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Thread: 51 sin laethys question

  1. #1
    Plane Touched
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    Default 51 sin laethys question

    I never really played 51 sin so i just tried to put a spec together that seemed right. I'm using 51sin/10mm/5rs. Not sure if there is a better single target dps build if there is please share it with me.

    Now as far as rotation i couldn't see anything else to use except builder macro. serpent/puncture/backstab/savage/quick shot. again if i am doing something wrong please let me know. Then of course keep up impale and using final blow after 3 global cool downs to keep the bleed up.

    I did run drainstalker tonight on her but i think if 51sin isnt a HUGE dps loss it might be better for progression right now since the rotation seems alot easier.

    I did look for a guide but couldn't find one, so sorry if i am beating a dead horse. any feedback and info is appreciated.

  2. #2
    Ascendant Mayi's Avatar
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    I think you have the essence of 51 sin. Here's the builder macro I use:

    #show serpent strike
    cast serpent strike
    cast puncture
    cast backstab
    cast savage strike
    cast swift shot
    cast poison malice

    Start off from stealth - jagged build to 5 impale. Then 3 gcd final blows. It builds combo points faster then sin-rs so final blow once 4 or 5 seconds are left on impale to get ready for the next impale. Use slip away on cooldown right before using an impale for the damage boost.

    Sin-RS looks to be more dps. With Sin-RS you need to watch/time ports and since we're killing it consistently I'm not willing to put in the time to relearn the fight as Sin-RS. If you're just starting to learn the fight and doing better with Sin-RS I'd stick with that. I'd suggest getting KBM so you can track when you can't port.
    Last edited by Mayi; 08-13-2012 at 03:48 AM.
    I rite a gooded guide for rouges.

    NB-Sin Guide - http://forums.riftgame.com/rift-gene...-sin-spec.html

  3. #3
    Telaran Mmba's Avatar
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    if anything, drainstalker should be better for progression than 51 sin, because of the survivability boost

    Laethys

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mayi View Post
    I think you have the essence of 51 sin. Here's the builder macro I use:

    #show serpent strike
    cast serpent strike
    cast puncture
    cast backstab
    cast savage strike
    cast swift shot
    cast poison malice

    Start off from stealth - jagged build to 5 impale. Then 3 gcd final blows. It builds combo points faster then sin-rs so final blow once 4 or 5 seconds are left on impale to get ready for the next impale. Use slip away on cooldown right before using an impale for the damage boost.

    Sin-RS looks to be more dps. With Sin-RS you need to watch/time ports and since we're killing it consistently I'm not willing to put in the time to relearn the fight as Sin-RS. If you're just starting to learn the fight and doing better with Sin-RS I'd stick with that. I'd suggest getting KBM so you can track when you can't port.
    lol Mayi... just write a guide.. I think a million people have asked you about this.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mmba View Post
    if anything, drainstalker should be better for progression than 51 sin, because of the survivability boost
    51sin has more survivability because only because of the lack of blinks. All you have to worry about is where you stand. Not where you going to end up. That said drainstalker is more dps and an advanced player would have no problems using it.

  6. #6
    RIFT Fan Site Operator Dunharrow's Avatar
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    51 sin does not have more survivability, it is just more idiot-proof. Drainstalker takes 15% less damage and has 15% more health. It is far easier to live as drainstalker.

    If your guild is on Laethys then you should do them a favor and not get carried.

  7. #7
    Telaran Mmba's Avatar
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    if you're on laethys, you should be "Advanced" enough to learn when to blink with drainstalker, and help your raid out by draining and not needing as many heals through absorbs.

    Laethys

  8. #8
    Ascendant bitnine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreezie View Post
    I did run drainstalker tonight on her but i think if 51sin isnt a HUGE dps loss it might be better for progression right now since the rotation seems alot easier.
    Hm, I've been liking drainstalker so far at least. Took a look at a breakout parse of P1 showing 4.1k ST with my non-BIS gear, but I'm pretty sure I can push that higher. It does seriously feel like h4x survivability as well - kinda hard to die as DS.

    And the timing ain't bad once you get used to it. E.g., since my rotations are pretty consistent I know that the first Molten Gold drops between my 6th and 7th finishers. All in all, the blinks do seem pretty manageable.

  9. #9
    Ascendant Zazen's Avatar
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    The problem with Drainstalker isn't in phase 1 where everything is predictable within a tolerance. The problem is in p2 and p3 when you are moving for Tail Spike. Tail Spike has some predictability, e.g., when Auric is cast the melee group will almost certainly be a target, however a port could cause a Tail Spike to drop in an inconvenient location, which can cause someone to be knocked into an unsafe position when sub is about to go off.

    In my opinion, until you kill Laethys, you should minimize the risk.

    Some advice in this thread has come from rogues without first-hand experience in looting Laethys' corpse and thus should be taken with a pinch of salt.

