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Thread: DH 1st boss bugged

  1. #1
    Champion of Telara Puandro's Avatar
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    Default DH 1st boss bugged

    So i tried to tank it on my Rogue and i got T2/T3 gear 12.9K hits. Boss was hititng me 4.9K-6.5K auto attack and sometimes double hitting, basically 2-shotting me. After 3 failed attempts i get our warrior who has tanked it before NP tank it. He got double hit for 6.5K + 3.9K and then cleaved from the call and died. So WTH was going on?

  2. #2
    RIFT Guide Writer intrinsc's Avatar
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    Bad timing on the hits.

    I still think this dungeon is over-tuned for the type of dungeon they want it to be. Bosses in here hit harder than GP bosses and this is meant as an introductory dungeon. I know what you feel. When I can tank Greenscale without my bar going down less than 80% and Joloral can take me down to 25% with a swipe of his claws there is a serious disparity between tiers of content.
    Last edited by intrinsc; 08-30-2011 at 06:45 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by intrinsc View Post
    Bad timing on the hits.

    I still think this dungeon is over-tuned for the type of dungeon they want it to be. Bosses in here hit harder than GP bosses and this is meant as an introductory dungeon. I know what you feel. When I can tank Greenscale without my bar going down less than 80% and Joloral can take me down to 25% with a swipe of his claws there is a serious disparity between tiers of content.
    Here we go again?

    Please don't tell me DH is more difficult than GP. I see lots of pugs for it and they finish it. However, I don't see pugs for GP quite as much.

  4. #4
    Rift Disciple Protoskull's Avatar
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    Just kite it and have a sabo incriminate you. Don't even need a healer and it nullifies its Stand to Attention>Cleave mechanic.

    In all my runs (including pugs) where we didn't use that tactic it still didn't hit the (rogue) tank as hard as you are suggesting though, so perhaps it is a bug in your case.
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    Rift Disciple Protoskull's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by intrinsc View Post
    Bad timing on the hits.

    I still think this dungeon is over-tuned for the type of dungeon they want it to be. Bosses in here hit harder than GP bosses and this is meant as an introductory dungeon. I know what you feel. When I can tank Greenscale without my bar going down less than 80% and Joloral can take me down to 25% with a swipe of his claws there is a serious disparity between tiers of content.
    That sounds like you are getting hit by Joloral when he has the buff from the water, from his add, or from the seacaps, or even all three!
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    Champion of Telara Puandro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Protoskull View Post
    Just kite it and have a sabo incriminate you. Don't even need a healer and it nullifies its Stand to Attention>Cleave mechanic.

    In all my runs (including pugs) where we didn't use that tactic it still didn't hit the (rogue) tank as hard as you are suggesting though, so perhaps it is a bug in your case.
    Ive healed less geared rogues before on my cleric, The warrior said he was never hit this hard before.

  7. #7
    RIFT Guide Writer intrinsc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ahov View Post
    Here we go again?

    Please don't tell me DH is more difficult than GP. I see lots of pugs for it and they finish it. However, I don't see pugs for GP quite as much.
    GP bosses hit a lot less hard than DH bosses. I can save you combatlogs this coming week and you can see yourself.

    We have no problem with the content because we don't suck. However, I am not going to blindly ignore inconsistencies because I am not some elitist a*hole.

    Just like guilds have problems with HK bugs, there are bugs in this dungeon. Because this dungeon is not a tier 2 doesn't warrant it gets shoved to the side and made fun of when people try to point out problems in it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Protoskull View Post
    That sounds like you are getting hit by Joloral when he has the buff from the water, from his add, or from the seacaps, or even all three!
    No, I tank Joloral on the side away from everything and we have a tank getting the big adds and soaking up the little ones. NOTHING gets to joloral. Again, I can gladly email you combatlogs for these 2 dungeons and you can take a look at my damage taken yourself. I will be glad.
    Last edited by intrinsc; 08-30-2011 at 07:16 PM.
    "I love being a father, but there are some things I miss: Silence, the absence of noise, one single moment undisturbed by the sounds of a childrens’ TV program called Doc McStuffins. There is no quiet anymore, there is only Doc McStuffins.
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    Quote Originally Posted by intrinsc View Post
    GP bosses hit a lot less hard than DH bosses. I can save you combatlogs this coming week and you can see yourself.

