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Thread: Why I love dungeons...

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    Prophet of Telara Neo Omni's Avatar
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    Default Why I love dungeons...

    Once I hit 50, I had a hard time moving on. I got used to ability leveling via trainer. Then all of a sudden that stopped and it was stat building via Planar Attunment.

    I thought I was on my way out....then I started dungeons.

    The reason I love dungeons is not for the dungeon itself, but the people.

    You get a random group of personalities and roles together in an enclosed world and all kinds of weirdness comes out. Though the dungeon may be the same, the experience is always different.

    I always play "support" because I like switching between dps and healing, and no one cares if I die. As for the main chaacters in a dungeon...

    Tanks: basically the leader of the group. Each tank is different. Some are nurturing...always asking if anyone needs to take a break or something. Always herding the group together.
    Some are indifferent and run off without looking back. Some organized in their tactics, some are all over the place. Some are authoritarian and will tell you how to play. Not how the dungeon is laid out, but what abilities to use/not use and what role to filll. Had one tank actually demand another player be tank.

    I liked the other player's response :"If I wanted to tank, I would have que'd as a tank."

    Then there are those groups where no one gets along and the kick vote prompt is constantly coming up during the game. I always vote NO...dammit people, get along.

    Healers: some healers take a great deal of pride in keeping the group alive. Some can be just plain possessive about it. No one dare heal anyone else...I got it all under control...sort of thing.

    All other members of the group revolve around these two main figures, and in a way they determine the personality of the group.

    The Experience:
    -Some groups are very chatty. Always commenting on one thing or another during the whole dungeon.
    -Some are constantly prompting you on what to expect next (I like those).


    -Some groups never say a word.

    -Some groups are constantly giving you your dps values to see how you measure up with your peers.

    -Some groups are just plain goof-offs and just want to have a good time and joke around.
    Those tend to die a lot in game....but they are fun and it's not uncommon for an impromptu dance off to start in the middle of a dungeon.

    -Some bicker over your Need/Greed choice and demand "so why do you need that?"
    My answer: does it matter? I try to be fair in my choices, but if I need something..I need something.

    Then there are those in a group that need to hurry up because they have a raid in 10 min. Those always make me laugh. If you know you have a Raid, why que up for a dungeon?

    The Rift dungeon experience can be good or bad, but no two are ever the same and that keeps the game interesting for me. My hope is that TRION will focus more on Dungeons and keep adding to them. I prefer them over war-fronts and instant adventures. Haven't really got into Chronicles yet, so we'll see how it goes.

    Feel free to post your dungeon experiences in this thread.

    Thanks for reading.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Neo Omni View Post
    -Some groups are constantly giving you your dps values to see how you measure up with your peers.

    -Some bicker over your Need/Greed choice and demand "so why do you need that?"
    My answer: does it matter? I try to be fair in my choices, but if I need something..I need something.

    Then there are those in a group that need to hurry up because they have a raid in 10 min. Those always make me laugh. If you know you have a Raid, why que up for a dungeon?
    Some groups post your DPS values to belittle you and show you how terrible you are and how awesome they are. I wouldn't give that a 10/10.

    If you are being questioned about your need, then probably you didn't need it. Not always the case cause some people are just idiots, but generally this holds true.

    They probably queued 30 minutes ago thinking "It can't possibly go so bad that it would take 40 minutes". Possibly they are used to guild runs that actually do only take 10 minutes . . . and if they bring that up they are what we call Elitist Jerks.
    Last edited by Traciatim; 03-26-2012 at 09:26 AM.

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    Prophet of Telara Neo Omni's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Traciatim View Post
    Some groups post your DPS values to belittle you and show you how terrible you are and how awesome they are. I wouldn't give that a 10/10.

    If you are being questioned about your need, then probably you didn't need it. Not always the case cause some people are just idiots, but generally this holds true.

    They probably queued 30 minutes ago thinking "It can't possibly go so bad that it would take 40 minutes". Possibly they are used to guild runs that actually do only take 10 minutes . . . and if they bring that up they are what we call Elitist Jerks.
    . <----was used sarcastically. As in, "Im showing you my dps."

    As for the need/greed thing. I can runebreak/salvage most anything for needed materials, so whether I actually use the item as an accessory or just for the material value, it doesn't really matter. I can still use it. Epic items especially break down into some rare stuff.
    Last edited by Neo Omni; 03-26-2012 at 09:30 AM.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Neo Omni View Post
    I can runebreak/salvage most anything for needed materials, so whether I actually use the item as an accessory or just for the material value, it doesn't really matter. I can still use it. Epic items especially break down into some rare stuff.
    That's why the greed button is there. Now you know why you are being called out.

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    Ascendant batou079's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Traciatim View Post
    That's why the greed button is there. Now you know why you are being called out.
    Sorry OP, but he is right. I agree with you about the variety and fun that random dungeon queuing brings... but i really really disagree with "needing" on an item because you "need" the materials that the item can break down into. That is not a very fair ideal for someone who seems bent on "people getting along".

