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Thread: Toughness and raiding

  1. #1
    Plane Walker
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    Default Toughness and raiding

    So the general consensus from the research I've done is that 150 toughness is the cap for instanced raids. However, I have not seen any actual numbers that prove this. Has somebody done the numbers and tested this out? If not, has there been a dev response about this yet?
    Last edited by Neykho; 04-24-2011 at 07:58 PM.

  2. #2
    Rift Disciple
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    As a rogue i tested this a little bit in DSM. Usual group

    cleric healer
    Mage dps
    Rogue tank (me)
    rogue dps
    random guildie dps


    I switched my +20 toughness rune out for an endurance one. This dropped me from 172 toughness to 152 toughness. I figured the same as you. 150+ and should be just fine right? Wrong. I got rocked in DSM. I mean completely destroyed on trash and bosses. I put my toughness rune back on my chest ( I always carry a few on me ) and bam...it was normal again.

    I don't know if it's a rogue thing or a tank thing in general but that 20 toughness made a pretty big difference. I went from 344% to 304% when i got rid of the toughness rune btw.

  3. #3
    Shield of Telara idefiler6's Avatar
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    150 toughness does nothing in T2s, the cap for T2 is 100. Crit damage in a T2 is damage +200%. 50 toughness reduces crit damage by 100%, so 100 toughness reduces by 200%. Your crits are coming in at the same amount of damage as any normal hit at 100 toughness, at 152 toughness and at 172 toughness. You cannot reduce the damage modifier less than 0%. It's not happening. What you saw appears to be what you wanted to see, and anything not parsed is anectdotal, anyway. I've tested this for myself in DSM, GSB and RoS and have found 150 to be the cap at this point. No mob in the game crits you for more than 300%, at this time. Were you watching debuffs? Mob buffs? Perhaps there is something you missed.
    Kalistrasz
    Level 50 Warrior
    "Strong people are harder to kill than weak people, and more useful in general." - Mark Rippetoe

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by idefiler6 View Post
    150 toughness does nothing in T2s, the cap for T2 is 100. Crit damage in a T2 is damage +200%. 50 toughness reduces crit damage by 100%, so 100 toughness reduces by 200%. Your crits are coming in at the same amount of damage as any normal hit at 100 toughness, at 152 toughness and at 172 toughness. You cannot reduce the damage modifier less than 0%. It's not happening. What you saw appears to be what you wanted to see, and anything not parsed is anectdotal, anyway. I've tested this for myself in DSM, GSB and RoS and have found 150 to be the cap at this point. No mob in the game crits you for more than 300%, at this time. Were you watching debuffs? Mob buffs? Perhaps there is something you missed.
    Actually it is parsed and there is a difference. I didn't miss anything. It was even argued by the other war tanks in my guild until the parse showed them different. Which is why we believe it to be a bug with rogues rather than warriors because they didnt have an issue.

    Try not to sound so arrogant and know it all because there are times you will be wrong. We are all human and nobody is perfect.

  5. #5
    RIFT Guide Writer bluedot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Banuvan View Post
    Actually it is parsed and there is a difference. I didn't miss anything. It was even argued by the other war tanks in my guild until the parse showed them different. Which is why we believe it to be a bug with rogues rather than warriors because they didnt have an issue.

    Try not to sound so arrogant and know it all because there are times you will be wrong. We are all human and nobody is perfect.
    Rogues and Warriors get the same amount of crit damage reduction from toughness. So the only way your story makes any sense is if mobs in T2 dungeons crit Rogues for 350% damage instead of the 200% damage they crit Warriors.. and every other class.

    Please show your parse of this.

    And yes 150 Toughness is considered the Raid cap. I cannot say I have personally tested it though.

  6. #6
    Shield of Telara HighFive's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neykho View Post
    So the general consensus from the research I've done is that 150 toughness is the cap for instanced raids. However, I have not seen any actual numbers that prove this. Has somebody done the numbers and tested this out? If not, has there been a dev response about this yet?
    Trion doesn't sticky ****. You can only parse the information so many times before you getting ****ing sick of it.

    Blame the lack of info on Trion. The fan base has already answered this, with numbers a 100+ times.

    It would jsut take one official statement from them to end this, the cleric parry display bug, etc. They choose to make us repeat ourselves for their enjoyment.
    Sticky some #$%#^$# guides so that people stop asking the same question for the 100th time or posting information that is clearly wrong.
    "Death to the dragons!" -
    Defiant NPCs
    "I will do my part, but I have no desire to play the hero" -
    Kira during Unseen Agent quest chain
    "Death is the best interrupt" - Guildie one night when we were doing expert RD
    Saga of the Endless guide: http://www.unseenagent.net/guides/qu...of-the-endless


  7. #7
    Shield of Telara idefiler6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Banuvan View Post
    We are all human and nobody is perfect.
    This is just something imperfect nonhumans say. It's like saying we're all beautiful on the inside (no, you're just ugly and need a way to justify it to yourself).
    Kalistrasz
    Level 50 Warrior
    "Strong people are harder to kill than weak people, and more useful in general." - Mark Rippetoe

  8. #8
    Plane Touched
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    Totally could be a bug. The game is full of them. Not sure about the angry responses you got though. Another issue there I'm sure. This game is so buggy I'm not surprised by anything i see or hear anymore. On Freeholm atm, if you are a rogue, you can endlessly res the whole raid over n over again without using any charges up.

  9. #9
    Shield of Telara HighFive's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enntense View Post
    On Freeholm atm, if you are a rogue, you can endlessly res the whole raid over n over again without using any charges up.
    I think that's game wide and it's been that way for at least a week. I'm on Greybriar.

    Having said that, I don't mind good bugs like this as much as the bad ones like AP bosses who one shot people.
    Sticky some #$%#^$# guides so that people stop asking the same question for the 100th time or posting information that is clearly wrong.
    "Death to the dragons!" -
    Defiant NPCs
    "I will do my part, but I have no desire to play the hero" -
    Kira during Unseen Agent quest chain
    "Death is the best interrupt" - Guildie one night when we were doing expert RD
    Saga of the Endless guide: http://www.unseenagent.net/guides/qu...of-the-endless


  10. #10
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    I have to say I have experienced something similar. I have 154 toughness, and I was in RD. Still the 4th boss was able to crit me sometimes. Yes, thats normal. BUT normal hits were like 1,7-2,2k, but the crits went up to 3,3k! So there is something stinky there.

  11. #11
    Plane Touched
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    I'm playing with a french client, so i dont know the exact names in english.
    Anyway, i went from 172 to 152 thougness, being a war, and with 152 i got some "overpowered" damage in my logs. Overpower is supposed to be the damage you take additionaly if you dont have the thougness.
    Maybe, the cap for bosses is 170, like the hit cap is 220 instead of 200 on bosses ?

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