    We have no problem with the content because we don't suck. However, I am not going to blindly ignore inconsistencies because I am not some elitist a*hole.

    Just like guilds have problems with HK bugs, there are bugs in this dungeon. Because this dungeon is not a tier 2 doesn't warrant it gets shoved to the side and made fun of when people try to point out problems in it.



    No, I tank Joloral on the side away from everything and we have a tank getting the big adds and soaking up the little ones. NOTHING gets to joloral. Again, I can gladly email you combatlogs for these 2 dungeons and you can take a look at my damage taken yourself. I will be glad.
    There's quite a large difference between gear checks and coordination. A boss hitting the TANK very hard is quite healable if your healers are running proper specs (such as sent/puri) and if your tank is running proper spec for mitigation.

    The *mechanics* behind Thalguur are much more complex than any boss in DH, which is what makes GP significantly harder.

    Any random group of T2-geared players can and will beat Drowned Halls. Any random group of T2-geared players will not go into GP and 1shot any of the bosses outside of Anrak the Foul. It just takes too much coordination.

  9. #9
    RIFT Guide Writer intrinsc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ahov View Post
    There's quite a large difference between gear checks and coordination. A boss hitting the TANK very hard is quite healable if your healers are running proper specs (such as sent/puri) and if your tank is running proper spec for mitigation.

    The *mechanics* behind Thalguur are much more complex than any boss in DH, which is what makes GP significantly harder.

    Any random group of T2-geared players can and will beat Drowned Halls. Any random group of T2-geared players will not go into GP and 1shot any of the bosses outside of Anrak the Foul. It just takes too much coordination.
    I strongly disagree with that. This is how hard I get hit by Joloral Ragetide:

    http://img710.imageshack.us/img710/4...amagetaken.jpg

    I am pants short of full raid gear. This is me, standing there, in one spot, getting 0 adds, not standing in the water, taking shots from him. I take almost 1500 damage a second.

    This is me tanking Anrak the foul.

    http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/1...amagetaken.jpg

    Same gear.

    You mean to tell me Trion expects a fresh, t2 geared tank to survive that sort of damage with anything but pro healers? Thankfully, we do have good healers, but if you get a pug with some wardens expecting to heal through that damage in Exemplaer's set, you are sorely mistaken.

    It seems to me that they are doing two things. Replacing difficulty of mechanics with damage output from bosses. That is dumb, stupid dungeon design, and alongside with the bugs Hydriss still has, makes the dungeon a crapshoot. You either have incredible healers and a decent tank or a crazy good, geared tank and mediocre healers. You can also have overgeared bastards claiming the dungeon is perfect and a roflstomp(for them, of course). Or, you can have people that are meant exactly for this "entry-level" instance hitting major walls because their gear just isn't right for the instance. The latter is what is happening when people try to go in there with fresh gear and a fresh raid. Sure, they'll be able to get by the skin of their teeth, but it's because the bosses hit hard. They offer absolutely zero training for other dungeons and are just a headache otherwise. We go in there for the marks, to be perfectly honest, and every time we have people repeat the same crap: Why are you getting hit so hard?

    This is me tanking Aleria with a rogue tank on the ranged wolf:

    http://img824.imageshack.us/img824/1...amagetaken.jpg

    We kill absolutely 0 pollen and Aleria gets to about 12 stacks every single time. Still, the damage take is half of what Joloral is hitting me for. Put a guild fresh out of T2's in GP and they'll be able to take down up to Thalguur. Uruluuk with "some" Earth resist on their tank and planar protection. The mechanics are NOT hard. Theres maybe 3 things to watch out for on Thalguur and Guurloth is a simple Simon says.

