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Thread: Rogue: Assassin Feedback by Randytherogue

  1. #1
    Telaran vVvKraftdinner's Avatar
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    Question Rogue: Assassin Feedback by Randytherogue

    Hey everyone, this is my first post in the Rogue Forums but I thought I'd join you all in our journey to make this a better game.

    The Assassin, you'd think would be one of the most powerful melee classes in the game.
    Currently, it's just above average because of a few flaws I have noticed while playing Beta 5 and 6.


    NEW LIST:
    Ideas
    • Incapacitate and Last Hope should not break stealth in PvP. (Said to be fixed)
    • Poison Malice - reduced cooldown or increased duration. Does not break stealth would be ideal.
    • Hidden Veil - passive instead of activated.
    • Poison Mastery - 2/4/6/8/10 % (4/8/12/16/20 % ?)
    • Serrated Blades - back to 100/200/300% Melee ( Ranged 50/100/150%)
    • Blinding Powder - Reduce chance to hit by a % for 3 seconds after the Blind wears off.
    • Assassinate - increased damage.
    • Physical Trauma - in addition, increase the damage of puncture/impale/jagged strike (5/10/15 % ?)
    • Slip Away - Increase immunity on Slip Away to 5 seconds.
    • Magnify Pain - Increase critical strike damage by 5/10% and critical hit chance by 2/4% ?
    • Foul Play - Duration increased to 5 seconds.
    • Improved Final Blow and Double Cross should be merged as one tree skill and introduce a new 3 point talent.
    • All attacks from behind a target should be increased in damage.
    • Perhaps a poison to reduce healing effects on a target?
    Continue to add feedback and comments. Let's get this right


    Previous and other ideas:
    • Poison to reduce healing is a must.
    • Assassin's 51 point Tree Root "Serpent Strike" is questionable compared to other roles in this game.
    • Baneful Touch needs to scale better with the damage output from poison.
    • Chance to land a critical strike seems to be far to low.
    • Poison damage should show up differently on the combat text.
    • Leeching poison should possibly heal more.
    • New skill to reduce targets armor for a duration.
    • Improved final blow and Double Cross should be merged as one tree skill and introduce a new 3 point talent.
      or
    • Double Cross: Should increase the damage and increase critical hit chance. I think having the higher crit is something we need as an Assassin.
    • Poison needs to be more like actual poison, stat debuff etc. Since when does poison do water dmg?
    • Adjust abilities in the assassin tree to have more of a benefit when used with a melee weapon and a far less benefit with a ranged weapon.
    • More interrupts or silence.
    • Change assassinate, finishing blow, and savage strike from physical to death based damage.


    Please feel free to leave comments below with your thoughts on the Assassin.
    I'd love to hear anyones feedback, questions or concerns.


    Thanks for your time,

    Randytherogue <vVv Gaming> Briarcliff
    Last edited by vVvKraftdinner; 02-09-2011 at 09:45 AM.

  2. #2
    Rift Master McWaffles's Avatar
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    I think the biggest flaw with assassin is that it is more of a secondary class to drop points for poisons and crit for MM and rangers than a class of it's own. you can literally got to the end of the branches without taking a talent that doesn't benefit MM/rangers.
    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0MfMN..0VMftcbqz0o is proof. there are better ways to do it, but still, it seems sickening to me that the "assassin" is more of a backup to MM than an actual assassin. It also seems to me to do ludicrously low amounts of damage compared not only to ranged rogues, but other melee classes in general, especially in beta 6. I think that their poisons should be changed to proc at a higher rate on MELEE hits and return serrated blades to 100/200/300%wep damage on MELEE hits. The only other thing I can say is give a possibility of another burst AFTER the initial, after building, or at least some sustained damage increases, because when a single healer can outheal 3 assassins attacking him, there is a problem.
    "You're just realizing the fault of your species, human beings are the most untrustworthy, backstabbing creatures on this planet. Except for bears."

  3. #3
    Soulwalker
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    The only thing that i'd like changed is poisons,
    i'd like leeching poison to heal for a bit more from the 20's up. and i'd like the poison damage to come up as different coloured numbers on the combat text. at the moment i see a mass spam of numbers and unless I go into my combat log i wont know how much damage those poisons do.

