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Thread: Improving healer quality of life

  1. #1
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    Default Improving healer quality of life

    So I wanted to put this out for community discussion. I fully expect to get a bunch of L2P responses, but I'm just looking to get a discussion started.

    Healing is the hardest role to fill, only two classes can fill it. To top it off, healing is incredibly stressful, there's more damage, the damage is very spiky, lots of cleanses are needed, and the damage is a mix of both raid a tank damage. Storm Legion made tanking much easier (don't stand in the red), and DPS got more complex so those are both well balanced. Healing is a whole other beast, its inherently unpredictable, and you still have to deal with mechanics.

    As a guild leader, I find us continually short of good healers, and it seems like this is true across most guilds. Almost every guild is looking for 1-2 more good healers, especially clerics.

    Making things even worse, the role situation is a disaster. You can't stack chloro's, and the cleric roles are incredibly unique. Sentinel is basically needed to heal experts, but is the least used is raids. Purifier is almost mandatory (due to spiky raid damage), Defiler is almost mandatory (high tank damage), Warden may be needed for raid healing. A good cleric healer, needs to carry 4 roles and excel at all of them. Needless to say, most clerics, especially casual players don't do this. Putting together a raid composition is a nightmare, because you need to make sure you have the CORRECT mix of clerics.

    I don't want nerfed encounters, I just want to be able to not have the success of failure of an entire encounter depends on exactly which clerics log in.

    What can be done to encourage more healers, reduce their overall stress and encourage more healers?
    ---------------------------------------------
    Caelem -- Warrior Tank/DPS
    Carinae -- Mage Alt
    Greybriar -- <Last Attempt> 9/9 T1, 2/4 GA, 1/4 IG, 1/5 PBB

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    Sword of Telara meoka2368's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carinae View Post
    I fully expect to get a bunch of L2P responses...
    http://www.l2pnoob.org/
    Do it. Really. You'll be glad you did.

    You can't stack chloro's
    You can use to to two without much issue.

    Sentinel is basically needed to heal experts
    I've solo healed experts (5-man) as an under geared Chloro.

    I just want to be able to not have the success of failure of an entire encounter depends on exactly which clerics log in.
    Stop forgetting your mages.

    What can be done to encourage more healers, reduce their overall stress and encourage more healers?
    As a healer, there's a couple of simple things that make things easier (or in some cases, just plain easy) comes down to how the other players work in the group.
    If the tank only pulls what he can handle, and the dps not pulling things themselves.
    That's it.

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    Rift Disciple Bubbaz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carinae View Post
    Healing is a whole other beast, its inherently unpredictable, and you still have to deal with mechanics.

    A good cleric healer, needs to carry 4 roles and excel at all of them.

    you need to make sure you have the CORRECT mix of clerics.

    What can be done to encourage more healers, reduce their overall stress and encourage more healers?
    Cleric healer perspective:

    Healing in raids is usually very much predictable. All the raid damage comes from casts/ mechanics, so a healer should know when damage is coming. If the raid damage is random, it's very small hits, or its not constant.

    A healer has to know fight mechanics for his own survival, but also for executing his role right.


    You also mention the amount of healing specs clerics have. Instead of having to learn them all, you should tell your fellow clerics in the guild to learn 1-3specs healing specs for raid. The fewer specs they have to play, the better they learn them.

    I always carry warden, sentinel and purifier specs. I never used sentinel in a raidboss encounter. I played warden trough FT/EE progression and only had to use Purifier in one of the new HM bosses.

    Having to play one healing spec on a progression boss, and then another spec on the same boss next week means you have to learn the encounter all over again.
    Compare tank healer and aoe healer on twins fight for example. As AOE healer you only have to focus on "Proximity Shock" casts and occasional random damage when someone gets hit by floor stuff. As a tank healer you have to heal multiple tanks, rotate cooldowns on certain points and whatnot (never actually tankhealed this)


    In short: Having to learn fewer specs reduces the stress a healer has. He can then learn one aspect of the fight, and therefore maximize his output according to what the fight requires. On other fights he then is able to alter the skills he learned previously, instead of playing whole different spec, having to focus on new soul AND a new fight.