    I am not QQing or crying, but when Trion says "entry-level" I expected something easy so I could throw some of my fresh T2 geared people into with a new raid leader. That is NOT the case. They have been banging their head on Hydriss for weeks because the tank takes, often times, 9k worth of damage in about 2 seconds from Tidal Wave/Tsunami/Attack combinations with no Seaspawn present. They got this far after consulting me about raid set ups, healing specs, etc. That is not something that a pug of fresh T2'd people can do easily and stomp the place in an hour.

    What I want is for Trion to mean what they say and walk their walk. This is not entry level as far as damage. It's entry level as far as mechanics, but barely. Gilded Prophecy is a far easier instance, a ton of fun, and the bosses and trash is far less annoying and hits less hard. I love the game, but for god's sake. The only way people who are tier 2 geared to get any raid experience still seems to get carried by people who out-gear stuff.
    "I love being a father, but there are some things I miss: Silence, the absence of noise, one single moment undisturbed by the sounds of a childrens’ TV program called Doc McStuffins. There is no quiet anymore, there is only Doc McStuffins.
    — Ron Swanson, 2014

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by intrinsc View Post
    I strongly disagree with that. This is how hard I get hit by Joloral Ragetide:

    http://img710.imageshack.us/img710/4...amagetaken.jpg

    I am pants short of full raid gear. This is me, standing there, in one spot, getting 0 adds, not standing in the water, taking shots from him. I take almost 1500 damage a second.

    This is me tanking Anrak the foul.

    http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/1...amagetaken.jpg

    Same gear.

    You mean to tell me Trion expects a fresh, t2 geared tank to survive that sort of damage with anything but pro healers? Thankfully, we do have good healers, but if you get a pug with some wardens expecting to heal through that damage in Exemplaer's set, you are sorely mistaken.

    It seems to me that they are doing two things. Replacing difficulty of mechanics with damage output from bosses. That is dumb, stupid dungeon design, and alongside with the bugs Hydriss still has, makes the dungeon a crapshoot. You either have incredible healers and a decent tank or a crazy good, geared tank and mediocre healers. You can also have overgeared bastards claiming the dungeon is perfect and a roflstomp(for them, of course). Or, you can have people that are meant exactly for this "entry-level" instance hitting major walls because their gear just isn't right for the instance. The latter is what is happening when people try to go in there with fresh gear and a fresh raid. Sure, they'll be able to get by the skin of their teeth, but it's because the bosses hit hard. They offer absolutely zero training for other dungeons and are just a headache otherwise. We go in there for the marks, to be perfectly honest, and every time we have people repeat the same crap: Why are you getting hit so hard?

    This is me tanking Aleria with a rogue tank on the ranged wolf:

    http://img824.imageshack.us/img824/1...amagetaken.jpg

    We kill absolutely 0 pollen and Aleria gets to about 12 stacks every single time. Still, the damage take is half of what Joloral is hitting me for. Put a guild fresh out of T2's in GP and they'll be able to take down up to Thalguur. Uruluuk with "some" Earth resist on their tank and planar protection. The mechanics are NOT hard. Theres maybe 3 things to watch out for on Thalguur and Guurloth is a simple Simon says.

    I am not QQing or crying, but when Trion says "entry-level" I expected something easy so I could throw some of my fresh T2 geared people into with a new raid leader. That is NOT the case. They have been banging their head on Hydriss for weeks because the tank takes, often times, 9k worth of damage in about 2 seconds from Tidal Wave/Tsunami/Attack combinations with no Seaspawn present. They got this far after consulting me about raid set ups, healing specs, etc. That is not something that a pug of fresh T2'd people can do easily and stomp the place in an hour.

    What I want is for Trion to mean what they say and walk their walk. This is not entry level as far as damage. It's entry level as far as mechanics, but barely. Gilded Prophecy is a far easier instance, a ton of fun, and the bosses and trash is far less annoying and hits less hard. I love the game, but for god's sake. The only way people who are tier 2 geared to get any raid experience still seems to get carried by people who out-gear stuff.
    Oh, you are that bad player who's going around whining about how hard DH is without even trying to understand boss mechanics.

