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Thread: What is wrong with Expert Vendor Gear?

  1. #1
    Telaran
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    Default What is wrong with Expert Vendor Gear?

    Hey Everyone

    I thought it was a bug in the Beta's, but it stil here..

    I am a Cleric and primary role is TANK, But I also DPS/Heal
    I have spent a considerable amount of time getting Infinity Stones and the 'tanking' gear, with about 4 items already upgraded once (Chest, Legs, Shield & Mace), with four more items planned to make the RAID Tier 1 requirements.

    I was planning on running experts & use the Slayer Marks to get DPS gear, however it seems several of the items can not be upgraded. This includes the Chest & Shoulders; which I planned to get DPS gear to replace the tanking gear with 'Toughness' on it.

    Problem is, the DPS gear items which can NOT be upgraded offer nothing of value; less or equal armor, less wisdom, less endurance, no toughness / block / dodge / parry (der!), BUT the only thing they offer for example; is a measly amount of Spell Power (+36).

    Interestingly enough, all first tier Expert DPS gear sucks compared to my current Tanking IS gear, BUT the items which can be upgraded, the upgraded item is good enough to use for DSP/Heals in RAIDs, except i need to replace at least the 4 items containing toughness.

    So between getting only 4 marks per LFG Expert & having only SOME of the gear upgradedable, i am now locked into being just a tank.

    Its going to take me 2-3 weeks to upgrade those other 4 items, and another 2 weeks if i want to upgrade every item (this is the first upgrade BTW) and if i want to upgrade 5 items to the third level (4x toughness + shield) will take about 2 months more on top.

    So its just not feasible to use IS to get the DPS set also.



    All this would be fixed with the following::
    1. make ALL Expert Vendor (Slayer Mark) gear upgradeable - see no reason it isnt already)
    2. make the final boss in experts 100% chance of dropping slayer mark
    3. make all other bossess in experts 50% chance of dropping slayer mark

    Points 2 & 3 provide an option and reason for doing experts outside of LFG.


    Anyway, the biggest part of this thread, is about why some items from the vendor can not be upgraded.

    EVERY World Vendor item can, EVERY Raid Vendor item can... but only SOME Expert Vendor items can...



    Thanks
    Last edited by Auraka Sith; 12-22-2012 at 09:18 PM.

  2. #2
    RIFT Guide Writer Muspel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Auraka Sith View Post
    Problem is, the DPS gear items which can NOT be upgraded offer nothing of value; less or equal armor, less wisdom, less endurance, no toughness / block / dodge / parry (der!), BUT the only thing they offer for example; is a measly amount of Spell Power (+36).
    Blue DPS gear is better than tanking gear for DPSing (and healing). That "measly amount of spellpower" makes that gear a significant upgrade. Armor, toughness, block, dodge, and parry are almost completely useless to DPS and healers. Endurance has some value, but you shouldn't wear tanking gear in order to get more, considering how much damage/healing output you'll lose.
    Last edited by Muspel; 12-22-2012 at 10:23 PM.

  3. #3
    Telaran
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    I was more concerned about the wisdom loss for the spellpower gain...

    for example the chest item... -22 wisdom, + 36 spell power (everything else is minus something)... So does that wisdom loss and spell power gain still make it worth it?


    But also, the main point was why are several of the items non-upgradeable??

    Surely either everything is upgradeable or nothing...??

  4. #4
    Telaran
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    wont allow me to edit.. oh well...

    to reply to the response, I can replace all my +32 endurance runes with Spell Power runes, and be in front Spell Power wise (on tanking gear), and yet still down Wisdom wise & spellpower (on DPS gear)....

    And its easier to get 3x runes then running 7 LFG's to get a single item (not to mention 3 items)


    BUT... the point is, if those several items could be upgradeable, this would not matter.... which is what this thread is meant to be about.. WHY CAN SOME ITEMS IN THE EXPERT VENDOR BE UPGRADED AND OTHER NOT???

    Thanks
    Last edited by Auraka Sith; 12-22-2012 at 10:45 PM.

  5. #5
    RIFT Guide Writer Muspel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Auraka Sith View Post
    for example the chest item... -22 wisdom, + 36 spell power (everything else is minus something)... So does that wisdom loss and spell power gain still make it worth it?
    Yes. Spell power is your best stat by a fairly significant margin. Wisdom also gives spell power, but you only get .75 SP per point of wisdom.

    Quote Originally Posted by Auraka Sith View Post
    BUT... the point is, if those several items could be upgradeable, this would not matter.... which is what this thread is meant to be about.. WHY CAN SOME ITEMS IN THE EXPERT VENDOR BE UPGRADED AND OTHER NOT???
    Because you already get gear from running experts. The point of dungeon mark gear is to supplement that and allow you to fill in some gaps in your gear, not to give you full raid BiS. Also, by leaving some gaps in the expert gear, it makes it so that there's some degree of incentive to use the World Gear merchant.

