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Thread: Zombie Tanking Kain the Reaper

  1. #1
    Telaran
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    Default Zombie Tanking Kain the Reaper

    Hi all,

    I'm the main tank of a guild currently progressing on Kain and I have a quick concern that I was hoping you all could clear up.

    Recently we found that tanking Kain as a zombie has certain advantages. We tried a strategy in which the tanks get intentionally get zombified. We did not end up getting the kill, but heals were noticeably more stable.

    Since that night, concerns have been raised that this strategy is an exploit. I was wondering what others in the raiding community think about this.

    It just doesn't FEEL like an exploit to me. Sure, it makes tank healing a lot less of an issue. But it doesn't completely trivialize or remove a mechanic. The tanks can still die very easily if they aren't paying attention, and there is a 4-5 second gap between zombifications where the tanks can get wrecked by a Life Bane if the healers fall asleep. The mechanic seems to fit well into the flavor of the encounter; it makes a lot of sense in a way.

    Still, I don't want our first Kain kill to be attributable to an exploit. We did not use this strategy during our progression attempts tonight, and we won't return to it unless I am satisfied that it's intended. I think it's a very cool mechanic, so I hope that it is intended.

    So what do you guys think? Zombie tanking Kain - exploit or not?

  2. #2
    Ascendant
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nevsa View Post
    Hi all,

    I'm the main tank of a guild currently progressing on Kain and I have a quick concern that I was hoping you all could clear up.

    Recently we found that tanking Kain as a zombie has certain advantages. We tried a strategy in which the tanks get intentionally get zombified. We did not end up getting the kill, but heals were noticeably more stable.

    Since that night, concerns have been raised that this strategy is an exploit. I was wondering what others in the raiding community think about this.

    It just doesn't FEEL like an exploit to me. Sure, it makes tank healing a lot less of an issue. But it doesn't completely trivialize or remove a mechanic. The tanks can still die very easily if they aren't paying attention, and there is a 4-5 second gap between zombifications where the tanks can get wrecked by a Life Bane if the healers fall asleep. The mechanic seems to fit well into the flavor of the encounter; it makes a lot of sense in a way.

    Still, I don't want our first Kain kill to be attributable to an exploit. We did not use this strategy during our progression attempts tonight, and we won't return to it unless I am satisfied that it's intended. I think it's a very cool mechanic, so I hope that it is intended.

    So what do you guys think? Zombie tanking Kain - exploit or not?
    I don't see how it's an exploit. By not dodging the mechanic, and then you get affected by it?

    Unintended, but it's not really circumvention.

  3. #3
    Prophet of Telara cwharland's Avatar
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    Devs know, it's fine.
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  4. #4
    Ascendant Techie Will's Avatar
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    Not an exploit, but as a tank I felt that strategy certainly made things a little more difficult for me. I just avoid the lanes all together now and use cool downs if we fall behind in healing at all, no big deal.


  5. #5
    Shield of Telara
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    Exploit? No. Adding RNG into the fight? Yes.
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  6. #6
    Rift Chaser
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    I've tanked this fight this way since our first kill. The only time I died was when the warrior I was designated to eat moved out for purple ****, he decided to stay out 20 feet away and channel charged pulse because he's a ****. By the time I realized what he was doing, it was too late to find another target and I got gibbed. Thanks Kaybye!
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  7. #7
    Shield of Telara Kaybriar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JorlynEndless View Post
    I've tanked this fight this way since our first kill. The only time I died was when the warrior I was designated to eat moved out for purple ****, he decided to stay out 20 feet away and channel charged pulse because he's a ****. By the time I realized what he was doing, it was too late to find another target and I got gibbed. Thanks Kaybye!
    It makes me uncomfortable when other dudes try to eat me.
    Last edited by Kaybriar; 02-21-2013 at 06:41 AM.
    Kaybye ~

  8. #8
    Champion of Telara Keilana's Avatar
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    Default Final outcome (for us)

    Hi guys,

    Thanks for the input everyone.

    We did send a petition on the 18th and got a definite response today. As per the development team, although it is not an intended tactic, no action is warranted against those who use it. However they do intend to fix it at some point in time, so that strategy is no longer possible.

    To that end, we will not use this particular strategy.
    "That which is beautiful is not always good, but that which is good is always beautiful."

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  9. #9
    RIFT Guide Writer Redcruxs's Avatar
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    If you're having problems getting gibbed by back to back life bane + auto attack then I recommend running a 61pt defiler. They are able to pull semi-decent DPS while the tank passively takes 30% less damage and has 6% higher HP.

    we just killed him this past week and we couldn't have done it without a defiler

  10. #10
    RIFT Guide Writer TheGrinnz's Avatar
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    As a zombie Kain's ability Life Bane does significantly less damage to you, this seems intended since you are a zombie and not alive. But we will have to see if it gets changed.

  11. #11
    Ascendant bitnine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keilana View Post
    To that end, we will not use this particular strategy.
    I think you need to do it that way at least one time after having the rest of your raid eat the food that changes them into zombies as well. Take a video, set it to "Thriller".

  12. #12
    RIFT Guide Writer TheGrinnz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bitnine View Post
    I think you need to do it that way at least one time after having the rest of your raid eat the food that changes them into zombies as well. Take a video, set it to "Thriller".
    We killed him yesterday as Deep Ones :P

    http://www.twitch.tv/grinnz/c/1950259

  13. #13
    Champion of Telara Keilana's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bitnine View Post
    I think you need to do it that way at least one time after having the rest of your raid eat the food that changes them into zombies as well. Take a video, set it to "Thriller".
    Awesome idea. We might have to make an exception, this once!
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  14. #14
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    So I have stupid question on Kain. We're just starting attempts again, and are clearly failing some mechanic, just not sure which one.

    We kill the bloodthieves, and Zath just fine. Bazial spawns, tank picks him up, then after about 10 seconds, there's an emote and a set of enraged adds spawn and insta-gib the tanks. Looking at video's we seem to be doing everything the same, but most guilds have 40+ sec to kill Baz. For us the second wave is spawning in under 20 sec.

    I'm 100% sure that the adds are not dying early.

    Possible issues:
    1) Tank getting him by exploding corpses? Does this make adds spawn?
    2) Tanking too close the ghostly adds and somehow activating them?
    3) Other missed mechanic?
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  15. #15
    Ascendant Ajax1114's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carinae View Post
    So I have stupid question on Kain. We're just starting attempts again, and are clearly failing some mechanic, just not sure which one.

    We kill the bloodthieves, and Zath just fine. Bazial spawns, tank picks him up, then after about 10 seconds, there's an emote and a set of enraged adds spawn and insta-gib the tanks. Looking at video's we seem to be doing everything the same, but most guilds have 40+ sec to kill Baz. For us the second wave is spawning in under 20 sec.

    I'm 100% sure that the adds are not dying early.

    Possible issues:
    1) Tank getting him by exploding corpses? Does this make adds spawn?
    2) Tanking too close the ghostly adds and somehow activating them?
    3) Other missed mechanic?
    Bloods could be dying late (if they don't die before Zath goes down, Baziel spawns enraged).

    Also, tanks could have the groups too close together. I'm not a tank but I believe it has to do with some of the adds blowing up when Zath dies - if the groups are too close, one set of explosions can affect another.

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