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Thread: Rift Ranks / Progression

  1. #1
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    Default Rift Ranks / Progression

    Hello everyone, again!

    I'm on a mission of sorts, to bring lots of old sites back to life. In progress is riftcombat which you're all aware of. There has been a huge public TS server set out to provide the community with voice comms and I can't wait for it to get busy.

    Anyway, I've made the new riftranks, since chris hasn't been around for a while and hasn't updated his site since last year. The ever upcoming ID instance is without many things we had when HK was released.

    Rift needs to have these sites to remain competitive between guilds who want to participate. A ranking site is hard without armory type data being released. A lot still has to be done manually.

    The new site is located here: http://riftcombat.com/progression/ - It's not on it's own domain yet and the point system (Made by the one and only veev) is still in progress. But I'm letting the community know I'm dedicated to this game and want all these wonderful sites back so we can enjoy ID progression like we did with HK progression.

    As ever, I'm getting PMs regarding help. If you have time to dedicate to helping then send me a PM. The main gauge to posting this thread early, like the other two is to gauge interest, promote it before ID and gain feedback/ideas from people. Thanks!
    A remnant of special olympics world first hammerknell - 27th July 2011 - Best raid ever to be opened. I was a mighty warrior tank. Had many friends and was appreciated in the community.

    Looking back at RIFT is bittersweet. Ah damn.

  2. #2
    Ascendant Primalthirst's Avatar
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    <hears Veev is determining the point system for rankings>

    <equips tinfoil hat>
    Nope.

  3. #3
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    Veev has actually done a pretty amazing job at the point system we're going to be using. I was like "wow" when he showed me
    A remnant of special olympics world first hammerknell - 27th July 2011 - Best raid ever to be opened. I was a mighty warrior tank. Had many friends and was appreciated in the community.

    Looking back at RIFT is bittersweet. Ah damn.

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    Prophet of Telara cwharland's Avatar
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    According to most of the posts on the forums the ranking systems don't matter and all that seems to matter is world first on the last boss. What kind of changes do you have in mind to convince the community otherwise?

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    RIFT Guide Writer intrinsc's Avatar
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    No one should use that very small dispute between Maximation and Voodoo back when RiftRanks was a thing to judge this. I don't think Veev is the kind of guy to hold a grudge(if he even had to begin with) that long and let it affect a community for his own self indulgence.

    Ok, that was off topic. Now, on topic: Great work so far. I wish Trion would let you use the XML data that Zam can get to get guild kills. One of the worst thing about RiftRanks was having to submit those pesky screenshots.
    "I love being a father, but there are some things I miss: Silence, the absence of noise, one single moment undisturbed by the sounds of a childrens’ TV program called Doc McStuffins. There is no quiet anymore, there is only Doc McStuffins.
    — Ron Swanson, 2014

  6. #6
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    Veev just finished his write up

    Here it is: http://riftcombat.com/progression/howitworks/
    A remnant of special olympics world first hammerknell - 27th July 2011 - Best raid ever to be opened. I was a mighty warrior tank. Had many friends and was appreciated in the community.

    Looking back at RIFT is bittersweet. Ah damn.

  7. #7
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    Yeah let me know if you have any questions/suggestions regarding that writeup. I think it will work quite nicely.
    Last edited by Veev; 03-18-2012 at 04:41 PM.

  8. #8
    Qan
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    Looks good so far.
    Can you do a test run with HK dates, I'd like to see it in action.
    Rogue DPS BiS | Critical Hit | Soft Cap: 1187 | Hard Cap: 3163
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    RIFT Guide Writer intrinsc's Avatar
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    Two things I like about the formula:

    1)It rewards everyone with some sort of value as long as you can kill the boss.
    2)Simple enough for anyone to follow.


    This way, even the less progressed guilds will feel like they have something in the running without having to be in contention for world firsts. I also like that the amount of guilds in the instance matter opposed to the old Rift Rank system of just decaying the number of points to 0 and not rewarding a first with more points over a second, or third.