    Or you can just use blues in those slots until you get raid drops. You don't need full epics for either the 10-man or the first bosses of the 20-mans.

  6. #6
    Plane Touched kiralia's Avatar
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    What I still do not understand is why the dropped gear does not go towards the set bonuses, you say the mark gear is supposed to supplement the drops not the other way around but in that case why are the sets made from the mark gear and not from the drops?

    *EDIT
    By set bonuses I mean for the crystals
    Last edited by kiralia; 12-23-2012 at 10:23 AM.

  7. #7
    RIFT Guide Writer Muspel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kiralia View Post
    What I still do not understand is why the dropped gear does not go towards the set bonuses, you say the mark gear is supposed to supplement the drops not the other way around but in that case why are the sets made from the mark gear and not from the drops?

    *EDIT
    By set bonuses I mean for the crystals
    First off, I never said the supplementing didn't work both ways. Second, even if it didn't, this still wouldn't be contradictory.

  8. #8
    Champion actionvapor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Muspel View Post
    Also, by leaving some gaps in the expert gear, it makes it so that there's some degree of incentive to use the World Gear merchant.
    There's already incentive to use the World Gear merchant. Weapons, wands, totems and shields are only available from the WG merchant. And aside from those, Infinity Stones are required for the better lesser essences.

    OP's point seems valid, all the expert gear should be up-gradeable.
    Last edited by actionvapor; 12-24-2012 at 04:44 AM.

  9. #9
    RIFT Guide Writer Muspel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by actionvapor View Post
    There's already incentive to use the World Gear merchant. Weapons, wands, totems and shields are only available from the WG merchant. And aside from those, Infinity Stones are required for the better lesser essences.
    The difference being that epic weapons and offhands are available as dungeon drops. That means that the World Gear merchant is merely an alternate path to similar rewards. By contrast, the world gear merchant is the only way to get pre-raid epics in some slots, which means that you're encouraged to use them if you want to get the best gear before raiding.

  10. #10
    Shadowlander
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    Quote Originally Posted by Auraka Sith View Post
    I am a Cleric and primary role is TANK,

    I was planning on running experts & use the Slayer Marks to get DPS gear, however it seems several of the items can not be upgraded. This includes the Chest & Shoulders; which I planned to get DPS gear to replace the tanking gear with 'Toughness' on it.


    All this would be fixed with the following::
    1. make ALL Expert Vendor (Slayer Mark) gear upgradeable - see no reason it isnt already)
    2. make the final boss in experts 100% chance of dropping slayer mark
    3. make all other bossess in experts 50% chance of dropping slayer mark

    Points 2 & 3 provide an option and reason for doing experts outside of LFG.


    Anyway, the biggest part of this thread, is about why some items from the vendor can not be upgraded.

    EVERY World Vendor item can, EVERY Raid Vendor item can... but only SOME Expert Vendor items can...



    Thanks
    I'm a cleric tank also and I think you might have a few pieces of gear confused. The pieces that can't be upgraded are helm, chest, and belt and this is for ALL callings. The reason they made helm/belt is to encourage you to get the crafted pieces which are BiS for many callings/classes. Chest is to encourage you to use the World event merchant. For the experts, each class has epic legs/feet/hands/shoulders drop for each of their callings.

    1. See above explanation about crafting items.
    2. + 3. Trion is trying to artificially "gate" content by not making marks guaranteed drops. It used to be that the classic experts didn't drop the ID marks or the GMoA marks. Once the content has been out for a while, Trion will add the marks in so that more people can get geared up and see the content. With a limited number of people in there to begin with, it's easier to fix major bugs before they hit the general population and allows for a sense of "competition".

    It is silly that some pieces of gear can't be upgraded while others can but I believe this is designed so that crafters get some love and so that Trion's new upgrade system gets used. I believe it's also this way to try and keep the Infinity Stone count low for now since there isn't a PA dump option. Cheer up! Before long Trion will probably implement 2 and 3 but I don't see 1 happening for a while.

    EDIT: Also just saw the other post above me. Each class/calling has 2-3 "sets" of gear they can upgrade. Usually it's the tanking main hand from experts and the off-hand from World Gear. DPS/heal main hand from experts, off hand from world gear. DPS/heal 2hand from experts, ranged weapon from world gear. There are also Epic ranged weapons on the loot table to help fill out your main/off/ranged Epic slots.
    Last edited by Pandorian; 12-24-2012 at 08:32 AM.

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