    "Needing" an item is because you can literally equip the item for an upgrade in stats. Your character's skills, stats and effectiveness literally gets bumped up for gear upgrades. As such, the "need" roll is acceptable. In the same note, needing an item specifically to break it down while any other player may actually be able to equip it for a tangeable upgrade is totally selfish. Crafting materials always ALWAYS take a back seat to physical gear upgrades. If no one needs it, and they all greed it, it is because they also feel they could simply use it for materials or vendor gold. This is fair, and this is what you are being called out for.

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    Rift Disciple Hyacinth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Traciatim View Post
    That's why the greed button is there. Now you know why you are being called out.
    Also agreed. I like crafting as much as the next person, and yes those rare materials are hard to find, but a great many MMORPG players across multiple games would put your reasons for wanting the item into the "greed" category. It's basically on the same level of the "need" hierarchy as wanting the item so that you can sell it; you have no use for the intact item, which is most likely even more difficult to come by than the crafting materials you want from it.

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    Prophet of Telara Neo Omni's Avatar
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    I also pass on many items..especially after NEEDING one. So can we get back to the topic of dungeons and not just my selection preferences, otherwise this thread is shot.


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    Ascendant batou079's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neo Omni View Post
    I also pass on many items..especially after NEEDING one. So can we get back to the topic of dungeons and not just my selection preferences, otherwise this thread is shot.
    Sorry but not getting past it if you don't see anything wrong with it.
    It is the fundamental problem with some pugs, is when you feel justified that needing an item to sell or breakdown, over a player who needs to actually equip the item is fair... because that is greedy (greed roll) and selfish, without question.

    But to add to your main topic as you wish. what is there to add? You summed up the main points fairly well. Dungeons are fun; pugs add flavor to a persons gaming experience in every way you mentioned and more. the "human" element as i like to call it, is what makes gaming fun for me... the totally spontanious behavior that makes every experience different is why i love all multiplayer type platforms from MMOs to online FPS games.

    Playing with a guild, despite knowing how eachother plays and "speed running" dungeons still nets random results and is fun when you set little challenges for eachother... "Oh so you tank'd expert RD in 16 minutes? How bout i try and top you!" Fun stuff like that. (I often compete as a tank to speed run dungeons with a buddy, which sometimes ends in a mess, sometimes ends with great success!) Dragging bosses along to the next trash mob, and the previous trash mob into the next boss... all sorts of fun for my healer! Haha

    Anyway, yes. Dungeons i still find very fun. We raid HK weekly and kill Aky weekly now, but no matter the lack of benefits from dungeons i still do my one daily dungeon bonus which i still enjoy. (although lately it has been nothing but DD queues. ARGH!)

    Byriel - Guardians - The Brethren - DH 4/4 - GP 4/4 - GSB 5/5 - RoS 5/5 - RotP 4/4 - HK 11/11 - iD 1/8
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    Batousi, 50 Warrior ~ Bomah, 50 Cleric ~ Kusanagi, 50 Rogue ~ Fuu, LvLing Mage

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    Sword of Telara Telnedra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neo Omni View Post
    Then there are those in a group that need to hurry up because they have a raid in 10 min. Those always make me laugh. If you know you have a Raid, why que up for a dungeon?
    OMG Quoted for the absolute truth of it!! I am sick of the speed runs where we have to hurry through due to some unknown schedule on another players part! Enjoy the experience folks, chat a little, you might find some new tricks to an old dungeon. Remember....the mob you don't kill is the one that has the pattern you have been waiting ages to drop! (nevermind the extra xp and cash to be had)
    Seltara ~ Defiant

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    Prophet of Telara Neo Omni's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by batou079 View Post
    Sorry but not getting past it if you don't see anything wrong with it.
    It is the fundamental problem with some pugs, is when you feel justified that needing an item to sell or breakdown, over a player who needs to actually equip the item is fair... because that is greedy (greed roll) and selfish, without question.

    OK..OK...I got it.

    I've been a bad ascended...I promise not to do it again.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Telnedra View Post
    OMG Quoted for the absolute truth of it!! I am sick of the speed runs where we have to hurry through due to some unknown schedule on another players part! Enjoy the experience folks, chat a little, you might find some new tricks to an old dungeon. Remember....the mob you don't kill is the one that has the pattern you have been waiting ages to drop! (nevermind the extra xp and cash to be had)
    I honestly don't expect dungeons to take 40 minutes. No it doesn't have to be a perfect run but when you get back home an hour before raid and want to do your daily you don't expect to be tanking for people doing 300-400 dps (healer aside).

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    Telaran The 17th Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neo Omni View Post
    The reason I love dungeons is not for the dungeon itself, but the people.
    You get a random group of personalities and roles together in an enclosed world and all kinds of weirdness comes out. Though the dungeon may be the same, the experience is always different.

