+ Reply to Thread
Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 1 2
Results 16 to 27 of 27
Like Tree4Likes

  Click here to go to the first Rift Team post in this thread.   Thread: Upcoming Rogue Changes - 3.1 and beyond

  1. #16
    Rift Disciple Konlict's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    113

    Default My thoughts on marksman 3.2

    Just come back to the game since 6 months after release of the game in 2011.
    Marksman is so messed up right now whoever made these changes done a good job at butchering it.

    Where the hell is hit and run???? And what is the point in run speed buffs from skills when they get taken away and even slowed with others??

    The rotation is horrible to maximise DPS in raids. And does not come close to the DPS on my Warrior in reaver spec and that has mostly blue gear.
    I feel like I am paying more attention to my character HP bar to see how many points I have, when before I just knew what I had and how to use them and I could pay more attention to what was happening in the fight.
    After a few weeks it's not getting any better and I've even taken skills off my action bar because I feel they are worthless

    Fan out: what is the point in the skill?? When we have crossfire & chain destruction and I think these skills should gain combo points and fan out be the finisher.

    Deadeye shot: this has been nerf real bad my opinion with no hit and run its no good and the damage is not great and not scaled up with the cast time.
    Suggestion to get rid of deadeye shot all together and replace it with something like.....
    Exploding shot/blazing shot: hard hitting finisher with fire damage over 10 seconds that has a 1 minute cool down.

    Free recoil: don't get used because I don't use deadeye shot and the animations for the skill seem glitchy and puts away bow or gun then out again. And no point in using for consuming 2 combo points when I can use empowered shot that does damage and brings me up to 2 points.

    Overall give marksman the love it needs take away deadeye shot and change it to my suggested skill and take away them silly reduced movement speeds on skills

  2. #17
    Prophet of Telara Stihl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1,107

    Default

    So with the changes to the ranges on healing abilities fr Chloro and Warden, how about some love for Curative Torrent? Widening its arc and increasing the range to which its heals can branch would be a huge improvement. It can be one of the more enjoyable specs to play if only it were viable in more situations.

  3. #18
    Shadowlander
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    49

    Default Please unsuckify Physician heals

    Granted tank heals are cool and everything.... and experts are ok... but raid heals suck... and in pvp its freaking useless.

    Please improve raid heals and unsuckify the pvp... make it balanced to the other heals...

    Mages - Great raid/expert heals & good tank heals
    Clerics - Great all round heals
    Warriors - Good heals all day
    ...
    Rogues - Great tank/expert heals... everything else sucks...

    I would change [Alternative Treatment] a bit...
    Extend effect to full raid (20 players)
    Effectiveness decrease between 30% to 40%... tweak it match average raid heals, just a tad below chloromancer...
    PVP effectiveness should be tweaked in the same way... to match it to most average pvp heal levels....

    For most players (that enjoy playing all classes) this might be a minor issue... but if all you do is play rogue (90% of the time anyway) is a problem. Since you made a "one class does all" you might as well balance the different aspect of it.

    With tanks you made it so great. every class has its own perks but all do a good job
    With support you made it great also... same thought...
    With DPS... well... balancing souls and play styles is a "forever ongoing job".

    Please make Heals balanced...
    Please make Rogue healers able to tackle every challenge...

  4. #19
    Plane Touched
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Posts
    298

    Default

    I don't even.

    What.

  5. #20
    Prophet of Telara Stihl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1,107

    Default

    ... 20 person CT at 70% effectiveness.

    Upcoming Rogue Changes - 3.1 and beyond-1335820139632.gif

  6. #21
    Shadowlander
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    49

    Default

    I mesured myself vs a chloromancer in pvp... he heals at least 2x more than me.... dispite effords...

    the 5 player limit is absurd... only healing class that cannot heal a full raid

    at least number restriction should be removed.... so raid heals are possible...
    Last edited by skorv; 07-19-2015 at 05:13 PM.

  7. #22
    Plane Touched
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Posts
    298

    Default

    Raid heals are possible.

    I've Phystact'd on every single boss in RoF, almost every boss in HK (excluding Vladmal, Garau, Zilas), and every boss in iGP (excluding Uruuluk). Phystacts are especially potent in 10-man content. Sure, we don't bring the same level of raw HPS that a Lib or a Chloro do but we do bring Power Core and shields to the table.

    61 Phys isn't even a bad tank healer, it's just pretty hard to compete with Divine Favor, Latent Blaze, Sign of Faith, Sterilize, Flame of Life, etc. Puri dominates the current tank healing meta, no one will dispute that. Turning Phys into a 2nd Puri is not a step in the right direction.

