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  Click here to go to the first Rift Team post in this thread.   Thread: Some upcoming Buffs and Fixes for 2.1

  1.   Click here to go to the next Rift Team post in this thread.   #661
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    I see a lot of suggestions to just raise numbers or buff to where Rogue or Mage are. Any changes I make must go through our mechanics team here to validate their balance, I cannot just raise damage numbers until you guys see them correctly, I have to hit certain specific targets, if I am over those targets or even at those targets I can't raise those numbers anymore. This is a system of checks and balances to keep us from entering into an arms race and keep things as balanced as we can. OP builds get brought back down as well as their calling developers look at them and evaluate them and put it through our testing process. So as I make changes, be aware that I am not making changes to hit Rogue numbers or Mage numbers, I am shooting at a specific target. if you are not hitting their numbers then it may not be that you are below targets, it may be that they are way above targets and that they may be getting a nerf here in the near future. I cannot speak to that because it is being handled by the specific Calling devs.

    I will continue to shoot at these targets and get as close as possible. But I wanted to explain why it is that I seem to only be worried about the Warrior souls in relation to one another.

  2. #662
    Shield of Telara Kaybriar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atrius View Post
    I see a lot of suggestions to just raise numbers or buff to where Rogue or Mage are. Any changes I make must go through our mechanics team here to validate their balance, I cannot just raise damage numbers until you guys see them correctly, I have to hit certain specific targets, if I am over those targets or even at those targets I can't raise those numbers anymore. This is a system of checks and balances to keep us from entering into an arms race and keep things as balanced as we can. OP builds get brought back down as well as their calling developers look at them and evaluate them and put it through our testing process. So as I make changes, be aware that I am not making changes to hit Rogue numbers or Mage numbers, I am shooting at a specific target. if you are not hitting their numbers then it may not be that you are below targets, it may be that they are way above targets and that they may be getting a nerf here in the near future. I cannot speak to that because it is being handled by the specific Calling devs.

    I will continue to shoot at these targets and get as close as possible. But I wanted to explain why it is that I seem to only be worried about the Warrior souls in relation to one another.
    That makes sense and I respect that. But what if the specific Calling devs in question are unaware what their callings are doing?

    Edit: Also, please take a look at the buff Grounded. The fact that in raids we lose 25% damage off the top + the loss of charged pulse due to movement only exacerbates the disparity between us and other ranged classes. Of course you will not see this on the dummy. Try running around and performing your tempest rotation. You will be surprised at the result.
    Last edited by Kaybriar; 12-07-2012 at 05:37 PM.
    Kaybye ~

  3. #663
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atrius View Post
    I see a lot of suggestions to just raise numbers or buff to where Rogue or Mage are. Any changes I make must go through our mechanics team here to validate their balance, I cannot just raise damage numbers until you guys see them correctly, I have to hit certain specific targets, if I am over those targets or even at those targets I can't raise those numbers anymore. This is a system of checks and balances to keep us from entering into an arms race and keep things as balanced as we can. OP builds get brought back down as well as their calling developers look at them and evaluate them and put it through our testing process. So as I make changes, be aware that I am not making changes to hit Rogue numbers or Mage numbers, I am shooting at a specific target. if you are not hitting their numbers then it may not be that you are below targets, it may be that they are way above targets and that they may be getting a nerf here in the near future. I cannot speak to that because it is being handled by the specific Calling devs.

    I will continue to shoot at these targets and get as close as possible. But I wanted to explain why it is that I seem to only be worried about the Warrior souls in relation to one another.
    Thanks for that explanation. It makes sense that your hands are tied in some respects so there won't be an arms race.

    Regardless, get RB back to the level it was at =D

    Also, a quality of life change for paragon would be nice. No change to the dps, but change the CD's, etc to lessen the amount of buttons you have to press for a min/max rotation. As a melee it is tough dodging all mechanics and running a ~10 button spec.

  4. #664
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    Quote Originally Posted by Betoguerra View Post
    I can't believe you just said that. Take your job seriously. Please. You do understand that a game is supposed to be made fun right? By nerfing us to the ground and not re-buffing to EQUAL to everyone else you are making this game not fun as a warrior. Our raid (a top raiding guild) takes 1 warrior tank and 3 dps warriors. That is it. And this is a guild committed to 5/5/5/5. Get this **** done before 2.1 or your reputation is done for in this community.
    I am not sure how "top raiding guilds" work, but taking one less warrior to gain a competitive edge on a boss is HARDLY something you need to get this riled up about. Especially as, I presume, the other warriors are using the same specs and have worked just as hard as the next warrior; and if you can't gain the edge over them, that's not Atrius' problem.