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    There's plenty of Defiler guides (although I don't like any of the public ones), I have a Warden and Purifier guide in my sig, and I have a Chloromancer guide there as well for your guild's reference.

    Mages are actually the most widespread healer (or should be, if you're not using them). They are the ideal tank-healer and raid-healer; 2 is the minimum run on any encounter, and on many you should run 3 chloros.

    Contrary to what you think right now, encounters are not designed around clerics. They are designed around chloros.
    Last edited by Ahov; 03-09-2013 at 11:45 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bubbaz View Post
    Cleric healer perspective:

    Healing in raids is usually very much predictable. All the raid damage comes from casts/ mechanics, so a healer should know when damage is coming. If the raid damage is random, it's very small hits, or its not constant.

    A healer has to know fight mechanics for his own survival, but also for executing his role right.
    I agree completely. The problem comes from the healers needing to know all of the tanks mechanics, raid mechanics, watch player health (who didn't get out of the stupid fast enough), watch boss casts. Simply put, no other role requires nearly that amount of attention.
    ---------------------------------------------
    Caelem -- Warrior Tank/DPS
    Carinae -- Mage Alt
    Greybriar -- <Last Attempt> 9/9 T1, 2/4 GA, 1/4 IG, 1/5 PBB

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ahov View Post
    There's plenty of Defiler guides (although I don't like any of the public ones), I have a Warden and Purifier guide in my sig, and I have a Chloromancer guide there as well for your guild's reference.

    Mages are actually the most widespread healer (or should be, if you're not using them). They are the ideal tank-healer and raid-healer; 2 is the minimum run on any encounter, and on many you should run 3 chloros.
    The guides tend to be very good, the problem is a lot of players don't actually read them. They play Sentinel in Experts, then hit raid content and are useless.

    Chloro's are awesome (we typically run 3), but they can't replace a purifier or defiler.
    ---------------------------------------------
    Caelem -- Warrior Tank/DPS
    Carinae -- Mage Alt
    Greybriar -- <Last Attempt> 9/9 T1, 2/4 GA, 1/4 IG, 1/5 PBB

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    One other quick comment:
    I would really prefer this not to degenerate into a L2P suggestions thread.

    Simply, what role is your guild currently having the most trouble filling? I'm betting its healers.

    Taken on a small-scale, healing is fine. But from a macro-perspective, why aren't there more healers? What can be done to develop/encourage people to heal.
    ---------------------------------------------
    Caelem -- Warrior Tank/DPS
    Carinae -- Mage Alt
    Greybriar -- <Last Attempt> 9/9 T1, 2/4 GA, 1/4 IG, 1/5 PBB

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carinae View Post
    The guides tend to be very good, the problem is a lot of players don't actually read them. They play Sentinel in Experts, then hit raid content and are useless.

    Chloro's are awesome (we typically run 3), but they can't replace a purifier or defiler.
    Well if your clerics are willing to ask for help, they can PM me questions here or ask me in-game (Ahov@Shatterbone)
    Last edited by Ahov; 03-09-2013 at 12:00 PM.

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    Rift Disciple Bubbaz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carinae View Post
    One other quick comment:
    I would really prefer this not to degenerate into a L2P suggestions thread.

    Simply, what role is your guild currently having the most trouble filling? I'm betting its healers.

    Taken on a small-scale, healing is fine. But from a macro-perspective, why aren't there more healers? What can be done to develop/encourage people to heal.
    TBH, usually it is l2p issue.

    As healers are supposed to watch party health, react to it, manage their cooldowns and avoid encounter mechanics, all other roles are also having equal burden.

    Tanks have to know avoidable mechanics, make sure they survive, make sure boss is positioned, move the boss, interrupt, purge

    DPS is also usually hard. As you have to focus to your complex rotation, you have to make sure you dont die, also purge and interrupt duties are for DPSers usually.


    Don't really have other ideas about 'encouragin' ppl to heal other than saying it's not actually as complex as you just made it sound.

    for questions you can find me @blightweald

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    Healing is always the hardest role in any MMO, mostly because you have to be proactive instead of reactive; as a healer you need to know (or guess) when the boss' special attack is coming so you can make sure people are topped off so they won't get oneshot, or put up shields/reduction to reduce the damage, as well as the general "Oh somebody stood in fire. Let me heal them up" scenarios. That's a lot of pressure and foresight that one needs to have, and it's also the most unforgiving role in group content and the one that people are least willing to be patient with.

