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Thread: With 1.5 will raid gear be made more accessible?

  1. #1
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    Default With 1.5 will raid gear be made more accessible?

    As the leader of a raid guild, one of the biggest things we struggle with is keeping our raid teams alive. I've spoken with other guild leaders who struggle with the same thing. Getting, then keeping 20 well geared people to raid is a huge challenge.

    What happens - usually - in raid guilds is they fall apart. Either through the inability to keep 10-20 people constantly happy, and raiding. Or any number of reasons such as egos that run rampant, Rift's high Churn Rate, and other things. On my server I have seen no less than 10 raid guilds evaporate over the months. I've had to restructure, regear, and replace 3-4 raid teams just over the last month. Gearing up new raiders - especially 10-20 can take some time - as everyone knows. (countless T2 runs, etc)

    So with 1.5 what I would love to see is the 'elitism' taken out of raiding.. Making raid lewt accessible by smaller numbers of people 1-3 mans, perhaps even 5 mans. Keeping a crack team of 1-5 people together, or even pugging 5 people isn't hard and will lighten the stress level of raiding guilds and keeping teams going with the high churn of Rift.

    A significant portion of Rift players aren't raiding, and have never been on a raid. I believe they need to make this content, and loot, more accessible to the masses that play Rift, and remote some of the 'elitism' aspects of it, which do tend to detract from good times playing.

    Here is hoping 1.5 fixes these concerns.

  2. #2
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    Master dungeons give raid level loot and marks of ascension.

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    Ascendant Hoss616's Avatar
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    1.5 will bring master mode to 5 man dungens which drops T3 gear.
    Hoss

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    Ascendant Hoss616's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chronicar View Post
    Master dungeons give raid level loot and marks of ascension.
    MoA too? I remeber reading that they did not drop any Marks in the test server.
    Hoss

  5. #5
    Rift Disciple Majsharan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moebro View Post
    As the leader of a raid guild, one of the biggest things we struggle with is keeping our raid teams alive. I've spoken with other guild leaders who struggle with the same thing. Getting, then keeping 20 well geared people to raid is a huge challenge.

    What happens - usually - in raid guilds is they fall apart. Either through the inability to keep 10-20 people constantly happy, and raiding.
    So with 1.5 what I would love to see is the 'elitism' taken out of raiding.. Making raid lewt accessible by smaller numbers of people 1-3 mans, perhaps even 5 mans. Keeping a crack team of 1-5 people together, or even pugging 5 people isn't hard and will lighten the stress level of raiding guilds and keeping teams going with the high churn of Rift.

    Here is hoping 1.5 fixes these concerns.
    I know what you mean but, on my server it has become much easier to pug the 10 mans recently. Just last night, right before the reset mind you, i was able to put togheter a gp run with a very decent group that would have beaten the last boss if our uber tank hadn't dced and never came back. We had teh last boss beat too but because it was 3 in the morning everyone bailed on teh last attempt that would have had us come through. IT only took me about an hour to assemble the entire group together and be in the dungeon killing things.

    Usually pug groups fall apart before the end or get caught on a boss that they can't beat but you usually get 2-3 bosses. so 6 plaques per and if you are lucky 4-6 t1 raid drops.

    I really do agree with your post, i think as long as the difficulty remains realtivly the same and it takes just as much time to aquire the same amount of gear/plaques i don't see why anyone would have a real problem with the new system that hoss says
    Quote Originally Posted by Hoss616 View Post
    1.5 will bring master mode to 5 man dungens which drops T3 gear.

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    I've seen more and more pugged 10-20's, but as you noted, they rarely finish.. In fact, I have never finished with a pugged one, but always got marks, and some lewt, so it's all good.

    1.5 if it has what is claimed, should address this, and put raid content into the hands of the masses, which I think is a very very good thing.. Seeing ROS and GSB drops on small 1-3 or 5 mans would really help gear up pugs - so we can do HK and other stuff eh?

    Also it would help me keep a steady stream of gamers geared, despite the churn.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Moebro View Post
    I've seen more and more pugged 10-20's, but as you noted, they rarely finish.. In fact, I have never finished with a pugged one, but always got marks, and some lewt, so it's all good.

    1.5 if it has what is claimed, should address this, and put raid content into the hands of the masses, which I think is a very very good thing.. Seeing ROS and GSB drops on small 1-3 or 5 mans would really help gear up pugs - so we can do HK and other stuff eh?

    Also it would help me keep a steady stream of gamers geared, despite the churn.
    So you expect to run HK when you can't get a guild raid that can finish GSB/RoS? That's some cool logic.

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    So, someone on a group progression path should be able to get raid gear? Just trying to understand the point. It was a massive tragedy that pvp progression path crossed raid progression path (in the eyes of the people complaining on here), but its okay that group progression path crosses raid progression path? You don't need raid gear if you aren't raiding. They have already made it really easy to get marks (you can get 1 a day from dungeons, GP/DH are puggable atleast on my shard I see pugs for them all the time).

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    Rift Disciple Majsharan's Avatar
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    Your arguement back fires on itself. Before HK came out many guilds had all the existing raids on complete farm and had many players with gear levels to the point where they couldn't get better gear by raiding anymore.

    So at that point unless they were just going to gear their guild, they had raid gear an didn't need to raid. There were a bunch of people on my server in full raid gear doing t1 and t2 dungeons for the achievements becuase they had no more room for progression. Unless the developers of a game release new raids as soon as on average 20 people on a given server are fully progressed gear wise then there are plenty of people who have raid gear who are no longer getting any benefit from having raid gear beyond having it.

