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Thread: Raid consumables

  1. #1
    Soulwalker
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    Default Raid consumables

    I've done GP and DH, but recently joined a guild to do the 20-man stuff. What type of consumables should I bring as a dps warrior? I'm going with a powersurge vial for str/dex and that thing that drops from Chronicles that has a chance to do xx damage on a melee attack (usable on a 2hander). I also usually have insoles equipped cause I like the extra run speed. Is there anything else I should be looking for?

    Thanks,

  2. #2
    Telaran
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    Get yourself some oilstones that add 10 dps to your weapon instead of that chronicle enchant. Also cupcakes from icewatch. The powersurge vials you mentioned and maybe some potions of critical strikes. That should be it.

  3. #3
    Rift Master
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    Exquisite Oilstone/2Whetstones
    Heroic Powersurge Vial
    Icewatch Cupcakes or Gravemaker Steak
    Insoles are also good
    Heroic Healing Philters are awesome.

  4. #4
    Rift Disciple
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    Imo Mighty Powersurge is enough, the extra 5 str/dex from Heroic is not enough to warrant the cost... like i said, imo.

  5. #5
    Soulwalker
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    Thanks everyone, I appreciate the help.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drexa View Post
    Imo Mighty Powersurge is enough, the extra 5 str/dex from Heroic is not enough to warrant the cost... like i said, imo.
    For new or very difficult encounters? Everyone should give their best and try very hard to kill that mofo.

    TLDR: kinda-rant about the attitude towards raiding (esp. from new recruits)

    Sure, it won't often make such a huge difference. After all, what can it hurt when the DPSers are doing a little less DPS, the healers are healing a little less and have less mana, the tanks have 5 endurance less... and why stop there? Why would it hurt for a DPSer to just use fine whetstones? After all it is just 2 weapon DPS, right? And Bufffood? It is just 10 stamina, if my HP get that low it was the healer's fault anyways. Healing Philters, Mana Potions, Speed Pots? Naah, too expensive. The others will surely balance it out if I'm oom. What, I'm dead? Why didn't the healers heal enough?
    Next step would be: Why should I enchant those items or *gasp* even farm notoriety for fraction runes?

    For me it really is this way: You're using all or nothing.
    If one person in the raid uses everything at their disposal, everyone should do so.
    Sure, if you are in old or trivial farm content you don't really need it. Then a 35 flask might be appropiate but everything else should still be used to guarantee that you get it done quickly.
    On progress (or other hard) encounters everyone should use everything that is at their disposal to kill that mofo.

    I know for many people it is very different (like our recruits we got before final raid disband) but for me it is about the attitude towards raiding. For me, raiding means doing it with complete dedication and not in some half-assed way and this dedication starts for me with getting the best raid consumables and giving my best.
    Other people might prefer showing up to a raid without having read strategies and with only fine whetstones and a few 35 flasks. But really, it begins with consumables and ends in "sorry, I didn't know there would be fire on the ground and I should avoid that big *** laser. Can someone explain the strat?" or even just not paying enough attention to the raid because you're watching youtube or TV while standing in fire and messing up rotations. Because after all it doesn't cost anything and the others will probably compensate for it, so no need to worry.
    Last edited by rofltehcat; 11-05-2011 at 08:41 AM.

  7. #7
    Rift Disciple
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    Wow, i have just witnessed true PMS on the forum..

    Had a wipenight or something, forgot chillpill?

    Missed the "Imo" i typed twice?


    Im guessing most guilds are fine with the 35 pots, since most guilds dont go all out, since they usually have a life outside the game.

    The rest of your rant was amazing though, i wish i felt like you about the game, like i was playing the best game ever again, sadly that feeling ended with trials of atlantis in daoc..

    Btw, those extra 5 really make people better at avoiding lasers? In that case ill buy a few for some people..

  8. #8
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    Hah, no. Was just bored and then I start ranting because half my guild quit the game. And it was mainly the half that came to raids well-prepared and always gave their best.
    The post wasn't directed against you or anyone even though it was a reply to your post so don't feel attacked or anything ;)
    Maybe it inspires a few people because I feel like the general population's attitude towards playing your best (and sparing no expense, money is so easy in this game anyways) and improving constantly to achieve something (before it is trivial) isn't very good. Instead there are many threads on the forums to make everything easier.

    And yeah, a lot of people see raiding very differently. But when I get together with 19 people for a few hours I might as well give my best instead of being there just in a half-assed way. Sadly, not many people see it like this. Raiding with 20 focused people that give their best is awesome. Raiding when half your raid isn't really there is a torture.

    And yeah, heroic vials and using a huge amount of consumables won't make people step out of fire faster but if someone is using everything possible they are probably also giving their best and focusing on the encounter. Because hey, you're spending a lot of plat on that evening. Might as well enjoy it and make it enjoyable for the rest of the raid.

  9. #9
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    The only reason vials cost platinum is because MMO players are infinitely more emotional than analytical. It's a mark of a gullible player to champion them at all. No reasonable, intelligent player should actually be defending their use. They're more of a...well what else am i supposed to do with money? sort of argument.

    Dex/crit vials are cosmetic vanity symbols. Don't let anyone tell you differently. Certainly don't let anyone tell you there's a bit of difference in heroic and mighty vials; that's just PURE posturing. Vials won't even increase your DPS by 20/s, and in no real way is 20/s dps going to make any sort of difference for your team. The dps difference between heroic vials versus mighty is less than 5. Five.

    My honest advice for the progression warrior:
    New to GSB: Use an oilstone for johlen day.
    New to RoS: Use an oilstone for plutonus day.
    Don't even use consumables in 10 men. Waste of your money.