    I've tanked in other MMOs and a bit in Rift and sometimes having to know everything and time everything gets to be too much; I can only imagine how much worse it must be for healers, and it's part of why I never want to heal (and part of why I sidelined my Cleric, so there would never be a chance I was asked to heal).
    Vaydron @ Threesprings

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    Yea tbh this isnt anything brand new or unique to RIFT. Healing is by far the hardest role to fill in any MMO.

    I carry basically every raiding role in the game (with the exception of tank). Shaman, Inq, Sent, Warden, Puri, Defiler (or hybrid). I pride myself on being a flexible cleric who can be plugged in where needed with almost any spec thats needed.

    But ill say that ive noticed it becoming more and more difficult over the course of RIFT's development to be a flexible cleric and still perform to the highest level in each spec. This is because as bubba said... "Having to play one healing spec on a progression boss, and then another spec on the same boss next week means you have to learn the encounter all over again. "

    That honestly hits the nail on the head when it comes to clerics. Most of our roles (especially healing roles) are incredibly specialized. And with the way fights are designed in RIFT, its more about knowing whats coming and your reaction. That reaction can be vastly different depending on your role in the fight. Its blatantly obvious with healers, less obvious with dps. And its only been getting worse with the push away from hybrids and into 61 point builds.

    The other problem with relation to clerics, is that many clerics chose the class because it was flexible in what it could do. I chose it because i played a healer and then a range dps in my last 2 MMO's. I wanted to be able to do both. Some clerics chose the class just to heal this is true. But i would argue not all that many went that direction. This means it can be frustrating to be pigeonholed into JUST healing, and because of that someone may not perform as solid as a healer as someone who spends 24/7 healing.

    I'm starting to ramble, but ill simply end by saying.... Trion is pushing clerics into very specialized roles with little to no flexibility. Its one of the primary reasons Chloros are such an important part of EVERY fight, where as clerics parts or roles in fights are in constant flux.

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    I believe the problem is the community not really taking the "support" role as seriously as they should. The support role is supposed to help the healer do its job but most of the community doesnt take it seriously plus trion hasnt really put much effort into builing souls to perform the role. In my opinion it should be the supports job should be to interupt, buff, debuff, and back up heal and combat rez. The support should be able to do all these to but not well enough to replace the healer but to take enough pressure off the healer to make his role easier and more defined.

    Support feels like a wasted undefined role trion needs to get the souls to really show what the role is all about. I also think the defiler would be a better supporter than a healer. Not that its not currently a good healer it just sounds better as a supporter.

  13. #13
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    Weird, I have totally different opinion. The dmg is 99% predictable. Most abilities hit same amount everytime, that makes the healing very predictable once you know the fight.


    Healing in nutshell:
    First step: Learn the strong points of each spec/classes.
    Second step: Learn the boss abilities...especially the cast ones and how much each hit for...when the ability comes.
    Third step: After you know the fight and abilities---> find right compination of healers to deal with dmg...think the strong points and weak points you figured in step 1.
    Fourth: Assign healers according to step 3 and execute the fight properly...keep track of boss abilities, people failing stuff...everything which affects incoming dmg and then react to it with proper abilities.

    I don't understand how this process differs from dps process at all, also I dont understand what makes it hard when the process is the same.
    Last edited by ReveBeck; 03-09-2013 at 08:29 PM.
    Ambroo- Apotheosys

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    General of Telara Kriptini's Avatar
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    Purifiers really aren't that useful... they have to spend all of their GCDs raid-shielding. There's no fun (or usefulness) in that.
    Last edited by Kriptini; 03-09-2013 at 08:47 PM.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kriptini View Post
    Purifiers really aren't that useful... they have to spend all of their GCDs raid-shielding. There's no fun (or usefulness) in that.
    there is a lot of usefulness to the shieldbot, but very little fun.
    Undecided! P90 Cleric | 9/9 FT-EE | 4/4 GA | 3/3 IG | 5/5 PB | BoB 2/4

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