    Short version:
    1) leeching poison to heal more, perhaps 5-10% is enough

    2) Poison damage showing up as differently coloured, so i would had a rough idea how much damage poisons are doing if i was a new player that doesn't have a assassin dps spread sheet running in the background.

  4. #4
    Telaran vVvKraftdinner's Avatar
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    I will continue to update the thread with your comments about the Assassin to generate a list of concerns, changes and solutions to problems.

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    Telaran serenics's Avatar
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    heres a few i posted in another tread but thought i would add them here also before i get spammed with whiners,

    - give all melee rogues a poison that reduces incoming healing

    - Maybe a skill that ignores a set% of amour thats a 20second buff 1 min cd

    - Make Slip away the 31 point talent in the sin tree Remove debuffs and dots too ( seems kinda pointless spending a points on it otherwise when theres so many dots flying around in pvp)

    - Perhaps make foul play stun duration work on a combo point system ( add a second on the stun for each combo point used, so a maximum of 7 second stun)

    - Instead of Blind powder Breaking on any damage, perhaps only physical or magical ( since our crits apply bleeds effects and puncture bleed breaks the blind seems pointless

    -Make improved final blow and double cross one skill

    The only classes that i could beat was other melee rogues or non healing range cloth classes, i don't really expect to beat a defensive spec tank, but as for healers and rangers or marksman who's specced into riftstalker are a big no no and there sort of classes i expect the assassin to be there bread and butter but by no means should be a 100% guaranteed kill.
    Neurosis - Assassin - Giving Guardians Free Favor Since Beta

  6. #6
    Rift Disciple villianos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by McWaffles View Post
    I think the biggest flaw with assassin is that it is more of a secondary class to drop points for poisons and crit for MM and rangers than a class of it's own. you can literally got to the end of the branches without taking a talent that doesn't benefit MM/rangers.
    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0MfMN..0VMftcbqz0o is proof. there are better ways to do it, but still, it seems sickening to me that the "assassin" is more of a backup to MM than an actual assassin. It also seems to me to do ludicrously low amounts of damage compared not only to ranged rogues, but other melee classes in general, especially in beta 6. I think that their poisons should be changed to proc at a higher rate on MELEE hits and return serrated blades to 100/200/300%wep damage on MELEE hits. The only other thing I can say is give a possibility of another burst AFTER the initial, after building, or at least some sustained damage increases, because when a single healer can outheal 3 assassins attacking him, there is a problem.



    I saw that alot and it really made me sad....
    ThatCreep

  7. #7
    Sid
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    I'd have to agree with McWaffles because the assassin tree is usable by MM/Rng and it's hardly useful as a main soul. Here's what I think needs to be adjusted just from playing Beta 6.

    1. "Improved Stealth" should also increase effectiveness of the stealth skill making it harder to be detected.

    2. Poison needs to be more like actual poison, stat debuff etc. Since when does poison do water dmg??
    2a. A poison that decreases healing is also a must as well.

    3. Replace some DoT abilities with spike dmg abilities and/or improve over all dmg including finishing moves . The Sin has little to no survivability so the Sin can't survive long out of stealth, especially against multiple enemies. The idea of the Sin (in every game I've ever played) is to get in, get it done and get out as fast as possible. I know this is a huge issue and it's been covered quite a few times so I won't go any further with it.

    4. Adjust abilities in the assassin tree to have more of a benefit when used with a melee weapon and a far less benefit with a ranged weapon. I think this will significantly alter the dmg output between ranged rogues and melee rogues if done correctly.

    5. Slip Away - Increase immunity on Slip Away to 5sec, that will give the Sin somewhat of a chance to actually "slip away".

    6.Hidden Veil - Requires 40 points spent in the Sin tree, that far down the tree it should be a passive ability which would give someone using the Sin as a main soul an edge over those that aren't.

    I think that's all for now, i'll make sure to post more as I think of it.

    Edit: Subscribed, This thread has potential.
    Last edited by Sid; 02-07-2011 at 02:03 PM.