    In PvP I probably wouldn't use Phystact, but a 58/61 Phys can still be useful for sustained non-resource reliant heals. PvP healing in general is a bit gimped at the moment because of Reaver (vile affinity and septic wounds are an abomination, at the very least any tool that is extremely effective against healing/cross-healing shouldn't be utterly brain dead, but oh well).

    I know Rogues like to complain a lot (as does the community of every other class) but overall we're in a pretty good spot at the moment. We have a viable raid healing option, a good tank healing soul, a viable support soul (despite being pigeonholed into 61 pts like Oracles are), a variety of different/viable melee DPS options (hybrids and 61 pt builds alike, our melee specs are superb and they all serve a unique purpose), a competitive ranged DPS soul that doesn't completely overshadow all of our melee specs (I know a lot of people dislike the MM revamp, but it could have been a lot worse), and our tanking soul is serviceable.

    Right now, in my opinion, the bigger issue is dead souls; not raid heals that are used on/can be used on 90% of current tier encounters.

    Sab is pretty much at the bottom of the barrel when it comes to dedicated AoE souls, Ranger is just terrible at everything (awful ST DPS, almost nonexistent AoE DPS, unreliable tank pet and pet path-finding issues, diffuse is the only thing that it has going for it and even that never lasts for the full 10-second duration against even remotely competent DPS), Tactician is stuck in an event horizon, etc.

    What happened to the new Ranger/Beastmaster pets? Why has Sab been like this for so long? What is a Tactician?

    Even getting extremely basic QoL changes is difficult. Dev resources when it comes to class/soul balance seem to be spread pretty thin, and at this point it's almost like we're waiting for our next turn in line; whenever that is.

  8. #23
    Shadowlander
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    49

    Default

    Its good that we address these issues as we are, sharing different opinions and points of view.

    The goal, I hope, is that every class and soul bring something different to the battlefield.
    Not underpowered or overpowered either, balanced.

    I think what Trion made for tanks is a good path to fallow. Every class brought different skills to the battlefield and they all are good in their skill sets.
    Support souls are in balance as far as I know.
    DPSwise... Pyromancer is overpowering everything right now in single target dps. The idea is not to tone it down but to make ranged dps souls do what tank and support souls are doing, bringing different skills to the battlefield and making stuff interesting.
    Melee DPS I really cant address because I hardly play it, so please guys enlighten me.

    Dead souls are an issue, yes. I play pure sab, ranger and tac, and love those souls... they have their use and are not useless.

    Not perfect, I know, but I still use ranger for most of the open world content.
    Sab AoE Damage is still one of the best and simplest souls to play.
    Tac is one of those things that can really help in narrow corners and if you need additional heals, it has its place.

    You may prefer one soul above another because of your personal play style or gaming skill, and you do the same with classes.

    Its only natural that Clerics are the best at healing, its a core skill. Mages can, at least, be a close 2nd. Never played a warrior healer, but as far as I know 61 Liberator is also a pretty decent raid healer and a good backup tank healer.

    61 Physician could be so much more than the experts healer it is right now.
    I agree hybrid builds can bring enhanced raid heals, but i find the healer soul still lacking.

    Clerics have 2 healing souls, and that's absolutely on spot because that the class you look up for healing expertise.
    All the rest have to be (and are) All-In-One.
    I do play Chloromancer from time to time, and yes, its a great raid healer and a great backup tank healer.
    I did play Cleric healer, so I at least have 1st hand knowledge of its strengths.

    Having played other healers (specially Chloromancer) give me the notion that Physician is very limited by itself.

    That is the main reason behind my thoughts about healing as a Rogue.
    By no means I want this to be the master of heals, but a fairly decent one...
    Chloro stresses raid heals, as does Liberator... Clerics do it all...

    Physician could be a little better tank healer (and is a pretty good one as it stands) but by itself fails at raid heals.

    My wishes for the Physician is that it becomes 2nd best tank healer (since its the way its going now) and a decent raid healer, and for that the removal of the limitation is a easy fix and easy to test. As for PVP healing... one could wonder if the 70% less could be removed and be on the same level as raid healing... also easy to do and easy to test.

    All and all I love Physician, even not being the "awesome" healer... but small corrections would make it a viable do-it-all healer as Liberator or Chloromancer already are.

    Not underpowered, Not overpowered, Not limited. Just all round good and usable.
    Last edited by skorv; 07-20-2015 at 05:36 AM.

