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Thread: Dropped items for marks?

  1. #1
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    Default Dropped items for marks?

    First let me say that I don't know if I like this idea. On the face of it, it seems good, and it worked pretty well in EQ2... there's just something... wrong about the idea. Anyways, here it is.

    Merchants at the front door to each of the instances which will sell all loot available that drops from that zone. Each item will cost 1000 marks (500 for T1 instances). Thats more than a full suit of armor, so its not cheap.

    But could help those people who have been running DSM forever trying to get the SHoE or a titanslayer or whatever other piece of gear they want but can't get to drop.

    EDIT: This is not my idea, I stole it (shamelessly) from someone else.
    Last edited by Paikis; 09-01-2011 at 07:23 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paikis View Post
    First let me say that I don't know if I like this idea. On the face of it, it seems good, and it worked pretty well in EQ2... there's just something... wrong about the idea. Anyways, here it is.

    Merchants at the front door to each of the instances which will sell all loot available that drops from that zone. Each item will cost 1000 marks (500 for T1 instances). Thats more than a full suit of armor, so its not cheap.

    But could help those people who have been running DSM forever trying to get the SHoE or a titanslayer or whatever other piece of gear they want but can't get to drop.

    EDIT: This is not my idea, I stole it (shamelessly) from someone else.
    Question: Why would you still be running T2s to have 1000 plaques of achievement available? That number just doesn't make sense.

    In reality, if you price everything so high to counter the fact that you still need random drops of some extent to make the game enjoyable, no one will ever reach that amount until they are far progressed past that tier of content.

    It won't work in the current state you've offered, and it definitely won't work if you price everything so cheaply, because, what's the point in drops if you already know how it's going to happen?

  3. #3
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    The point is that it is possible to have run DSM every day since release (or even multiple times) and still not have a piece of loot that you want. This would provide a way for you to get that item if you just can't get it to drop.

    The number of tokens itself doesn't matter, as long as it's a high number. Considering you get an average of 13.6 tokens per T2 dungeon run (plus 6 plaques for the random bonus) it would take roughly 73 dungeon runs to get that one item you want to drop. If you run 5 dungeons a day, you will be able to buy one item after only 15 days. If you run 2 dungeons a day it jumps up to about a month. The number doesn't matter, you could make it 300. Whatever.

    I'm also confused, are you syaing 1000 is too high, or too low? You said why would you still be running T2s to have 1000 plaques... implying that its too high... but then you said that it wont work if you price everything so cheaply...

    Which is it you're trying to say?
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    Ascendant Primalthirst's Avatar
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    I really don't think this is a good idea, it sets a bad precedent. Over time qqing by unlucky players is almost certain to push Trion into repeatedly lowering the cost of items, eventually making them relatively inexpensive.
    Nope.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Primalthirst View Post
    I really don't think this is a good idea, it sets a bad precedent. Over time qqing by unlucky players is almost certain to push Trion into repeatedly lowering the cost of items, eventually making them relatively inexpensive.
    So...we are just going to let the root of the problem stay that way, is that what you are suggesting?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ahov View Post
    Question: Why would you still be running T2s to have 1000 plaques of achievement available? That number just doesn't make sense.
    Maybe said person has that amount because they don't need to buy anything with plaques anymore, but chooses to run them with people who still need gear because they're helpful. I currently have over 600 plaques just from tanking for my guildies, and I really don't care to spend them on anything. At least with this idea, I could finally get the god damned leather shoulders from CCx for the model.

    Why won't you drop damn it!?!?

    At any rate, I fully support this "shamelessly stolen idea."
    Last edited by Kudaran; 09-01-2011 at 08:44 PM.

  7. #7
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    I don't think it's a bad idea at all. If I ran t2s enough to get a full set of tier 2 gear, and still didn't have the shoe, I would say that RnG is ****ed. However, if you were to sell it for around 200 marks I think that would be fair.

    People would still run t2s in order to buy BiS items even if they already have the full t2 set.

    You may not like it because you're allowing people to skip "progression", but it does create a gap closer between different player groups. Same as allowing someone to buy a piece of t1 raid gear for 400 PoAs or t2 raid gear for the t1 raid marks. It also pushes the more progression minded players into going into earlier tier content. If I could buy a t2 raid piece for 800 plaques I'd never have a daily bonus left. I would probably be running way more t2s than that, even.

