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Thread: need advice how to improve DPS, in PvE

  1. #1
    Shadowlander Angina's Avatar
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    Default need advice how to improve DPS, in PvE

    i got bored playing PvP on my cleric, so i made rogue alt, and i intend to join PvE raiding guild. I am gathering gear to be T1 raid ready. To cut long story short, my DPS is low, i think. I made a huge investment yesterday, i bought relic 339dps bow for 45k empyrean slayer marks (plus 5 large cells as upgrade) and 4x lesser essences (i had lvl 50 blues, so EXTREME upgrade), T1 i think, 75 DEX 50 STR 60END and around 40 ap each, plus i have 2x greater with around same stats and procs from dmg abilities. And what happened, nothing, i do around 11600 DPS on expert dummy with both of my ranged specs, ranger and MM. i did around the same with my old 290 DPS bow and blue essences ... my stats are:

    2000 DEX, around 3200 ap selfbuffed, 350 CP, and standard amount of crit, i think 2000.

    trying to reach 500 CP, and AP after. I have 4 pieces of dungeon blue set, for some buffs from synergy crystal, crafted seal with 88 DEX and some AP, crafted KEEN rings, necklace with T1 stats, conquest master trinket for favor, lvl 50, but good stats ... i would like to ask you, where is the problem, and what upgrades i should aim now. rotation and spec is out of question, i was raider in retail Rift and with my guild we had 90% shard first kills PvE wise. Any input is appreciated. Thanks

  2. #2
    Ascendant Rounded's Avatar
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    11,6k from MM selfbuffed is more than enough for T1, you'll see the numbers go up in a raid situation. What you do want is Sin, NB and BD specs and become fluent with them, a "Hi, I'm a marksman and I want to raid" will you get laughed out from half of the guilds even doing T1 unless they really need the numbers.
    Last edited by Rounded; 12-09-2013 at 05:39 AM.

  3. #3
    Telaran
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    You might want to learn melee specs if you want to raid. Marksman can be useful when you really need an offensive dispell, but excepting that, the damage specs are NB/Sin, 61Sin, (for ST damage), 61NB (though I don't really like that spec) and 61 BD for decent ST and really great AoE damage, but marksman and ranger are just that : ranged. Ranged = less dps.

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    Ascendant Gunzip's Avatar
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    Marksman is not your raid dps specc, its a utility specc for purging and interrupts, its dps is much lower than all the other options we have available to us. You're going to have to learn how to play Assassin, Bladedancer, Nightblade, and the hybrid Nightblade/Assassin build.

    Who told you Marksman was a good raid dps build? i'm just curious.
    Quote Originally Posted by Muspel View Post
    I believe Assassin DoTs are uncleansable.

    It's still a terrible PvP spec compared to Marksman, though.

  5. #5
    Plane Walker
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    Quote Originally Posted by Angina View Post
    i do around 11600 DPS on expert dummy with both of my ranged specs, ranger and MM
    Can you post a parse of both on Raid Dummy? With such a high DPS bow I do think your DPS should be higher than what you got, especially since it's on an Expert Dummy.

    Get the crafted DPS helm, it has better stats than T1 raid marks helm if you just give it a stellar augment.

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    Plane Touched erct657's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gunzip View Post
    Marksman is not your raid dps specc, its a utility specc for purging and interrupts, its dps is much lower than all the other options we have available to us. You're going to have to learn how to play Assassin, Bladedancer, Nightblade, and the hybrid Nightblade/Assassin build.

    Who told you Marksman was a good raid dps build? i'm just curious.
    MM is a perfectly fine raid build. There are just better ones. DPS checks are not particularly tight in T1 raids, which is what the OP wants to do, and if your raid has a plethora of rogues, like mine did back when we were progressing on T1, you better know how to use it well because you will likely be using it on Saetos and Goloch, maybe (though unlikely) on Matriarch, and I'd recommend it while learning Zaviel so that you can do backup interrupts on the orbs.

    @OP: Like everyone else has said, learn some melee specs. I recommend 61 Sin and 61 BD, in that order. Also, you are going to want to start to try to bump up your Crit Power immensely, like to 7-800+.
    Last edited by erct657; 12-09-2013 at 09:07 AM.
    Erct - <Undaunted> - Wolfsbane.
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    Ascendant Gunzip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by erct657 View Post
    MM is a perfectly fine raid build. There are just better ones. DPS checks are not particularly tight in T1 raids, which is what the OP wants to do, and if your raid has a plethora of rogues, like mine did back when we were progressing on T1, you better know how to use it well because you will likely be using it on Saetos and Goloch, maybe (though unlikely) on Matriarch, and I'd recommend it while learning Zaviel so that you can do backup interrupts on the orbs.

    @OP: Like everyone else has said, learn some melee specs. I recommend 61 Sin and 61 BD, in that order. Also, you are going to want to start to try to bump up your Crit Power immensely, like to 7-800+.
    I melee those bosses, but ok.
    Quote Originally Posted by Muspel View Post
    I believe Assassin DoTs are uncleansable.

    It's still a terrible PvP spec compared to Marksman, though.

  8. #8
    Telaran
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gunzip View Post
    I melee those bosses, but ok.
    TBH I melee every single boss in T1 raids... Except when It's my turn to be the bard.

