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  Click here to go to the first Rift Team post in this thread.   Thread: Beastlord will they make it better?

  1.   This is the last Rift Team post in this thread.   #16
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    Check out the PTS forum for info about some Beast Master changes.

    ~Daglar

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    Prophet of Telara Lewin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daglar View Post
    Check out the PTS forum for info about some Beast Master changes.

    ~Daglar
    Some of those changes look almost too good to.be honest, mainly the heal (percentage based heals are almost always overpowered) and the purge on a spamable builder.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lewin View Post
    Some of those changes look almost too good to.be honest, mainly the heal (percentage based heals are almost always overpowered) and the purge on a spamable builder.
    I did a large writeup already about how messed up these changes are, but it wouldn't let me post it. I'll stick to PMs even though I think Allion hates me now :-P
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bloodbourne View Post
    I did a large writeup already about how messed up these changes are, but it wouldn't let me post it. I'll stick to PMs even though I think Allion hates me now :-P
    the rest of the changes look fine, and letting them have a ranged.builder and finisher with out having to go 2 temp is nice, and while warriors do need another purge somewhere, putting it on a spammable builder in the support soul doesn't seem like the best idea. I see the heal being easily abused as with 3 wars doing it they could easily keep it always running, while doing reasonable dps unless it has an immunity debuff of 20 seconds you could very nearly tank heal with them.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lewin View Post
    the rest of the changes look fine, and letting them have a ranged.builder and finisher with out having to go 2 temp is nice, and while warriors do need another purge somewhere, putting it on a spammable builder in the support soul doesn't seem like the best idea. I see the heal being easily abused as with 3 wars doing it they could easily keep it always running, while doing reasonable dps unless it has an immunity debuff of 20 seconds you could very nearly tank heal with them.

    the ranged builder and finisher is amazing. helps alot with using different soul builds which is great.
    spammable purge is also great. i dont see the complaint, archons can spammable purge right now as well (aoe), it does have a short cast time but still puts us closer to equal there. plus if you are spamming it you will lose a LOT of bleed uptime if you arent careful.
    i cant see the heal being abused like you say. thats crazy sorry. not in pve anyhow, no guild would run 3 BM's just to rotate a heal every 7 seconds, which only hits 5 people. if anything its only adding a bit of much needed healing support from the BM for 5 man dungeons which will get all the BM haters out of the way in terms of the lfg tool.

    changes sound fantastic to me personally.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drathek View Post
    the ranged builder and finisher is amazing. helps alot with using different soul builds which is great.
    spammable purge is also great. i dont see the complaint, archons can spammable purge right now as well (aoe), it does have a short cast time but still puts us closer to equal there. plus if you are spamming it you will lose a LOT of bleed uptime if you arent careful.
    i cant see the heal being abused like you say. thats crazy sorry. not in pve anyhow, no guild would run 3 BM's just to rotate a heal every 7 seconds, which only hits 5 people. if anything its only adding a bit of much needed healing support from the BM for 5 man dungeons which will get all the BM haters out of the way in terms of the lfg tool.

    changes sound fantastic to me personally.
    Rogues used to have a spammable purge, every other class complained about it and now it has a cd. As far as the heal thing, while I admit it is farfetched, percentage based heals, especially on tanks, are extremely powerful. If you can get 3 warriors running bm doing 10k each, combined able to replace a tank healer, and maintaining a rediculous amount of uptime on enrage... I just see it as being op as hell, now it may not work out that way, but it does at least need to.be considered.
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    If these changes go through mostly how they are it's going to make Beastmaster pretty similar to my old LOTRO Captain... This has me super excited.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lewin View Post
    Rogues used to have a spammable purge, every other class complained about it and now it has a cd. As far as the heal thing, while I admit it is farfetched, percentage based heals, especially on tanks, are extremely powerful. If you can get 3 warriors running bm doing 10k each, combined able to replace a tank healer, and maintaining a rediculous amount of uptime on enrage... I just see it as being op as hell, now it may not work out that way, but it does at least need to.be considered.
    The purge removes 1 buff per activation with 1.5 sec gcd, has 20 meter range and requires heavy point investment in... beastmaster. I doubt it will turn into an OP pvp pwnmachine. It is nowhere near the old erradicate.

    The heal hits 5 people. If you have 3 beastmasters in an expert rotating their op 5 man heal enabling the healer to go dps, you're not really getting anywhere you wouldn't get otherwise. It's not like you can rely on it to do focused healing with 10 people let alone 20.
    Last edited by Vrab; 03-19-2013 at 06:18 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vrab View Post
    The purge removes 1 buff per activation with 1.5 sec gcd, has 20 meter range and requires heavy point investment in... beastmaster. I doubt it will turn into an OP pvp pwnmachine. It is nowhere near the old erradicate.