    If they take no warriors or only one DPS warrior, then that's Atrius' problem.

    As for why he said that, I strongly believe he meant it with respect to answering that he cannot do anything about their DPS behind ahead of the warriors - he didn't say anything with respect to how he cannot do anything about ours.

    For a class leader coming forward and asking us what we see, and telling us what he sees, is something I respect him for, and any warrior with any inclination to make it better for this class will respect what he's doing. He's trying to resolve this; and he's actively working at it. From his summary alone, we can easily infer that he is following this thread and taking everything seriously.

    So give him a break, okay? This is Rift's FIRST expansion, there will be bugs, there will be errors, there will be problems. That is how MMOs are and have always been.
    If you can't be considerate or have the patience, then I suggest you stop playing until all the dust settles.

  5. #665
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    So am I right then atrius? ...or do the callings have different targets for damage, or did I misread that?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaybriar View Post
    It's because it is. Please compare the top lvl 60 rb rotation to the top lvl 60 para rotation. It's not even close.
    RB - Three buffs and two DoTs to maintain and that's not even including Rift Implosion or Burst Synergy from going 61pts.

    Paragon - Three Buffs, one DoT (2 if you take FB), SB and Combat Focus. Final Blessing can be macro'd without macro lag. Death Touch is a builder and as such I don't count it.

    Paragon has seven things to maintain and RB has 5. Paragon also has a 1s gcd so it's more forgiving at 61pts. RB just has a more streamlined rotation.

    Now I'm not disagreeing that Paragon suffers a massive dps loss from DC's and RB doesn't because that just wouldnt be true, but that's something that Atrius needs to work on because it's a gameplay issue within the Paragon soul and has nothing to do with whether or not it's more "advanced" than RB.

  7.   Click here to go to the next Rift Team post in this thread.   #667
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    Quote Originally Posted by MNM View Post
    So am I right then atrius? ...or do the callings have different targets for damage, or did I misread that?
    We have the same targets.

  8. #668
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    Quote Originally Posted by Solaxys View Post

    If they take no warriors or only one DPS warrior, then that's Atrius' problem.
    http://forums.riftgame.com/avatars/i...ine=1354855110
    Kaybye ~

  9. #669
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    Was referring to the person to whom I replied to.

    I am not saying Warriors aren't at the end of the chain; just his argument was invalid.

  10. #670
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    Quote Originally Posted by Solaxys View Post

    As for why he said that, I strongly believe he meant it with respect to answering that he cannot do anything about their DPS behind ahead of the warriors - he didn't say anything with respect to how he cannot do anything about ours.

    For a class leader coming forward and asking us what we see, and telling us what he sees, is something I respect him for, and any warrior with any inclination to make it better for this class will respect what he's doing. He's trying to resolve this; and he's actively working at it. From his summary alone, we can easily infer that he is following this thread and taking everything seriously.

    So give him a break, okay? This is Rift's FIRST expansion, there will be bugs, there will be errors, there will be problems. That is how MMOs are and have always been.
    If you can't be considerate or have the patience, then I suggest you stop playing until all the dust settles.
    /Agree

    Atrius is taking a lot of heat. Some of it is deserved, but a lot of blame is for things out of his control.

  11. #671
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killian26 View Post
    Final Blessing can be macro'd without macro lag.
    no

    /10 char
    Kaybye ~

  12. #672
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atrius View Post
    We have the same targets.
    Whatever those targets are compared to other classes I can assure you we are performing well below it compared to other callings especially with range

  13. #673
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atrius View Post
    They may be getting a nerf here in the near future. I cannot speak to that because it is being handled by the specific Calling devs.
    Guess this will come after most bugs are fixed and I would guess we are speaking about a time between 2.2 and 2.3 or later....too late in my opinion. Guess to better not expect something good from 2.1 for melee dps....still using Tempest and giving the raid 5% more range crit.

  14.   Click here to go to the next Rift Team post in this thread.   #674
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    Quick Update. This is all very early info I just wanted to share with you all because of how upsetting this kind of thing can be. I have been running tests again after reading concerns here. Some kind of bug has been introduced, the parses I am running this afternoon are WELL below where they were before pushing up to PTS on both Riftblade and Paragon. Tempest appears ok. This is likely what you guys are seeing. I am continuing to look into it. Will post more info when I have it for you.

  15. #675
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiika View Post
    Whatever those targets are compared to other classes I can assure you we are performing well below it compared to other callings especially with range
    This. 10000x this.

    Please evaluate Grounded. It only makes it worse.
    Kaybye ~

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