    Hint: Why Anrak appears to do less damage than Joloral is because you split the damage up into two tanks for Anrak and Joloral is a single tank fight. But good attempt at trying to bullcrap your way through, might be better a troll attempt if it was a single tank fight versus single tank fight. And the ranged tank on Aleria kites the wolf around rather than stupidly standing there, so another moot point.
    Last edited by Vocalhealspam; 08-30-2011 at 10:43 PM.

  11. #11
    General of Telara
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    For the first boss, just get one of your clerics to switch to inquisicar (or really any kind of justicar spec with ranged attacks availaible), turn on MoL and run in a circle spamming stuff on boss. You don't even need tank gear since you don't get hit at all.

    For 2nd boss, don't use a rogue tank then the damage becomes a lot easier to heal. And the fight is only about being able to keep the main tank alive (while both tanks are rotating around the room), so it better be somewhat hard.
    Since you compare it to Greenscale, it's a bit like if he never entered air phase and his only mechanics were breath & plants. In that case you'd expect him to deal quite higher damage.

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    You dont need any AoE heals at all in DH. You do in GP.

    Put more healers on single target heals/support and none on AoE. If you run the same amount of healers in Dh as in GP (but have them all single target focussed) it should be easier to heal than GP even with a ****ty tank if the healers are all specced right. People seem to think "One synth chloro and one cleric in GP + one or two AoE clowns = One synth chloro and one cleric in DH and ooo look, no AoE healing is needed so let's get more dps instead!"

    ^ In response to that terrible tank with a fat guy as an avatar who complains incessantly about all raid content being too hard for him. Also rogues SUCK at physical mitigation when compared to warriors/clerics so you should be using one of the latter for all of DH if lots of healers still can't keep tank up.
    Last edited by woopedazz; 08-31-2011 at 05:24 AM.

  13. #13
    Plane Touched Kudaran's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by intrinsc View Post
    I strongly disagree with that. This is how hard I get hit by Joloral Ragetide:

    http://img710.imageshack.us/img710/4...amagetaken.jpg

    This is me tanking Anrak the foul.

    http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/1...amagetaken.jpg

    This is me tanking Aleria with a rogue tank on the ranged wolf:

    http://img824.imageshack.us/img824/1...amagetaken.jpg
    Hate to go off topic, but what program are you using for this? Too lazy to figure out how to monitor my damage intake with ACT and your program looks downright sexy.

    Aaand, back on topic.

    Some of the tanks in my guild complain about how overtuned DH is some times, but it isn't impossible. It's still fun, like Isskal and the second boss. There's just minor script issues with the first boss where he cleaves as he's puling the target so the target dies in midair, even if the tank already turned him. It may seem like they hit harder, and I think at least the second boss in DH does. (5k on a Warrior tank? Not even gonna try it on my rogue, I'll stick to tanking the adds kthx.)

  14. #14
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    ^ Just looked at those parses again: What those parses show is exactly what I'm talking about with it being even easier to heal than any other raid content in the game with proper healer setup. You take 250 more dps than the other two bosses, which are both absolute jokes when it comes to incoming damage and there is no incoming raid damage at all. That's 250 HPS that an extra healer/2 healers have to pull depending if you have 1 DoL cleric/aoe chloro/2 of these/whatever setup on Anrak. That's incredibly low. Either 2 less healers than anrak and one of your two healers needs to pull an extra 250HPS from somewhere, or 1 less healer than Anrak and the 3rd dude has to cast bloom on cd as their entire healing contribution (assuming you are running heavy heals on Anrak for whatever reason; 2 mains and a chloro/archon, and a DoL cleric for example).

    Also went over our raids parses and our guilds 2nd off-tank (i.e. 3rd geared tank who has been raiding with us for a month) with a piece or two of T2, 2 mark items (gloves and head) and the rest drops takes this damage: http://www.raidrifts.com/report/view...381332/394192/

    Our guilds 6th tank in line with only 3 T3 drops (ring, neck, sword) and no plaque gear and a substandard sigil gets hit for about the same as you. It's your spec causing you issues intrinsic if you are getting any.
    Last edited by woopedazz; 08-31-2011 at 05:40 AM.

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