    The heal hits 5 people. If you have 3 beastmasters in an expert rotating their op 5 man heal enabling the healer to go dps, you're not really getting anywhere you wouldn't get otherwise. It's not like you can rely on it to do focused healing with 10 people let alone 20.
    I do worry about the purge -- if it was melee it would probably be fine but even a 20 meter range makes it a bit too much. Speaking strictly of PvE here.

    As for the heal, it kind of makes sense -- helps BM in the role of support heals in 5-mans, while not providing much in raids with larger groups. My question is just whether it heals enough or too much, don't want it to be worthless or OP in 5-mans. Primarily though, is it a percentage of the BM's health or the target's health? The latter could definitely be OP since it would be healing the tank.
    Last edited by TheGrinnz; 03-19-2013 at 09:29 AM.

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    Overall, the changes look very good, this should be a significant bump in BM DPS. The changes to Messy Wounds (+7.5%) and Cunning Ruse (+~8%) should be about a +15% DPS gain.

    If Guardianship is 15% of the BM's max health, its an excellent change. Sure, you could cheese it by wearing tank gear, but that would cripple your DPS. 15% of each player's max health is a potential issue with tanks.

    The ranged abilities are great, and thank you for the change to Claw Swipe.

    Absolution may have issues with PvP, especially in CQ. I can definitely see a BM running around just spamming that to remove buffs in between Enrages. If there's a way to make it so the Purge effect only happens once every 4 sec that would be about ideal.
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheGrinnz View Post
    As for the heal, it kind of makes sense -- helps BM in the role of support heals in 5-mans, while not providing much in raids with larger groups. My question is just whether it heals enough or too much, don't want it to be worthless or OP in 5-mans. Primarily though, is it a percentage of the BM's health or the target's health? The latter could definitely be OP since it would be healing the tank.
    I don't think that healing a tank for 7-9k hp every 20 seconds (so if it's target's health) followed by a 6 second hot will trivialize 5 man healing any more than anyone else going support would. It still won't tank heal on it's own. Would be a sort of a panic button at best. Most bosses in experts hit tanks for about 10k per swing anyway.
    Last edited by Vrab; 03-19-2013 at 10:20 AM.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carinae View Post
    Overall, the changes look very good, this should be a significant bump in BM DPS. The changes to Messy Wounds (+7.5%) and Cunning Ruse (+~8%) should be about a +15% DPS gain.

    If Guardianship is 15% of the BM's max health, its an excellent change. Sure, you could cheese it by wearing tank gear, but that would cripple your DPS. 15% of each player's max health is a potential issue with tanks.

    The ranged abilities are great, and thank you for the change to Claw Swipe.

    Absolution may have issues with PvP, especially in CQ. I can definitely see a BM running around just spamming that to remove buffs in between Enrages. If there's a way to make it so the Purge effect only happens once every 4 sec that would be about ideal.

    Having the purge not happen every time basically makes it useless on fights where you need to purge at certain times, and having it on a builder that you are going to be using for the pet damage increase is problematic as well as there are times you don't want to purge things (black ghosts between matriarch and gorloch for example) I think bm getting a purge is great, but it really should be its own seperate ability.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vrab View Post
    I don't think that healing a tank for 7-9k hp every 20 seconds (so if it's target's health) followed by a 6 second hot will trivialize 5 man healing any more than anyone else going support would. It still won't tank heal on it's own. Would be a sort of a panic button at best. Most bosses in experts hit tanks for about 10k per swing anyway.
    It would still be a bit much. It is a lot easier to balance when based on the caster's HP, like every other power they've changed to be this way.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lewin View Post
    Having the purge not happen every time basically makes it useless on fights where you need to purge at certain times, and having it on a builder that you are going to be using for the pet damage increase is problematic as well as there are times you don't want to purge things (black ghosts between matriarch and gorloch for example) I think bm getting a purge is great, but it really should be its own seperate ability.
    Agreed... putting it on Fierce Strike isn't a very good idea to begin with, just give them a new ability. 20m range purge, 4-10s cooldown. Then you can make it really cool sounding too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lewin View Post
    Having the purge not happen every time basically makes it useless on fights where you need to purge at certain times, and having it on a builder that you are going to be using for the pet damage increase is problematic as well as there are times you don't want to purge things (black ghosts between matriarch and gorloch for example) I think bm getting a purge is great, but it really should be its own seperate ability.
    Fierce Strike isn't your main builder in a BM build, Vicious Blow is, so having an internal CD on the purge is fine, since you shouldn't be spamming Fierce Strike. You'd just have to time it, which isn't really a big deal.

    Please, please, don't add another ability to BM. Its already incredibly overloaded with keybinds, adding another just makes things worse.
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