    I feel like a good foundation is being built here that can rival the world's most established MMO in the competitive raiding department.
    "I love being a father, but there are some things I miss: Silence, the absence of noise, one single moment undisturbed by the sounds of a childrens’ TV program called Doc McStuffins. There is no quiet anymore, there is only Doc McStuffins.
    — Ron Swanson, 2014

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    Here is just a really small example using discovery data for the first 10 Akylios achievements: http://www.voodooguild.net/veev/ID-P...yliosTest.xlsm

    This isn't representative of what ID will look like since it's just 1 fight obviously, and it's also not weighing Akylios to have a higher point value than anything else. But you can see how the decay works.

  11. #11
    Qan
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    Quote Originally Posted by Veev View Post
    ...and it's also not weighing Akylios to have a higher point value than anything else.
    Does this mean that end bosses will have a higher point value?
    Rogue DPS BiS | Critical Hit | Soft Cap: 1187 | Hard Cap: 3163
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qan View Post
    Does this mean that end bosses will have a higher point value?
    They won't be assigned an artificial higher point value. The only way they'll have a higher point value is because they've been killed by less guilds. (Read the 1st paragraph of the FAQ again.)

    So say we have 5 guilds total in a 2 boss raid instance. 3 of them have killed boss #2, all of them have killed boss #1.

    Pre-decay, boss #1 is worth (5/5)*1000 = 1000 points
    Pre-decay, boss #2 is worth (5/3)*1000 = 1666.7 points

    When those other 2 guilds catch up, boss #2 will become worth 1000 points also (but the decay since the original date still applies, and realistically speaking there will always be guilds that don't full clear to keep the difference between encounters).

    Basically the more "exclusive" a boss is (been killed by smaller percentage of playerbase), the more points it is worth.
    Last edited by Veev; 03-18-2012 at 06:46 PM.

  13. #13
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    Thanks for updating everyone veev

    Site has been put on a domain now, http://riftprogression.com/ - Make sure you bookmark it!
    A remnant of special olympics world first hammerknell - 27th July 2011 - Best raid ever to be opened. I was a mighty warrior tank. Had many friends and was appreciated in the community.

    Looking back at RIFT is bittersweet. Ah damn.

  14. #14
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    For anyone who can't figure it out, a system like this is incredibly weighted towards whoever gets the furthest boss down in a dungeon first, PERIOD. It will be odd with the 2 different paths, as guilds can clear one half before the other and split the point, but in general this is the idea:

    Example: Let's assume each boss is 2x harder than the previous boss.

    X Guilds Kill Boss 1
    X/2 Guilds Kill Boss 2
    X/4 Guilds Kill Boss 3
    X/8 Guilds Kill Boss 4
    .
    .
    .
    X/2^Y Guilds Kill Boss Y

    Since the sum of 2^1-->2^Y-1 = 2^Y - 1, the guild who kills the newest boss first, would have the highest score over whoever kills all the previous bosses first. This implies that whoever has the newest world first would always be the #1 guild. Obviously this assumes a set amount of guilds progressing past each boss, but the idea holds as the only thing you can possibly do is increase the value of the newest boss (more guilds kill 1st boss) and decrease the value of all other bosses (guilds progress towards newest boss).

    For anyone who thinks it's unfair, the point of progression is who is the furthest, so it will serve its purpose rather simply.

    On the other hand, given so many various factors in MMO raiding, (relic/new epic weapon drops, PA, raid times, etc.) I'm sure there will be complaints, but don't everyone get all uptight ripping apart this system and instead try to be positive or make your own site. Negative criticism serves almost no purpose and be thankful Nuxt and others are putting in so much time on this. The goal is FRIENDLY competition and to enjoy the new content.

  15. #15
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    Yeah, you bring up a good point. Another scenario, which could apply to ID:

    Early days of HK, say guild A kills Grug by themselves, guilds B,C,D kill Sicaron -- all on the same night. In this situation, guild A is ahead in points since their boss was more exclusive, implying that it was more difficult. If on the next night guild A kills Sicaron and B,C,D all kill Grug, they would all be equal.

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