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  Click here to go to the first Rift Team post in this thread.   Thread: PvP Warriors... grab your torches.

  1. #16
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    Glad to see Reaver getting some love, they need it. Reaver used to be one of must fun classes to play way way back when (pre HK) but its been good and crappy for a good long while. I hope they at least restore some of its former glory.
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  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daglar View Post
    Perhaps young grasshopper, one must put good abilities into currently poor soul trees on the road to making them good soul trees. There is more to come for the Reaver.

    ~Daglar
    This really should have been the first response...
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  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dementic View Post
    This really should have been the first response...
    No the first response should have been the realization that the patch notes on the PTS probably aren't finalized.
    Even free cost too much now

  4. #19
    Shield of Telara smoked's Avatar
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    Didn't reaver just get revamped not too long ago?

  5. #20
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    If you time infestations with delayed blast it can be amusing but it is not that strong in comparison .. the aoe of reaver is obsolete in pvp. I am not too sure where reaver fits in however since the change is melee base change and reaver does have many range options. I am thrilled they are giving the soul attention however. I'm wondering what they come up with I have experimented with it in pvp and it does actually have range potential(meaning it can become a viable range tank type of class that does debuffs snares and have rng burst potential), let us see where they take it.
    Last edited by Flashmemory; 03-15-2013 at 09:18 PM.

  6. #21
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    Am I the only one who sees the potential here?

    A warrior in among the enemy healers and reducing their zerg's healing output by 15%? Yes please. I am so glad that they haven't put that low in the tree.

  7. #22
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    Even a 76 point warrior tank will be leveled by a large (20-40 strong) zerg, between the CC's flying around and the constant aoes everywhere, your 45-50k HP in pvp gear in a full tank spec will still melt pretty fast.

    As far as the Reaver soul in general, I agree that it does need work, but to be fair, all of the warrior souls need work in one way or another.

    I am pretty sure that VK shields still scale for sh!t, several tank aoes have an animation delay causing mobs to just run by you, and for those of us who are not in near BiS raid gear, we are still "magically" considered the hardest to heal, even when using the "ideal specs" with "proper cooldown rotations". I dont know about you guys, but Im gonna take the word of my guild's 8 healers over 1-2 Regulos farming super geared warrior guru's saying that we are fine... No offense to our gurus of course.

    Back when 2.2 was on PTS, Kervik tried to adjust cleric aggro, but pulled the changes shortly before 2.2 launched. I wonder if 2.3 is going to include some tank adjustments and rebalancing this time. Warriors are still be forced to trade a 10% healing mod for more mit or more cooldowns... Yet Riftstalker and Justicar practically get that 10% bonus built in, AND naturally have more cooldowns, and more powerful cooldowns than warriors do.

    We've got the raid tank parsing dummies on PTS, Im thinking of grabbing my PTS warrior, rogue,and cleric, in full PTS tank gear, and just tanking the dummies for 10 minutes each, using all cooldowns, and see what we end up for with damage taken...

    I assure you, it will be nowhere near equal.

  8. #23
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    The negative replies to this thread sound like they are from the warrior type that does not play well with others. If your entire purpose is to be a killing god who doesn't work with your team, then Reaver is not for you.

    Reaver is a debuffer in this case, one that can lock down enemy players for others to kill. It has great value in team play, but as so many of the PvP players are focused on solo play and being viable on their own, they completely ignore potential team play utility.

    I wouldn't expect the masses who PvP in Rift to appreciate abilities like this, or the old support options Warriors once had and were lost (subdue, phalanx, etc etc) since they never try to coordinate with anyone... Your K/D might not be amazing as a Reaver, but using your utility properly and combining it with another couple players on your team could make this ability (and other reaver abilities) have great synergy for PvP.
    Last edited by Patchkid; 03-16-2013 at 05:36 AM.

  9. #24
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    On the pvp side, unless they also add a host of other debuffs, like target does 10% less damage when they have a dot on them, then 48 Reaver is not going to be particularly useful in the current pvp metagame. Most targets are at range and moving, easy to move out of ground aoes if you arent being an idiot, and out of range of our harder hitting abilities.
    On the CQ end of things, most zerg fights occur 30-35m apart, even with points in Tempest for an extra 5m range, a Reaver will still have to joust out into the fray to drop a puddle or dots even on the front line, much less the back line where the healers are... Course they could get tabbed to and yanked in just as fast.

    On the pve side, I am going to be perfectly blunt and say that I am worried that Bindings of Death will move from its 51 point slot into a 61 point slot. Right now the ONLY reason that Reaver is good as a tank spec is that you can get all the mit from the Reaver soul, plus Pacification from Paladin at 18 points, plus Void from 0 VK. This adds up to the most melee mit, and by far the most magic mit.
    If we lose the ability to spec into Pacification when running a properly optimized Reaver, then the build falls below Paladin and VK in all forms of mitigation, utility, and cooldowns.