  8. #8
    Telaran vVvKraftdinner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sid View Post
    Edit: Subscribed, This thread has potential.
    Thanks

    These are issues that need to be addressed.
    The Assassin is in serious trouble as a main if this is how they plan to launch the Role when the game goes live.

    Keep the feedback coming!

    Thanks

  9. #9
    Soulwalker SoulSurf's Avatar
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    I built a full on assassin/rift stalker/blade dancer to level 27 and found it very hard to get a group. I hate that my favorite class is a joke to a lot of the other classes. It isn't even so much as fix this or nerf that as it is "You are an assassin? Oh sorry group is full." Most of the players I have encountered don't even consider me a melee dps class. However I do enjoy the game and the diversity. I also have a full on tank and healer. I have been at mmo's a long time and always create and level alts that complete a group. I really enjoy groups and meeting new players and I fear that when the characters are wiped my sin will not be my main but an alt.



  10. #10
    Soulwalker
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    Switch Virulent poison and lethal poison, then give Virulent poison a stacking healing debuff like 5-10% and 3 stacks.

    Change blinding powder to choking powder, a silence and then after that spells for a small duration cast slower.

    Also where is the silence/inturrupts, my targets screams should be stifled when I'm spammin my keys hoping to kill that cleric/mage that is healing before I die.
    Last edited by ITango; 02-07-2011 at 02:30 PM.

  11. #11
    Telaran vVvKraftdinner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoulSurf View Post
    I built a full on assassin/rift stalker/blade dancer to level 27 and found it very hard to get a group. I hate that my favorite class is a joke to a lot of the other classes. It isn't even so much as fix this or nerf that as it is "You are an assassin? Oh sorry group is full." Most of the players I have encountered don't even consider me a melee dps class. However I do enjoy the game and the diversity. I also have a full on tank and healer. I have been at mmo's a long time and always create and level alts that complete a group. I really enjoy groups and meeting new players and I fear that when the characters are wiped my sin will not be my main but an alt.

    These concerns are mostly with PvP since I have not had any issues in PvE.
    Especially in Instances or groups.
    If you have a tank that can hold aggro, you should be fine with dealing top damage since you should have improved damage when behind a target.
    Also, remember to bleed your target out in PvE if you know he will last as long as the duration before dropping.

  12. #12
    Telaran serenics's Avatar
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    I think the class is perfect for pve i cant say for sure but im 99% i was the best dps in all my instances, i know this is a pvp thread but just a quick bit about my pve rotation

    Stealth > Jagged Strike > Puncture > Backstab > Baneful Touch(5 combo points) > Backstab untill 5 combo points or puncture needs refreshing > Impale(5 combo points) > Backstab intill 5 combo points or punture needs refreshing > Final Blow(5 combo points)

    So i just keep with the same rotation but refeshing impale or baneful touch when needed and if they didnt need refreshing a final blow
    Neurosis - Assassin - Giving Guardians Free Favor Since Beta

  13. #13
    Soulwalker
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    I had posted a seperate thread on the HOW to increase damage for assassins which would likely be a good boost in damage without much coding I think. That would be to change assassinate, finishing blow, and savage strike from physical to death based damage to help them from being dropped in efficiency so much.

    I just thought i would add that to here and also to keep this thread bumped up for review by devs (which i really hope for) for our soul to be used as a main for those of us who love it.

  14. #14
    Telaran Mieville's Avatar
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    Does the rogue class have an outright interupt? Champions have bash on a 6 sec cd, yet i can't remember seeing rogues have any form of interupt?

    "If we was in prison...I would protect you in the showers"

  15. #15
    Telaran serenics's Avatar
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    with the specs i have played i have found the following skills to assist you

    Foul Play - 30 second cd (Assassin)
    Cloudy Poison - 25% increase cast time (PvP Soul)
    Smother - 5 second silence (NightBlade)
    Weapon Barrage - 5 second silence (BladeDancer)

    the only ones i know for melee rogues with out going super high into talent trees
    Last edited by serenics; 02-07-2011 at 03:42 PM.
    Neurosis - Assassin - Giving Guardians Free Favor Since Beta

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