    If you're going to use consumables in the face of limited platinum, buy oilstones. These can actually matter.
    Cupcakes are the next economic choice even though they will never matter.
    If platinum is no issue, add the vanity pieces. They will never help you in reality or make any difference, but if your shell is vain enough to care about such things you will be wearing the right brands at least, and you'll never be able to convince such gullible players that those items don't do anything significant but burn a hole in your pocket.

    Don't let anyone tell you differently. And boy will they try.

  10. #10
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    As far as vials being an "attitude" thing about the people who don't use them (they're cheap, they're not committed, they're not trying)...worse insults can be said for those who do.

    Because when I see a raider posturing about these worthless consumables, I just chuckle. It's vain. It's futile. It's mindless consumerism and elitism which defiens the MMO demographic perfectly. I have much more respect for a raider who accurately depicts these consumables as cosmetic than I do one who *actually* thinks they matter or the message their use sends matters.

    The real message their use sends is that you didn't really think, you just consumed. Or you have nothing left to spend money on.

    Only the latter is a real reason to use any more consumables than DPS. Tanks exempted. Cupcakes don't even have a real utility, although come on. They're cupcakes everyone likes cupcakes.
    Last edited by PFalcon; 11-07-2011 at 08:55 AM.

  11. #11
    Champion of Telara
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    In Rift, plat is beyond easy to come by even for the most casual that its silly to hoard it. Might as well use it on consumables. Hell I even blow coin on Gloamsilk Poison cause that 0.4 extra DPS is ubah =P

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaylonn View Post
    In Rift, plat is beyond easy to come by even for the most casual that its silly to hoard it. Might as well use it on consumables. Hell I even blow coin on Gloamsilk Poison cause that 0.4 extra DPS is ubah =P
    So long as you're arguing that they're for players with nothing left to use plat on, it's fine. This implies that none of your game time is spent actually uniquely spent affording all these consumables, otherwise they're not "easy to come by" at all. Usually players make this sort of strawman argument as an addendum to their opinion that they actually affect performance outcomes.

    Very rarely do you see a player who solely argues pro-consumables simply because they're easy to afford. In fact, I bet you never see it. You either argue that they are vanity or that they are important. Arguing that they are easy is essentially arguing that they are important. Arguing that they are expensive is arguing that they are not.

    Critically thinking, you are better off giving your platinum to the guild to buy storage space than you are buying raid consumables. Does your guild have full inventory space? You are better off twinking your undergeared rookies. Do you have raid members with purchaseable upgrades left?

    And if you farm for consumable platinum in any way, you are better off doing something else other than maintaining posture and image.

    There's really no functional defense for consumables. Oilstones, whetstones, and tank consumables withstanding criticism because they really can matter.

    The only real defense is a comical, superficial one...that you really have nothing left to do than sport vanity. Any more pro-consumable than that...and you've breached gullable.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by PFalcon View Post
    So long as you're arguing that they're for players with nothing left to use plat on, it's fine. This implies that none of your game time is spent actually uniquely spent affording all these consumables, otherwise they're not "easy to come by" at all. Usually players make this sort of strawman argument as an addendum to their opinion that they actually affect performance outcomes.

    Very rarely do you see a player who solely argues pro-consumables simply because they're easy to afford. In fact, I bet you never see it. You either argue that they are vanity or that they are important. Arguing that they are easy is essentially arguing that they are important. Arguing that they are expensive is arguing that they are not.

    Critically thinking, you are better off giving your platinum to the guild to buy storage space than you are buying raid consumables. Does your guild have full inventory space? You are better off twinking your undergeared rookies. Do you have raid members with purchaseable upgrades left?

    And if you farm for consumable platinum in any way, you are better off doing something else other than maintaining posture and image.

    There's really no functional defense for consumables. Oilstones, whetstones, and tank consumables withstanding criticism because they really can matter.

    The only real defense is a comical, superficial one...that you really have nothing left to do than sport vanity. Any more pro-consumable than that...and you've breached gullable.
    I don't farm plat.....what I get I get from whatever I normally run around doing and vendoring crap loot. I don't go out specifically to harvest.......but ill pick up anything that I step over while I am out doing rifts, etc. Its more than enough make all consumables I need.

    More bank space for our guild would be for.........yep consumables and runes =P

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaylonn View Post
    I don't farm plat.....what I get I get from whatever I normally run around doing and vendoring crap loot. I don't go out specifically to harvest.......but ill pick up anything that I step over while I am out doing rifts, etc. Its more than enough make all consumables I need.

    More bank space for our guild would be for.........yep consumables and runes =P
    Guild space is still more important than vanity consumables, which is effectively just throwing the money away for the pretense of an image.

    Assuming you raid 3 days a week: Day 1: DH and GP Day 2: GSB Day 3: RoS or Day 1: RoS Day 2 and 3: HK
    18 platinum for oilstones @ 6p each.
    6 platinum for vials if you use two a raid. Not even going to bother assuming you use heroics.
    Loose change for cupcakes.

    24 platinum a week for an honestly casual raider. 50+ platinum a week for more focussed raiding.

    You're probably grinding for sourcestones like everyone else if you incidentally make that much in a week. That is, you have supplemental income.

    Even if you do incidentally net 25p a week, it's still money straight down a drain. "cheap" "easy" is just a strawman argument pro-consumables considering the fact that they impart ZERO performance outcome to their advocates. This argument only breaks even when consumables become free...that is you're paying nothing for nothing.

    That you're paying anything for nothing isn't a credit or an argument.

  15. #15
    Soulwalker
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    Keep your elder tablets. Those help out with energy regen a little in case you're energy starved.

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