    Gelidra : NB/Sin
    Zaviel : NB/Sin
    Twins : i'm usually the tank, but I guess i'd run BD (ST rotation with HB/DS included when off CD)
    Crucia : NB/Sin

    Saetos : NB/Sin (if you pull your hands out of your *** on the saetos/rhu'megar phase, and maintain fiery spike on both while dpsing, it's just awesome)
    Kain : NB/Sin. 61Sin works too, but the hybrid can assist on bloodthiefs when they're in front of the boss and keep on dpsing anyway when there's the ravenous hunger.
    Matriarch : BD
    Goloch : NB/Sin (61sin works too but can't dps during the baleful smash)
    Regulos : BD works wonders on the eyes, but NB/Sin will do the job.


    To be entirely honest, I was a big 61'Sin fan, but that new hibrid spec is just too good if you sync your cds correctly...

    As for the tier 2 bosses, I have only tried my hand at GA as of now so, can't really say. Guess NB/Sin / Bladedancer.

    MM is decent, but it's subpar in terms of dps.

  9. #9
    Ascendant Gunzip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shilyena View Post
    TBH I melee every single boss in T1 raids... Except when It's my turn to be the bard.

    Gelidra : NB/Sin
    Zaviel : NB/Sin
    Twins : i'm usually the tank, but I guess i'd run BD (ST rotation with HB/DS included when off CD)
    Crucia : NB/Sin

    Saetos : NB/Sin (if you pull your hands out of your *** on the saetos/rhu'megar phase, and maintain fiery spike on both while dpsing, it's just awesome)
    Kain : NB/Sin. 61Sin works too, but the hybrid can assist on bloodthiefs when they're in front of the boss and keep on dpsing anyway when there's the ravenous hunger.
    Matriarch : BD
    Goloch : NB/Sin (61sin works too but can't dps during the baleful smash)
    Regulos : BD works wonders on the eyes, but NB/Sin will do the job.


    To be entirely honest, I was a big 61'Sin fan, but that new hibrid spec is just too good if you sync your cds correctly...

    As for the tier 2 bosses, I have only tried my hand at GA as of now so, can't really say. Guess NB/Sin / Bladedancer.

    MM is decent, but it's subpar in terms of dps.
    Bladedancer is the sexy for IG.
    Quote Originally Posted by Muspel View Post
    I believe Assassin DoTs are uncleansable.

    It's still a terrible PvP spec compared to Marksman, though.

  10. #10
    Plane Walker Baalthorne's Avatar
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    MM if u need a purge. I am biased against MM so I will not go into a spiel about how much i hate that spec but yeah learn some melee specs and RANGER

  11. #11
    Shadowlander Angina's Avatar
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    Thank you all for valuable input. I think you are right with rogue ranged DPS in raids, back in the days, when we had River of Souls on farm status and few times relic bow dropped, it always ended in warrior hands, even when there was rogue who loved ranged DPS, but simply he wasnt allowed to do it in raids

    Indeed i have crafted DPS helmet, but with KEEN augment. I think i will craft a new one, with CP augment, as you adviced to raise CP to at least 700. Yesterday Sacred Hand trinket dropped in Boneforge expert, but there was 5 NEED rolls including casters, and tank won it. Fair enough, upgraded version is DEX/STR/END and CP along with nice dmg proc, i tried to bribe him, but he refused So i guess i will give up and farm Karthan ridge for reputation trinket, with CP on it, for start.

    No one told me MM/Ranger is viable raid spec. I just leveled as ranger and i was in impression it is equal to melee, DPS wise. I will have a look on melee specs now, but it is a shame, i spent all dungeon marks on relic BOW

    Thank you again
    Last edited by Angina; 12-09-2013 at 10:21 PM.

  12. #12
    Plane Walker
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    Quote Originally Posted by Angina View Post
    No one told me MM/Ranger is viable raid spec. I just leveled as ranger and i was in impression it is equal to melee, DPS wise. I will have a look on melee specs now, but it is a shame, i spent all dungeon marks on relic BOW
    Ranger is definitely usable for raids, it's not far behind other classes' DPS unlike MM, but I'm not sure if you're playing ranger right because it should parse higher than MM, even with power starvation. Are you following Gery's ranger guide?

  13. #13
    Shadowlander Angina's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scyd View Post
    Ranger is definitely usable for raids, it's not far behind other classes' DPS unlike MM, but I'm not sure if you're playing ranger right because it should parse higher than MM, even with power starvation. Are you following Gery's ranger guide?
    I am following EXACTLY that guide. I was thinking, i will test it today with PA points invested towards pure DPS. I have around 950 points, with full PVP/DEX/END now. Ill replace END with STR, and with CP trinket i hope i can do significantly better.

  14. #14
    Ascendant Gunzip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Angina View Post
    I am following EXACTLY that guide. I was thinking, i will test it today with PA points invested towards pure DPS. I have around 950 points, with full PVP/DEX/END now. Ill replace END with STR, and with CP trinket i hope i can do significantly better.
    The pvp tree has a fair amount of crit power and endurance, don't gloss over them, especially when you're a new 60 with 21K health.
    Quote Originally Posted by Muspel View Post
    I believe Assassin DoTs are uncleansable.

    It's still a terrible PvP spec compared to Marksman, though.

  15. #15
    Ascendant Archemys's Avatar
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    MM isn't nearly as bad as some of you people make it sound.
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