    Laethys isn't about glory on the parse, it's about picking up her loot, and the pinata that is eggs and then getting a look at Maelforge. Most guilds that have been 5/8 for a while should have more than enough DPS to beat the soft enrage.

    This is just my opinion but we got the Subjugate This achievement on our first kill and only 1 death the entire fight.
    Last edited by Zazen; 08-13-2012 at 08:38 AM.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mmba View Post
    if you're on laethys, you should be "Advanced" enough to learn when to blink with drainstalker, and help your raid out by draining and not needing as many heals through absorbs.
    You would think so wouldnt you?

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dunharrow View Post
    51 sin does not have more survivability, it is just more idiot-proof. Drainstalker takes 15% less damage and has 15% more health. It is far easier to live as drainstalker.

    If your guild is on Laethys then you should do them a favor and not get carried.
    Ok, I guess you are right. I am just making an assumption. I am the only person who goes drain in my guild and I don't suck, I just assumed you would have an easier time living as 51sin because its easier than ports and you wouldn't have to blink into a pets red circle or anything stupid like that. As far as phases go. TBH I haven't done phase 2 so I guess I probably shouldn't of opened my mouth in the first place and let the question be answered by anyone who is at least 6/8. My bad lol.

  12. #12
    Ascendant Mayi's Avatar
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    There's another thing too, if you're parsing higher with sin-rs with debilitating in P1 you're doing something wrong with 51 sin. That's the main reason I stuck with 51 sin, it parses just as high in P1 as Sin-RS with drain. For me they both end up around 4200 at the end of P1. I tried a bunch of different variants during our progression to see how they stack up and decided 51 sin is best in P1.

    It's only in P2/3 that sin-rs pulls ahead. People have shown parses of 3800 (4100 with a relic) in P2/3 whereas I'm at about 3500 as 51 sin (before I got my relic). I think it's because the assassin damage boosts have more positional requirements so while you aren't behind the boss the damage buffs in RS are better then the damage buffs in sin.

    I'd write a guide for 51 sin but I don't see a point. Sin-RS is overall better in the encounter, but for us we're well ahead of the enrage. All the raid has to do is stay alive and it's a kill.
    I rite a gooded guide for rouges.

    NB-Sin Guide - http://forums.riftgame.com/rift-gene...-sin-spec.html

  13. #13
    Champion of Telara daphat79's Avatar
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    In phase 2 you cant go behind the dragon or you get a debuff. So your DPS will go down since you have buffs to increase dmg from behind a target.

    If you have 3 mages that dedicate draining the dragon you shouldnt have an issue at all.

  14. #14
    Ascendant Mayi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by daphat79 View Post

    If you have 3 mages that dedicate draining the dragon you shouldnt have an issue at all.
    That's true but mages as a full dps parse over 4k. Draining they don't break 2k. That's a 2k loss per draining mage. Even as 51 sin we're only losing 500 dps per drainer. We have all 4 rogue dps draining with our archon and two chloros being able to drain (I think it is) so having that many rogues draining allows the mages to only drain when required so they can do their own thing.

    Everyone's strat is different, we prefer more draining rogues for more melee as well. We take the orbs and split the damage amongst the melee which is another perk of having more melee. We run with 6 mages so 3 mage dps, 2 chloro (drainers) and an archon. Each of the mages are doing more then a rogue is able to do on the encounter.

    It might also be a quirk of our guild. We use rogues whenever a mechanic needs to be dealt with, i.e. interrupt, purge, killing spawns, breaking MCs, being back from the group on Rusillia, etc... It's just how our guild does things.
    Last edited by Mayi; 08-13-2012 at 11:07 AM.
    I rite a gooded guide for rouges.

    NB-Sin Guide - http://forums.riftgame.com/rift-gene...-sin-spec.html

  15. #15
    Champion of Telara daphat79's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mayi View Post
    That's true but mages as a full dps parse over 4k. Draining they don't break 2k. That's a 2k loss per draining mage. Even as 51 sin we're only losing 500 dps per drainer. We have all 4 rogue dps draining with our archon and two chloros being able to drain (I think it is) so having that many rogues draining allows the mages to only drain when required so they can do their own thing.

    Everyone's strat is different, we prefer more draining rogues for more melee as well. We take the orbs and split the damage amongst the melee which is another perk of having more melee. We run with 6 mages so 3 mage dps, 2 chloro (drainers) and an archon. Each of the mages are doing more then a rogue is able to do on the encounter.

    It might also be a quirk of our guild. We use rogues whenever a mechanic needs to be dealt with, i.e. interrupt, purge, killing spawns, breaking MCs, being back from the group on Rusillia, etc... It's just how our guild does things.
    If im not miss reading you have 3 mages still doing drain? all the additional melee is not required. You are 100% right tho everyone has a different strat to kill her. Have you made it to 3rd phase yet using this strat? Please dont think im trying to troll you im just curious on what others are doing. We mostly developed our own strats for every fight in the game due to different party makeups.
    Last edited by daphat79; 08-13-2012 at 11:11 AM.

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