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Thread: Trion please think twice before implementing DF.

  1. #1
    Shadowlander
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    Default Trion please think twice before implementing DF.

    Before you go on your little casual nerd rage spree disagreeing with what I'm about to say, I have played WoW in vanilla even before DF was even thought of. Sure no one likes sitting around spamming any channel to get a group together because it takes up time. I think its a safe assumption to say that most of you complaining about not having a DF in this game aren't even level cap yet and most likely never experienced WoW without DF.

    Pro DF advocates seem to use the infamous arguement that it takes forever to find a group and that it was exactly the same in WoW pre DF. I could say from experience that as DPS in vanilla, BC and some of the Wotlk. It was alot easier to get a group for any dungeon as DPS.

    You all seem to look at dungeon finder on paper as a simple design, you fail to see it for what it really is. WoW DF queues for DPS atm are ridiculous. 45 minutes is the average amount of time you have to wait for your queue to come up. If your whole arguement is based on the fact that you want groups fast it is completely eliminating any reason to even have a DF in the first place. In vanilla i would be able to find groups by spamming trade, asking in guild, and psting Healer friends or tank friends i grouped with before on the server. You all seem to look at DF from the point of view in current WoW state. Where you have no server community at all. You completely ignore the fact that friends helped fill those spots for your dungeon.

    On top of not having a bunch of random people acting like complete ****s in the dungeon you were running it with people all in the same server who respected eachother to an extent and even formed lasting friendships. During vanilla I had a wide variety of people on my friends list that were good DPS good tanks or good heals that would do me the favor or healing a specific dungeon for me even though they weren't in the same guild as me. In essence the server was alot more close knit. Guilds knew other guilds. And people were known widely around the server. Sitting in trade spamming for a group was widely exaggerated. Sure i will agree lowbies were the only ones getting shafted with this type of system. But even then you had other friends who had same level lowbies who would also help out.

    When DF first came out in BC people were so widely against it. Pretty much telling blizzard how they will kill their own community with this feature. Blizzard reacted by implementing a DF that allowed other players to see which dungeon you wanted to run and what role you were able to fill. This feature was server only. Not only did this feature eliminate having to sit in trade asking for groups. It made finding groups even easier than it already was. This feature was extremely popular it was used all the way through BC and even halfway through Wotlk. It became a little too popular for its own good. Blizzard got it in their heads that they should improve and already popular tool and took it one step further. What they did with that patch they set in a chain of events that is not killing WoW and its own community. Dont believe me? Go check out the WoW forums. If it isnt QQ about how someone was being trolled in DF its QQ about how long the queues are, or about how the community feels lacking. Little do they all know its all because of 1 feature. Cross Server Dungeon Finder.

    Anyone saying that it took forever in WoW to find a group max level. Is only exaggerating. I know it. You know it. We all know it.

    Before you get on your little rampage about how wrong I am. And how My opinion doesnt matter because it doesn't match with yours. Let me lay down a few facts.

    You can't compare the time it takes to find groups in Rift because
    1. You are either not max level yet.
    2. This game alot less subscribers than WoW.

    My suggestion to Trion is if you are going to implement any sort of DF tool.
    Make Level 1-45 DF cross server.
    And make 45-50 DF Server Only.

    This will not only eliminate time spent trying to find a group for lowbies trying to level but its a compromise for people who dont want their server community to end up like WoW.

    You may now proceed to quote a passage of my text, reply to it in an attempt to force your opinion down my throat in the process of trying to get supporters for your own gain, while not offering any real solution or compromise at all.

    Good Day everyone.

    TL: DR Dungeon Finder should only be cross shard Level 1-45, then Shard only 45-50.

  2. #2
    Plane Touched BoneFlavoredGum's Avatar
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    Personally I'm against DF because it cuts down on communication. Sometimes you don't really know you want to go to a dungeon until you see that "LF1M, DPS, Bowelsofthenewyorksewersystem."
    Originally: Harrow (because it was the only one I could select) - Wicked, Dead, Atheist, Grunt.
    After Harrow shutdown: Briarcliff () Discordant, RedOctober(went to Seastone), DropnFbombs, Crappy
    After Briarcliff went trial: SeaStone() RenamedThreeTimes

  3. #3
    Soulwalker
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    why not just merge shards and make the LFD tool entirely same-shard
    boom pow blam problems solved.

  4. #4
    Soulwalker
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    Yeah, agreed on most points except one.

    Implement a cross shard DF for normal only, that way it eliminates issues from there being no one online to do instances on lower pop shards.

    Keep experts to LFG spam in general/level 50.
    Quote Originally Posted by Talamare View Post
    Everyone whos not a Warrior is ruining the game

    with their constant whining

  5. #5
    Rift Chaser Vokan's Avatar
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    It doesnt matter on my server. We only have a handful of 50's. If its not cross-server, then its useless since we all know if there is a group or not. We are lacking in healers and tanks so its hard to get a group.

    I have been 50 for several weeks. Never stepped foot in a dungeon yet and thats spamming LFG BARD Support/DPS, whatever. All night every night. If you are on Briarcliff or a high-pop server than you wouldnt understand.