    It just gives players who are finished with content a reason to go back and do older content, allowing for a more enjoyable experience for all. To be honest, I couldn't care if someone farmed 400 plaques just to buy a t1 raid piece or a t2 raid piece for x amount of plaques.
    Last edited by Skaer; 09-01-2011 at 09:01 PM.
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    This system is less appropriate to Rift than it was to EQ2.

    In EQ2, loot tables did not give all items equal weighting. Some items on a loot table would have a 25% chance to drop, while others on the same loot table would have less than 5% chance to drop.

    Rift has all items equally weighted, and also has smaller loot tables (and less over all loot as a result)

    It is technically possible to run a dungeon hundreds of times and not get a specific item, but it would be a freak occurrence.
    Quote Originally Posted by Debase View Post
    If the only target audience for Rift is disenfranchised WoW players, its doomed imo.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Noaani View Post
    This system is less appropriate to Rift than it was to EQ2.

    In EQ2, loot tables did not give all items equal weighting. Some items on a loot table would have a 25% chance to drop, while others on the same loot table would have less than 5% chance to drop.

    Rift has all items equally weighted, and also has smaller loot tables (and less over all loot as a result)

    It is technically possible to run a dungeon hundreds of times and not get a specific item, but it would be a freak occurrence.
    How do you know what the weighting is? judging by my experiences in DSM over the last week, the Master Thieve's Tools have a 100% drop rate from Dichrom. I know random numbers are random (and streaky) but I've seen the MTTs atleast 10 times, and only once seen the SHoE, and htats since beta2 over 5 level 50 characters.
    I'M RIFTSTALKING YOUR MUM!

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  10. #10
    Ascendant Primalthirst's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paikis View Post
    How do you know what the weighting is? judging by my experiences in DSM over the last week, the Master Thieve's Tools have a 100% drop rate from Dichrom. I know random numbers are random (and streaky) but I've seen the MTTs atleast 10 times, and only once seen the SHoE, and htats since beta2 over 5 level 50 characters.
    I've never seen MTT drop but have seen multiple SHoE. I believe that's called RNG.

    I can understand if they were sold for a ludicrous amount of plaques, ie like 500 per piece, and could probably accept that. But the problem is that it gives players the expectation that they can purchase any piece of gear they want in a dungeon environment. Then 1 or 2 things will happen:

    a) These players start complaining that the system is different in raids and Trion inevitably caves to complaints and essentially removes the RNG factor in raiding loot and quite possibly the eventual removal of drop tables and bosses end up just dropping marks. I don't know about you but I like the fact that no two people have the exact same set of gear and everyone is always a little different.
    and/or
    b) Unlucky players complain so much that Trion lowers the plaque cost for these non-set pieces to the point that they end up costing the same amount as other gear and there's no longer any reason to not run the quickest/easiest dungeon.
    Nope.

  11. #11
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    Considering that pre-hammerknell PvE set bonuses are being thought of for the next patch, I don't think that having this would be that bad of an idea though. People would be MUCH more concerned with getting the tier pieces, and not so much the dungeon armor pieces at that point. This would help the people who have **** for luck, such as myself, and it would give me reason to tank randoms again. You could set values at like:

    t2 item values
    Armor: 400 plaques
    Trinket: 450 Plaques
    1h Weapon: 475 Plaques
    2h Weapon: 850 Plaques
    Ranged Weapon: 800 Plaques
    Accessories : 300 Plaques

    This way it's still time-consuming to earn, but you have something to actually work for, and not rely on ****ty RNG to do it for you. Even WoW had kind of a system like this, you could get gear that was similar to the items in dungeons, with different names/models, but somewhat nearly identical stats. Raids however I don't think have been tainted with a system like this yet, and hopefully people won't ruin that.
    Last edited by Kudaran; 09-02-2011 at 02:33 AM.

  12. #12
    Ascendant JimboTCB's Avatar
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    I think the real issue that needs to be addressed is why things that drop from T2 experts are still BIS for certain roles compared to raid loot. Especially in terms of trinkets, the itemisation of certain categories of raid loot seems poor to the point of non-existent.

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