raids a few times, and in each instance I don't say "Must have 520 hit." I'll say "must parse 18k+ on the dummy."
    Sure, I agree that hit doesn't mean anything especially in this cash shop world. However, are you going to watch every pug parse on a dummy? Most don't even know what they parse. Or maybe you'll kick after the first boss if they don't meet the requirement? It's a lot harder to fill a spot after a boss is dead. In principle it's a good idea but I'm not convinced in practice.

  6. #6
    Rift Disciple BittyMagnet's Avatar
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    Sure Hit ≠ Skill, but 99% of the time a person with 100 hit over the instance requirement vs a person in blues barely having the minimum hit, the person with the xtra hit will out dps the minimum hit person.

    Gear doesn't show skill necessarily but it shows experience playing that toon. With the new ability to buy high level gear from the store we might see some changes but most likely not.

    To the OP, it kinda sounds like your mad that people are not willing to carry as much as in the past. But you can always just run your own pug's if you actually have the experience in that instance.
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    Rift Chaser Zetsuu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ahov View Post
    I've told people for ages that setting hit requirements is a really poor way to gauge skill level.

    Ask someone for their dummy parses, on the other hand, and you can get a better idea for how they'll do in a raid environment along with their DPS compared to their gear.

    I've only run pug raids a few times, and in each instance I don't say "Must have 520 hit." I'll say "must parse 18k+ on the dummy."
    Fresh level 60 who have playing the game for 2 weeks only can buy T2 gear with Credit and join those pugs who messure people by HIT and fail in every mechanic with poor dps , when someone played the game for 2 years and skillful enogh to join but he doesnt have enogh hit and can do enogh dps to clear the instance .
    So yea, hit requirment isnt the right way to get people for pugs !
    I keel Em Too Fast !

  8. #8
    RIFT Guide Writer Nynja's Avatar
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    I know that 90% of the population cant play the game properly even after 2 years. The only requirement that works for me is a whitelist.ppl i know of that are decent
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  9. #9
    Rift Chaser Yeowang's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zetsuu View Post
    Fresh level 60 who have playing the game for 2 weeks only can buy T2 gear with Credit and join those pugs who messure people by HIT and fail in every mechanic with poor dps , when someone played the game for 2 years and skillful enogh to join but he doesnt have enogh hit and can do enogh dps to clear the instance .
    So yea, hit requirment isnt the right way to get people for pugs !
    ^
    That's the logic right there.

  10. #10
    Shadowlander Kythis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BittyMagnet View Post
    Sure Hit ≠ Skill, but 99% of the time a person with 100 hit over the instance requirement vs a person in blues barely having the minimum hit, the person with the xtra hit will out dps the minimum hit person.

    Gear doesn't show skill necessarily but it shows experience playing that toon. With the new ability to buy high level gear from the store we might see some changes but most likely not.

    To the OP, it kinda sounds like your mad that people are not willing to carry as much as in the past. But you can always just run your own pug's if you actually have the experience in that instance.
    You missed the entire point of the post and inferred your own opinion. That takes talent.

  11. #11
    RIFT Guide Writer NotTrev's Avatar
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    I think you're generalizing a bit when you portray all pugs this way. The reason you see this style of recruitment, at all, for pugs is because there are people that have been playing this game for a year plus straight while you had been taking time off to play whichever game had your attention. There are others, like you, too though. Basically, different people want different things.

    Those that farmed 9/9FTEE for 8months(and then subsequently also cleared T2) as a guild do not want a headache when they're going to pug it at this stage, so they seek insurance. Every pug is a gamble, but at least requiring a higher requirement(either hit or parses) helps lessen that gamble. Asking for achieves(your paradox) helps insure that they know the mechanics of all of the bosses. These runs aren't for you; you're neither contributing to the run being significantly easier(being appropriately geared rather than over geared, no offense) nor do you know the later fights.

    Those that play very casually, are just returning or just starting can find and join those runs that don't require such gear or acheivements; typically progression runs partially filled by smaller guilds or perhaps an alt run. These are what you're looking for.

    There are exceptions, of course, sometimes a t2 guild will do ft/ee on the weekend and need 5 random pugs to fill, which is an easy carry. There's also PDKPs that will bring you along, as long as you fill their pockets with plat.

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  12. #12
    Shadowlander
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    Fast clears with vials > Slow clears with vials.
    Get more bang for my buck or get less bang for my buck?

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    Quote Originally Posted by BittyMagnet View Post
    To the OP, it kinda sounds like your mad that people are not willing to carry as much as in the past. But you can always just run your own pug's if you actually have the experience in that instance.
    Sure. People who want to run T1-instances and have not 500+ hit are leechers. Or those who cannot offer the required archivements of already cleared the instance. Had the same discussion months before, with the same opinions thrown into the discussion.

    First: Its pretty nonsense to resume from hit to skill. I know enough players in relics not being able to play properly.
    Second: I know people in blue/purple gear that beat T1,5 equipped players in dps or healing - because they can.
    Third: Not all who want people with 500+ hit have the same values! They only want to avoid the leechers whispering. I know it, because i have more than 500 hit and inspected then the others in the raid...
    Fourth: It is pretty impertinently to look for players for SLE (dungenons!) with minimum 500 hit! I thought it would be mistakes... no, it isn't!
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  14. #14
    Ascendant Onebutton's Avatar
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    If you just randomly take any player with the achievement listed, you could end up spending two hours in TDQ. The main reason I think today is because of the vials running or because people are now use to the Rapid runs which take 20-25 min or so. So using the 520+ is at least some guideline to use for those players. It does mean something, most of the time, not all the time, but better than random nothings.

    To the OP. I would start your own group, or run with your own guild then to avoid the frustration of this... Spending an hour+ in TDQ with friends is just fine
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  15. #15
    Shadowlander Kythis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NotTrev View Post
    I think you're generalizing a bit when you portray all pugs this way. The reason you see this style of recruitment, at all, for pugs is because there are people that have been playing this game for a year plus straight while you had been taking time off to play whichever game had your attention. There are others, like you, too though. Basically, different people want different things.

    Those that farmed 9/9FTEE for 8months(and then subsequently also cleared T2) as a guild do not want a headache when they're going to pug it at this stage, so they seek insurance. Every pug is a gamble, but at least requiring a higher requirement(either hit or parses) helps lessen that gamble. Asking for achieves(your paradox) helps insure that they know the mechanics of all of the bosses. These runs aren't for you; you're neither contributing to the run being significantly easier(being appropriately geared rather than over geared, no offense) nor do you know the later fights.

    Those that play very casually, are just returning or just starting can find and join those runs that don't require such gear or acheivements; typically progression runs partially filled by smaller guilds or perhaps an alt run. These are what you're looking for.

    There are exceptions, of course, sometimes a t2 guild will do ft/ee on the weekend and need 5 random pugs to fill, which is an easy carry. There's also PDKPs that will bring you along, as long as you fill their pockets with plat.
    Yes. In a perfect ideal world, having the achievements required = knowing the mechanics, among other things. However, that is not the case in the majority of instances.

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