    So again I want to reiterate. If the devs really want us to use 61 point tank builds, then the souls have to be designed as such.
    That means no low hanging mitigation talents. That means each tank spec should have a 20%, 30-35%, and 50-75% self shield cooldown. Each spec should have a 10% incoming healing multiplier, etc. Right now we are deemed the worse tanks to heal, even though on paper we have the most armor, 2nd highest resists, and the most melee and magic mitigation... but for that we trade a 10% healing mod, or we lose cooldowns. This needs to be fixed.

    Daglar says there is more to come for Reaver, that is good and all, but if this ends up messing up the already frail tanking dynamic, we are gonna be in trouble.
    Last edited by kenji1134; 03-16-2013 at 05:52 AM.

  10. #25
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    Honestly what they should do with Reaver is either remove Flesh Rot (no clue why it was even added; just another button to press) or make it do what Pacification does if you have 61 points in Reaver (i.e. add it to Binding of the Devouring Dark or whatever that one is called) to offset the loss of Pacification. I hate Reaver as a tank soul because it's clunky; you have way too many AP builders that you need to keep up (AB, SS, NW, BF, Pac from Pally, FR) so you spend most of the time refreshing dots. It doesn't need half as many abilities as it does; a few of them can and should be consolidated similar to how BoJ and BoR are for Inquisitors (you use BoJ until you get BoR, at which point it replaces it entirely but BoJ now can be used on the move). Maybe even make Flesh Rot be direct damage and not a dot so it offers more ranged tanking (like the Justicar's new ability they got in SL) and roll some additional mitigation into Blood Fever.

    Reaver as a concept is neat but it doesn't play right. I'd rather see it become the offensive tank with high damage output and low physical mitigation (which it was originally meant to be in SL, I had thought) or become how Void Knight was originally billed in Chocolate, as an anti-caster tank.

    I also hope they address other tanking issues (e.g. VK absorbs being rubbish, Paladin absorb not being worth anything at all) in the future as well.
    Last edited by wayne62682; 03-16-2013 at 06:05 AM.
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  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by kenji1134 View Post
    On the pvp side, unless they also add a host of other debuffs, like target does 10% less damage when they have a dot on them, then 48 Reaver is not going to be particularly useful in the current pvp metagame. Most targets are at range and moving, easy to move out of ground aoes if you arent being an idiot, and out of range of our harder hitting abilities.
    On the CQ end of things, most zerg fights occur 30-35m apart, even with points in Tempest for an extra 5m range, a Reaver will still have to joust out into the fray to drop a puddle or dots even on the front line, much less the back line where the healers are... Course they could get tabbed to and yanked in just as fast.

    On the pve side, I am going to be perfectly blunt and say that I am worried that Bindings of Death will move from its 51 point slot into a 61 point slot. Right now the ONLY reason that Reaver is good as a tank spec is that you can get all the mit from the Reaver soul, plus Pacification from Paladin at 18 points, plus Void from 0 VK. This adds up to the most melee mit, and by far the most magic mit.
    If we lose the ability to spec into Pacification when running a properly optimized Reaver, then the build falls below Paladin and VK in all forms of mitigation, utility, and cooldowns.

    So again I want to reiterate. If the devs really want us to use 61 point tank builds, then the souls have to be designed as such.
    That means no low hanging mitigation talents. That means each tank spec should have a 20%, 30-35%, and 50-75% self shield cooldown. Each spec should have a 10% incoming healing multiplier, etc. Right now we are deemed the worse tanks to heal, even though on paper we have the most armor, 2nd highest resists, and the most melee and magic mitigation... but for that we trade a 10% healing mod, or we lose cooldowns. This needs to be fixed.

    Daglar says there is more to come for Reaver, that is good and all, but if this ends up messing up the already frail tanking dynamic, we are gonna be in trouble.
    Reaver has the rotation potential in a number of builds..actually very fun and not too hard to manage.. just the damage output is so inferior that you are forced into less dynamic rotations from other builds. Reaver has some awesome rotations when paired with temp and/or rb. I haven't tried with the physical specs simply because the synergy is nowhere to be found.. One thing I don't like about some souls for each class..is when talents that boost other talents show up before the boosted talent shows up in the soul trees. It happens regularly. Those booster talents should have a secondary effect or a placement change.
    Last edited by Flashmemory; 03-16-2013 at 07:58 AM.

  12. #27
    Ascendant Killian26's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raviel View Post
    nerfing shock pulse at 0pt for pvp, would impact pve greatly.
    no it wouldn't...I swear sometimes you people just say **** to say it.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daglar View Post
    Perhaps young grasshopper, one must put good abilities into currently poor soul trees on the road to making them good soul trees. There is more to come for the Reaver.

    ~Daglar
    as someone who has long loved reaver. cant wait to see the changes.
    Drakkles - Warrior - Jynxed
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  14. #29
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    See, I've always been one of those people who thought the concept of Reaver seemed awesome, but the execution of it made the soul too much of a hassle to use. Underwhelming, I suppose.

    Anyway, if there are changes to make it more playable down the road, I'd be super glad for them.
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  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drathek View Post
    as someone who has long loved reaver. cant wait to see the changes.
    sadly they fail more than they succeed.....just look at the state of our dps and how out of whack it is.

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