    For all of you saying that I should just make my rogue a tank. Easier said than done when my gear is crap, and barely any way to upgrade when I cant get in a dungeon anyway.
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  6. #6
    Shadowlander
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vokan View Post
    It doesnt matter on my server. We only have a handful of 50's. If its not cross-server, then its useless since we all know if there is a group or not. We are lacking in healers and tanks so its hard to get a group.

    I have been 50 for several weeks. Never stepped foot in a dungeon yet and thats spamming LFG BARD Support/DPS, whatever. All night every night. If you are on Briarcliff or a high-pop server than you wouldnt understand.

    For all of you saying that I should just make my rogue a tank. Easier said than done when my gear is crap, and barely any way to upgrade when I cant get in a dungeon anyway.

    You are also forgetting you are 1 month into the game. The majority of the playerbase isn't even 50 yet. That might be why its hard to find groups at the moment.

  7. #7
    Soulwalker
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    Seriously though, definitely need server merges before we need a LFD tool. a LFD tool is nothing without people to actually queue up.

  8. #8
    Soulwalker
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    I confess that I agree with almost everything said by the OP. While a dungeon finder can be a cool tool it needs to stay server specific to maintain any server community. Personally I think WFs should be as well but that's a different issue.

  9. #9
    Rift Chaser Vokan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Electrical View Post
    You are also forgetting you are 1 month into the game. The majority of the playerbase isn't even 50 yet. That might be why its hard to find groups at the moment.
    More like a month and a half, almost 2 months with head-start. Seriously though even casual gamers got to 50 already. Must lower levels are alts and random people who just purchased the game.
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  10. #10
    Shadowlander
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vokan View Post
    More like a month and a half, almost 2 months with head-start. Seriously though even casual gamers got to 50 already. Must lower levels are alts and random people who just purchased the game.
    eMaking completely false assumptions wont help your cause. Ill be the first to say im not level 50 yet. I also wouldnt consider myself a casual player. I have 3 other alts about level 20 because i wanted to try out allcallings before i decided which was my main. Although im about 14 levels from cap. I know many others in my guild still on their first character who are not even as close to me to 50. You forget not everyone plays this game like you. I prefer to read the quest text and learn the lore of the game if im investing time. I gather mats for professions go rifting and even do warfronts at low level i dont see myself being level 50 within the next week or maybe 2 weeks. I agree server merges are needed at the moment. Maybe if they were done DF advocates would stop trying to turn this game into the crappy WoW community.
    Last edited by Electrical; 04-17-2011 at 10:51 PM.

  11. #11
    Rift Disciple Aalysha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Electrical View Post
    TL: DR Dungeon Finder should only be cross shard Level 1-45, then Shard only 45-50.
    Never thought of splitting it so lowbie could get easier runs.


    I wouldn't mind seeing this idea go through but may I add a tiny suggestion.

    If you are in queue longer then 15minutes, it allows you to get people from other servers.
    Just so low populated servers don't get shafted.
    Daemen - Cleric
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  12. #12
    Plane Walker Sardoni's Avatar
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    I didn't do an instance until level 48 just because chain CC runs were a good way to hit 50. Now I just hit K for WF queues.

    I agree something needs to be implemented to help people find groups easier, but I thought that's what guilds of like minded people were for o.o?

    PUGs across shards and ninja looters... I can just hear the pve drama now.......

    On second thought. Implement it. This game lacks drama.
    Last edited by Sardoni; 04-17-2011 at 10:54 PM.

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    Sardoni
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  13. #13
    Rift Disciple
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vokan View Post
    We are lacking in healers and tanks so its hard to get a group.
    This is every server and every MMO that uses the "holy trinity" Very few people want to tank or heal so you endup with a overpopulation of DPS and not enough tanks or healers to support them all.

    when 5% of the population tanks, 10% heals and 85% dps. and the intended dungeon split is 20% tanks/20% healers/60% DPSers your going to wait to get into a dungeon unless your a tank. A larger group really doesn't change much. the solution really is for everyone to play multiple roles.

    The only thing DF does (esp cross server) is devalue the social interaction and your need to keep a decent reputation.

    DF is BAD

  14. #14
    Ascendant xtorma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vokan View Post
    It doesnt matter on my server. We only have a handful of 50's. If its not cross-server, then its useless since we all know if there is a group or not. We are lacking in healers and tanks so its hard to get a group.

    I have been 50 for several weeks. Never stepped foot in a dungeon yet and thats spamming LFG BARD Support/DPS, whatever. All night every night. If you are on Briarcliff or a high-pop server than you wouldnt understand.

    For all of you saying that I should just make my rogue a tank. Easier said than done when my gear is crap, and barely any way to upgrade when I cant get in a dungeon anyway.
    From what i have read on this issue in the past month, this is what it boils down to. The anti-lfg lobby is afraid. When fear dictates the actions of a group of individuals, then there will always be people, such as yourself that have to suffer.

    It's not that they don't care about you , they just care about themselves much more. This selfish behavior is representitive of the community they are so fearful of losing to a cross shard dungeon finder.
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  15. #15
    Rift Disciple Aalysha's Avatar
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    5min edit rule ftl...

    The tool doesn't need too auto group you all up and teleport you to the dungeon. It just needs to list your name lvl and role you want to fill.

    If people are interested they'll send you an invite.
    Daemen - Cleric
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