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Thread: Any actual reason to use daggers?

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    Soulwalker Zerogeist's Avatar
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    Default Any actual reason to use daggers?

    Poison damage is next to worthless to give up the extra ability/auto damage from a 2.7 or higher sword/axem/mace, is there an added benefit to these weapons, or is it just their extra swing speed for more poison procs?

    I only got mine to 15ish in beta5, and there was just no real reason for it that I could see, looking for some input
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    General of Telara Selgin's Avatar
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    Extra speed, and the stats. Swords and axes tend to be strength/endurance heavy while maces tend to be wis/end/int. The most common dex gear is daggers. More dex is well worth the lower weapon damage, since all of your dodge and 75% of Attack Power comes from dex.
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    Prophet of Telara Mantiss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zerogeist View Post
    Poison damage is next to worthless to give up the extra ability/auto damage from a 2.7 or higher sword/axem/mace, is there an added benefit to these weapons, or is it just their extra swing speed for more poison procs?

    I only got mine to 15ish in beta5, and there was just no real reason for it that I could see, looking for some input
    Once you run Iron Tombs and Fae you'll have 2 blue daggers with a damage proc. Very nice in terms of dps, stats and the proc which adds up to a lof of hurt for the enemy. There were also the leaked alpha notes which hint at weapon damage normalization. Which will gives most Rogues, not all, an incentive towards using daggers.

    Until level 15 though, you really should stick with and enjoy whatever weapon reward has the best dps/stat mix and you'll a few spots like that when getting from one tier of dungeons to the next. By the time I was ready for FC I was back to using daggers though as the rewards from Dungeons, Rifts and Factions were better overall.

    Once that weapon normalization occurs and assuming you use 2 weapon/poison enchants you'll really want fast weapons. As those procs, especially for my Nightblade add up to a TON of damage in PvE and essential to have in PvP with 20% slower casting poison.
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    Telaran Scayth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Selgin View Post
    Extra speed, and the stats. Swords and axes tend to be strength/endurance heavy while maces tend to be wis/end/int. The most common dex gear is daggers. More dex is well worth the lower weapon damage, since all of your dodge and 75% of Attack Power comes from dex.
    Nope. From Beta 2 patch notes:

    * Combat stats are now calculated:
    - General:
    Parry is now 100% Strength.
    Dodge is still 100% Dexterity.
    Block is still 100% Strength.
    Melee Critical is now 100% Dexterity.
    Spell Critical is now 100% Intelligence.
    - Warrior:
    Attack Power is now 75% Strength, 25% Dexterity.
    - Rogue:
    Attack Power is now 50% Dexterity, 50% Strength.
    - Mage:
    Spell Power is now 50% Intelligence, 50% Wisdom.
    - Cleric:
    Spell Power is now 75% Wisdom, 25% Intelligence.


    Also, what the other poster mentioned about weapon damage normalization in the next patch. And most swords I came across seem to have plenty dex.

    Depending on what I have available I have tended to go sword/sword or sword/dagger. Sword speed is 2.1, daggers are 1.8, imo daggers weren't faster enough than swords to make up for the lesser damage. I also picked up a couple of Glossy Granite Tomahawks (EQ1 easter egg), which was probably a waste of money with the normalization finally happening.

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    Champion Skyline's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Selgin View Post
    Extra speed, and the stats. Swords and axes tend to be strength/endurance heavy while maces tend to be wis/end/int. The most common dex gear is daggers. More dex is well worth the lower weapon damage, since all of your dodge and 75% of Attack Power comes from dex.
    Actually what most Rogues don't seem to know is that their attack power is 50/50 dex/str.

    Edit: wow It took me 4 minutes to find those beta 2 notes.
    Last edited by Skyline; 02-01-2011 at 11:16 AM.

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    Rift Disciple Baconnaise's Avatar
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    * Weapon damage added to abilities has been normalized. There should be a much smaller difference in damage done using a fast weapon versus a slow one. This sounds minor but is actually a high impact change!

    * Increased the base damage on all weapons.

    * Increased the base damage for all Attack Power-based abilities.

    * Auto-attack no longer benefits from Attack Power.
    Quite a big change to combat in general in my opinion. Daggers should be fine as long as you stack dex/str.

    My only cloudy issue is bards don't seem to be straightforward on what improves their skills like the other classes.
    Last edited by Baconnaise; 02-01-2011 at 11:19 AM.

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    Telaran Scayth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baconnaise View Post
    Quite a big change to combat in general in my opinion. Daggers should be fine as long as you stack dex/str.
    Mentioning a change in those notes is one thing, actually quoting them here is probably not the best idea...

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    Plane Touched
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    no, dagger have low weapon dmg and almost all rogues skills are weapon dmg+ x skill dmg.
    A LOT of hammers and axes have str/dex status.

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    CPK
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    Daggers will always be the better choice for an off-hand weapon, too. GCD abilities are only performed by the mainhand weapon, so the offhand weapon only benefits from DPS and poison proc. Since the weapon type does not affect the DPS of a weapon, then daggers are the better option since they proc poison more often.

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    Rift Disciple Baconnaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scayth View Post
    Mentioning a change in those notes is one thing, actually quoting them here is probably not the best idea...
    I wasn't quoting leaked patch notes but what was pointed out in a discussion in another thread of what the likely change was.

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    Telaran Haliit's Avatar
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    More chance to proc poison, more chance to crit and proc serrated blades

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    Telaran Scayth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baconnaise View Post
    I wasn't quoting leaked patch notes but what was pointed out in a discussion in another thread of what the likely change was.
    Wrong. I've read them, that's an exact quote.

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    Champion rich1051414's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CPK View Post
    Daggers will always be the better choice for an off-hand weapon, too. GCD abilities are only performed by the mainhand weapon, so the offhand weapon only benefits from DPS and poison proc. Since the weapon type does not affect the DPS of a weapon, then daggers are the better option since they proc poison more often.
    this is true, i would say 1h axe main hand(seem to have the highest dps and still can find um with str and dex, and a dagger in the offhand, more off hand hits, more chances for your poisons to stick

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    Rift Disciple Baconnaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scayth View Post
    Wrong. I've read them, that's an exact quote.
    My mistake then. I shouldn't quote what others are saying then .

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    Telaran Scayth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rich1051414 View Post
    this is true, i would say 1h axe main hand(seem to have the highest dps and still can find um with str and dex, and a dagger in the offhand, more off hand hits, more chances for your poisons to stick
    That might be true in a game like WoW where the fastest daggers are like 1.5ish, and swords tend to be what, 2.8 speed? It's been a while. Anyways, in Rift all daggers (that I've seen) are 1.8 and all swords are 2.1. The difference is hardly noticeable and the poisons (also unlike wow) proc for really, really low damage. All this is speculation anyway until we can test out the damage changes in the next event.

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