    Tanks: basically the leader of the group. Each tank is different. Some are nurturing...always asking if anyone needs to take a break or something. Always herding the group together.
    Some are indifferent and run off without looking back. Some organized in their tactics, some are all over the place. Some are authoritarian and will tell you how to play. Not how the dungeon is laid out, but what abilities to use/not use and what role to filll. Had one tank actually demand another player be tank.
    Then there are those groups where no one gets along and the kick vote prompt is constantly coming up during the game. I always vote NO...dammit people, get along.

    Healers: some healers take a great deal of pride in keeping the group alive. Some can be just plain possessive about it. No one dare heal anyone else...I got it all under control...sort of thing.
    All other members of the group revolve around these two main figures, and in a way they determine the personality of the group.
    Thanks for reading.
    That was a great read, and completely explains why I love playing dungeons in MMO's, and Rift especially. Until Rift, I had ALWAYS been a main-healer in every MMO I've played (EQ2, WoW, and LotRO) and I have to say I was pretty good at. You definitely nailed the pride/possessiveness on the head (nothing is more gratifying than when a tank goes down and you single-handedly keep the group up to beat a boss).

    However, with Rift I decided to try what I had honestly been nervous/scared to try: Main-tanking.
    I wanted to move out of my healer comfort zone and into the position of Leadership and Responsibility and it really is like a whole new world. You go from a face in the crowd that can somewhat hide mistakes and blend in with the others to being as singled-out as it gets in every situation. You play at the top of your game, 100% of the time, or everyone knows you're not. And, most importantly (I think) your personality and demeanor determine that of the group and can dramatically effect how much fun everyone else in the game has.

    I tend to view my group almost like...I don't know, not to be insulting, but like they're my children that I have to protect, guide, stop from bickering, care for, etc. I play for fun, I want my group to have fun, and I hate when people in my group are not having fun. I always try to congratulate people for doing well (even if they're face-rolling), I take the time to explain mechanics, I never belittle someone for a mistake, and I always ask people to give me advice and explain how I'm screwing up if I recognize that I have been screwing up (after all, 1 mistake by me and 4 other people suffer). I think the thing I've hated the most among tanks over my hears of main-healing was egoism. I know I am an exceptionally good tank in Rift, but I also know I'm not perfect. I eff up, I get people killed, and the last thing I should do is be defensive about it. Much better for a tank to own their mistakes as well as their victories and apologize for those mistakes (because everyone else's repair-bill reflects your mistakes). I adamantly refuse to kick anyone or punish anyone when personalities clash. I force cohesion because 10 years in the military taught me that a powerful team/military unit is not one where everyone gets along from the start, it's where people overcome their differences and dislikes and view themselves not as friends (as friendships can be broken) but as a family (whose bonds are unbreakable). A family can hate each other, but they are family all the same.

    Loved the post, Neo, and the chance to pontificate!

    PS: For all you would-be tanks out there:
    After 10 years in the military I know a lot about leadership, and you can't teach most of it, it's something you learn from experience. What advice I can give is simple and has been said 1,000 times: 1. You don't know anything about leadership until you know how to be a follower 2. Never ask someone to do something you won't do yourself (because you may have to do it, and if you refuse, you'll lose their respect permanently) 3. Lead by example 4. Praise in public (/party) and chastise in private (/whisper). If you must chastise a group, use broad terms that include yourself "We must do ____ better" to show that everyone is a part of the team, including you, and that no one is singled out. 5. Explain your decisions clearly, concisely, and (most importantly) kindly. 6. Accept criticism. 7. Own your mistakes and explain how you plan to rectify them. 8. Learn to lead without commands, because orders/commands are the last resort of a faltering leader.
    Trust me, following those rules you can lead someone into a dungeon in Rift, or gunfire in real life or making a pizza at Pizza Hut. Leadership is a universal skill, and it is something you have to learn, you aren't born with it.
    Last edited by The 17th Knight; 03-26-2012 at 01:23 PM.

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    Rift Chaser Nam19771's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neo Omni View Post
    OK..OK...I got it.
    Took you long enough.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kanel32 View Post
    A little sexism each day keeps the bikini's at bay.. nothing to see here folks.

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    I very rarely speak in /p during an Expert. I usually queue with a couple of guildies and i get annoyed if we wipe or the dungeon takes longer than 15 minutes. I don't mind an undergeared tank (I will just switch to sent/ward heal), but i prefer to cabicar heal and make things go very quickly.

    Experts, to me, are just dailies worth 250k PA xp. All the socialising i need is in guild, raid and real life.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Neo Omni View Post
    Tanks: basically the leader of the group. Each tank is different. Some are indifferent and run off without looking back. Some organized in their tactics... Some are authoritarian ...


    Healers: Some can be just plain possessive about it. No one dare heal anyone else...I got it all under control...sort of thing.


    -Some groups never say a word.
    This is pretty much me when i run dungeons. That said, i am one of the very few people in my guild that prefers to run dungeons with pugs. I like to meet people, but also i like to make pug runs smoother than they usually are for most people. Every time i pug a dungeon and it ends under or near the RA timer i feel like i have accomplished something. I made someone's day a little easier, i like that.
    Hastati (50 warrior), Tsar (50 cleric), Tsaritsa (50 Mage)
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