    So if people want some raid gear but don't plan on using it to raid, what does it matter? Its all just a mouse wheel anyways. Sure your mouse wheel is harder to turn and requires better mouse steriods to move but why should he be denied the better mouse steriods to turn his easier to turn wheel since there is no such thing as REAL gear rarirty in this game. Its not like there is only so many copies of raid gear. At some point given enough time everyone can have full sets of the exact same gear.

  10. #10
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    Although it doesn't seem like it at first, gearing up really starts to snowball once you start getting the hang of tactics and can reliably one-shot bosses most of the time. The faster you can beat a boss, the more time you have for the later ones, and the more loot you get. The more loot you get, the better your core raiders' gear gets, and the more stuff gets passed on so lower-geared people get boosted.

    Our guild hasn't been raiding all that long - just a couple of months really, and we're not even remotely serious about it - and we're already at the point where we've got about 15 people almost fully raid geared. We did a combined DH/GP run, loads of rogue loot dropped, and since one of our rogues was already almost fully-geared the other one got just about everything, and went from pretty much fresh-out-of-T2 gear to half raid-geared in the space of a couple of hours.

    As it is, DH and GP can pretty much be pugged by people in T2 gear, and after a couple of runs you'll probably start outgearing the first couple of bosses in GSB, so the barrier to entry is almost nonexistent. This game is the most accessible to get into raiding of any MMO I've played, the "elitism" you seem to be seing is a complete non-issue. And if you've got that many guilds struggling to hang on to players on your shard, it sounds like you've just got too damn many guilds for its population.

  11. #11
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    Its the same issue on Blightweald and on every server i would guess.

    The only guilds that are stable are either the hardcore guilds because players there are there for the gear and progress and they wouldnt leave a fast progressing guild unless there is drama etc etc.

    Or the ones that came before from other games and already bonded for years hence they are a good 10-20 player base.


    We saw like 2-4 guilds get disbanded, we almost got disbanded because of the summer but we got lucky/kept trying.

    But i agree with you and i made a post about it.

    Gearing people is really annoying, and the main reason for that right now is the two things:

    1)Hit Rating

    2)Weapons play a huge part for Rogues/Warriors more than overall gear does.

    Like 90% of a Rogues/Warriors DPS is his Main Hand weapon everytime you increase a tier of that, you see a massive upgrade..some better scaling with AP would be better so the weapon wasnt 90% but 50% of the DPS.

    3)Following number 2..Gear does not scale that well for the melee classes.

    And mages/clerics being behind on DPS is the spellpower scaling badly.
    Last edited by potis; 09-07-2011 at 02:17 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by potis View Post
    Its the same issue on Blightweald and on every server i would guess.

    The only guilds that are stable are either the hardcore guilds because players there are there for the gear and progress and they wouldnt leave a fast progressing guild unless there is drama etc etc.

    Or the ones that came before from other games and already bonded for years hence they are a good 10-20 player base.


    We saw like 2-4 guilds get disbanded, we almost got disbanded because of the summer but we got lucky/kept trying.

    But i agree with you and i made a post about it.

    Gearing people is really annoying, and the main reason for that right now is the two things:

    1)Hit Rating

    2)Weapons play a huge part for Rogues/Warriors more than overall gear does.

    Like 90% of a Rogues/Warriors DPS is his Main Hand weapon everytime you increase a tier of that, you see a massive upgrade..some better scaling with AP would be better so the weapon wasnt 90% but 50% of the DPS.
    #2 would seem like a good thing coming from someone who plays a cleric where you need overall good gear to compete DPS wise to rogues/warriors who just need a weapon. I agree that hit rating can be a pain, however, after seeing a couple people just hit 50 and how quick they could get up to 300 hit/focus for HK it isn't that bad especially with the ease/quickness of DH/GP.

  13. #13
    Ascendant Inixia's Avatar
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    To answer the op, yes, 1.5 will make obtaining raid gear easier. In fact a huge amount of content will drop the same raiding tier of gear.
    Slivers will still drop marks and raid gear, and have been nerfed
    The new Master Modes will also drop raid gear and marks of ascension and are reportedly as easy as the old T2 5mans
    Crafting gear is raid quality
    Pvp gear is raid quality
    And finally T1 Raiding drops marks of ascension and raid gear at that level.

    The new stat boosts and aa system will make all pve aspects easier indirectly too.

    But will this help people retain 20mans? No I don't think so. It would be one thing if the non T1 raiding areas dropped gear that prepared new raiders for the 20mans like you are saying... but that's just not the case. In most cases it simply overwrites it. You may have a lot more people who are geared up for T1s after this patch for less effort but the question quickly becomes, well why raid T1s now? For fun seeing it the first few times I guess, but it might be even harder to get people to raid consistently when there isn't much gear incentive. The remaining 20man area with that sort of progression incentive is Hammerknell but you may find that people geared up for it does not translate to them being prepared for that skill level if they are coming from master modes, slivers, etc..
    Last edited by Inixia; 09-07-2011 at 02:34 PM.

  14. #14
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    Have you even tried Dh? It's not that bad, all the bosses (cept for the last one) are basically beaten thru dance moves. Once get the movement down, the bosses aren't that hard. I don't even think they have an enrage timer.

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    Sword of Telara Hrimnir's Avatar
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    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raid_%28gaming%29

    A raid is a type of mission in a video game in which a very large number of people (larger than the normal team size set by the game) attempt to defeat a boss monster



    Pls read the highlighted parts.

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