  9. #24
    Shadowlander
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    49

    Default

    in other words:

    Clerics: Great Tank Heals | Great Raid Heals
    Mages: Good Tank Heals | Great Raid Heals
    Warriors: Good Tank Heals | Great Raid Heals

    and it should be like this:
    Rogues: Great Tank Heals | Good Raid Heals (in opposition to mages and warriors)

    But actually is:
    Rogues: Good Tank Heals | Crap Raid Heals

    I'm not counting hybrid builds, just what one expects from a pure healing soul...

  10. #25
    RIFT Guide Writer fufi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    1,014

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by skorv View Post
    I'm not counting hybrid builds, just what one expects from a pure healing soul...
    Here is your mistake.
    There is a reason people go phys/tact for raid healing rather than full phys (and appart from Power Core I don't know what the reason is, but I know it's there).

    Also, warrior ST heal isn't that great.
    Also, clerics can't do both ST and raid healing in the same spec. That's the domain of chloromancers, but they still have variants, and most importantly, depending on the crystal they use, they won't be as efficient in ST or in AOE healing, and you can't switch crystal middle fight, making it virtually like two specs anyway. As you can see, there's no reason one spec only (61 phys) should be good at both raid healing and tank healing at the same time.

    That would be like creating the reaver of healing D:
    <Apotheosys>@Typhiria
    World First 5-man Easy Mode 1/4 GP

  11. #26
    Rift Master
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    618

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by skorv View Post
    Clerics: Great Tank Heals | Great Raid Heals
    As Fufi said, either/or not both in 1 spec... and just how many encounters will a warden find a warm welcome? 1 in iGP, 1 in HK, and Conquest?

    Quote Originally Posted by skorv View Post
    and it should be like this:
    Rogues: Great Tank Heals | Good Raid Heals (in opposition to mages and warriors)
    It is - check out the 1-tank Zilas strat and you'll find a 61 Phys. I've tank healed RoF as a 61 Phys in dungeon purples - had a LOT of fun doing it too. More challenging than my T2 raid geared Puri? Yep, AND more satisfaction at the end.

    Quote Originally Posted by skorv View Post
    But actually is:
    Rogues: Good Tank Heals | Crap Raid Heals

    I'm not counting hybrid builds, just what one expects from a pure healing soul...
    Why discount an excellent hybrid build? You'll find Phys-tact to be very welcome in all but 2 raid encounters as Nebucent mentioned above - often using more than 1 Phystact because overheal shielding > raw hps.

    As for pvp? Maybe not quite as good as last Fall, but still an excellent healer and a lot harder to shut down than a cleric. Be careful what you wish for, you could get it.

  12. #27
    Prophet of Telara Stihl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1,107

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by fufi View Post
    Here is your mistake.
    There is a reason people go phys/tact for raid healing rather than full phys (and appart from Power Core I don't know what the reason is, but I know it's there).
    Well after 44 points in Phys (to get Alternative Treatment in the root) all of your remaining options are either useless (Medicinal Leeching, Blood Letting) or CDs that only serve a purpose for ST heals (Biofeedback, Emergency Response, Massive Therapy, Supportive Care, Life Insurance.) You need at least 17 points in Tactician for Extended Workload and Conservation of Energy as AT reduces your energy regeneration rate by 5/s and without them you will starve very very quickly.

    At that point (44 Physician 17 Tactician) the remaining 15 points into Tactician are much more valuable (Auxiliary Plan, Palliative Care, Battle Remote, Curative Blast, and lastly Power Core) for raid healing with AT than anything you gain from Physician.

    I think the problem here is two-fold. First you can not properly assess the value of the Phystac hybrid without taking the shielding it does into account. If you are looking at raw hps (especially comparing it to Chloro/Lib/Warden) it will appear to be severely under-performing. Secondly it seems the comparisons made in the last few posts were in PvP.

    The outgoing heal reduction on Alternative Treatment is increased from 50% to 70% in PvP due to the release state of Physician. Simultaneous Treatment (30% of overhealing is converted to shields) shielding also gets gutted in PvP due to "double dipping" the PvP reductions. Not only is the initial heal reduced by 77.5%, but so is the resultant over-healing conversion. So a normal AT-split CT that crit for 40k and shielded for 12k, will crit for 5.4k and shield for 365 health.

    An effective 97% reduction on ST shielding means the single largest advantage Phystac brings to the table is non-existant in PvP.

+ Reply to Thread
Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 1 2

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts