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  Click here to go to the first Rift Team post in this thread.   Thread: Tablets, Fervor, and Energy - Problems and Solutions

  1. #91
    Plane Walker TroubleMagnet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daglar View Post
    While there is a lot of passion out there about modifying other aspects of energy regen the one that I'm going to approve and push through for now is as follows:

    Rogue energy regen will be changed from 23 per second to 24 per second.
    Tablets will have energy regeneration removed from them.
    This gives you the effective energy regen of a character using a tablet - for free and all the time.

    We will not be addressing concerns regarding fervor or other energy regen buffs at this moment in time.

    Daglar
    Lead Game Designer: Rift
    Thanks you for this change.

    Looking forward to the next moment when our total dependance on LE/Fervor can be addressed in a similar fashion to how it was addressed for warriors.
    Dummy Foundry rocks. CQ blows. Energy is meh. MORE ROLE SLOTS! Burma shave.

  2. #92
    RIFT Fan Site Operator Dunharrow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gery View Post
    Ability queue is affected by latency breh.
    Ability queue is really the great equalizer when it comes to latency. If you queue up an ability, it fires as soon as the server decides you're off GCD, regardless of ping. If your connection is stable, you won't see much of a change in DPS between 30 ping and 300 ping, and that is thanks to ability queue.

  3. #93
    Champion of Telara Puandro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daglar View Post
    While there is a lot of passion out there about modifying other aspects of energy regen the one that I'm going to approve and push through for now is as follows:

    Rogue energy regen will be changed from 23 per second to 24 per second.
    Tablets will have energy regeneration removed from them.
    This gives you the effective energy regen of a character using a tablet - for free and all the time.

    We will not be addressing concerns regarding fervor or other energy regen buffs at this moment in time.

    Daglar
    Lead Game Designer: Rift
    So i don't need tablets in raids anymore but im still energy starved out the wazoo without Fervor/LE anyways.

    Why is it such a big issue to have rogues still need LE/Fervor but Warriors/mages/clerics not need it?

    WHY WHY WHY
    Gnarlwood - Belladonna - P50 Rogue
    Seastone - Puandro - P24 Mage
    Im here for the PvE, not the unbalanced subpar PvP.
    Just Waiting...

  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daglar View Post
    While there is a lot of passion out there about modifying other aspects of energy regen the one that I'm going to approve and push through for now is as follows:

    Rogue energy regen will be changed from 23 per second to 24 per second.
    Tablets will have energy regeneration removed from them.
    This gives you the effective energy regen of a character using a tablet - for free and all the time.

    We will not be addressing concerns regarding fervor or other energy regen buffs at this moment in time.

    Daglar
    Lead Game Designer: Rift
    With Daglar on the case, **** gets real. Thank you SIR.

    Only concern now is seeing dps without LE/Fervor vs. with. What would be an acceptable variance between self parse vs. having those buffs... Really rough estimate.
    Last edited by DTM300; 05-07-2012 at 01:51 PM.
    The first issue I would like feedback on is the Power Regeneration. I have tweaked it to a point but I need feedback on it from actual players (You guys) in a real world environment to fine tune it. The value is not final and will likely need to be changed. The goal is to minimize the use and need for Tablets and make players who do not use them more viable without completely removing the use of the Tablets in game

  5. #95
    Rift Disciple Fantastica's Avatar
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    i dont see what the big deal is

  6. #96
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    Why not fix the real issue instead of putting a band-aid on the situation?


    The fact of the matter is Warriors have ONE spec that they need cost reduction at all.



    We require at least LE for EVERY single one of our viable raid dps specs, and Fervor for almost all of them. Why bring a DPS rogue to a raid when you have to accommodate to their needs? When you could just sub them out for a warrior or mage and use LE/Run speed?


    Talking sense to most of these Devs is like talking to a brick wall, and why more then likely i'm out after Maelforge goes down.

  7. #97
    Champion of Telara Puandro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kokie View Post
    Why not fix the real issue instead of putting a band-aid on the situation?


    The fact of the matter is Warriors have ONE spec that they need cost reduction at all.



    We require at least LE for EVERY single one of our viable raid dps specs, and Fervor for almost all of them. Why bring a DPS rogue to a raid when you have to accommodate to their needs? When you could just sub them out for a warrior or mage and use LE/Run speed?


    Talking sense to most of these Devs is like talking to a brick wall, and why more then likely i'm out after Maelforge goes down.
    Words taken right out of my mouth.
    Gnarlwood - Belladonna - P50 Rogue
    Seastone - Puandro - P24 Mage
    Im here for the PvE, not the unbalanced subpar PvP.
    Just Waiting...

  8. #98
    RIFT Guide Writer Muspel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dalthium View Post
    I don't understand this sentiment, you all seem to want to make fervor/LE have no use at all.
    The problem with LE/Fervor is that there's no real way to balance both with them and without them. If we're balanced with them, then many specs are essentially useless without them. If we're balanced without them, then the buff is useless.

    Ideally, LE/Fervor would be redesigned to provide some other benefit. In the interim, it seems to me that having a buff be useless to a single class is less problematic than having several specs be useless in most 5-man and some 10-man content.

  9. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dunharrow View Post
    Ability queue is really the great equalizer when it comes to latency. If you queue up an ability, it fires as soon as the server decides you're off GCD, regardless of ping. If your connection is stable, you won't see much of a change in DPS between 30 ping and 300 ping, and that is thanks to ability queue.
    No that's not how it works. I use ability queue and it's a massive difference between 50ms on live and 180ms on pts. Ability queue does not equalize anything.

  10. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daglar View Post
    While there is a lot of passion out there about modifying other aspects of energy regen the one that I'm going to approve and push through for now is as follows:

    Rogue energy regen will be changed from 23 per second to 24 per second.
    Tablets will have energy regeneration removed from them.
    This gives you the effective energy regen of a character using a tablet - for free and all the time.

    We will not be addressing concerns regarding fervor or other energy regen buffs at this moment in time.

    Daglar
    Lead Game Designer: Rift
    Boring. Giving passives/active abilities to make people invest points/effort into having better energy management would have been better. This applies to warriors too.

  11. #101
    RIFT Fan Site Operator Dunharrow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kokie View Post
    Why not fix the real issue instead of putting a band-aid on the situation?


    The fact of the matter is Warriors have ONE spec that they need cost reduction at all.



    We require at least LE for EVERY single one of our viable raid dps specs, and Fervor for almost all of them. Why bring a DPS rogue to a raid when you have to accommodate to their needs? When you could just sub them out for a warrior or mage and use LE/Run speed?


    Talking sense to most of these Devs is like talking to a brick wall, and why more then likely i'm out after Maelforge goes down.
    A bandaid is faster. They can basically push this out untested because there's no balance concerns. I think this is a positive move and shows they recognize the issue. Changing reliance on Fervor is a much bigger change, that will require testing.

  12. #102
    Shield of Telara
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    This was tossed around by the rogues in our guild.

    People are not complaining about the energy cost as much as they are complaining about the cost to solve the energy cost problem. If tablets were near free would you complain? I know I would not.

    Keep the energy regen on them.
    Keep the other benefits on them.

    Let us purchase them with planarite/inscribed whatever. How about 1 inscribed for 20 Tablets? I don't think people would complain that much then. The math works out to roughly one 3 hour block of progression for 1 iss. That ain't bad, and is fair imo. Now if they do that, make warriors power starved as well

  13. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kokie View Post
    Why not fix the real issue instead of putting a band-aid on the situation?


    The fact of the matter is Warriors have ONE spec that they need cost reduction at all.



    We require at least LE for EVERY single one of our viable raid dps specs, and Fervor for almost all of them. Why bring a DPS rogue to a raid when you have to accommodate to their needs? When you could just sub them out for a warrior or mage and use LE/Run speed?


    Talking sense to most of these Devs is like talking to a brick wall, and why more then likely i'm out after Maelforge goes down.
    I agree that the entire issue needs to be addressed but this band-aid took Daglar what... 2 minutes to address? Took Ailion... How long?

    If Daglar can see the issue, he can work on it. In the meantime, I will take the simple band-aid that should have been done MONTHS ago.
    The first issue I would like feedback on is the Power Regeneration. I have tweaked it to a point but I need feedback on it from actual players (You guys) in a real world environment to fine tune it. The value is not final and will likely need to be changed. The goal is to minimize the use and need for Tablets and make players who do not use them more viable without completely removing the use of the Tablets in game

  14. #104
    Sword of Telara Gynxz's Avatar
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    The issue was completely ignored. We dont have a Tablet Issue, we have an ENERGY issue. I can pop a tablet for dummy test but I cant pop a bard.

    We have 2 problems: We need MORE regen and we need to be less dependant of bards/LE. We use Tablets to mitigate those problems but they are not the problem, they are our band-aid.

    The equation got changed from Fervor+ tablet=starved to Fervor=Starved


    Fervor =4 energy+ per sec while Tablet = 1energy /per sec. They exchanged the way we get that 20% for non raiding content.


    Seems like the No more Tablets Icons got the message across, Time to change them to no more Fervor I guess.

  15. #105
    Champion of Telara Puandro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kokie View Post
    The real issue is for anything to happen, we have to start a mini riot on the forums for any of our issues to be acknowledged.

    And where is our own class dev speaking on this issue?

    Probably working on sab healing or something ;P





    My question to the devs is this :

    Why have an energy/power/mana resource if you don't have to manage it?


    (If I am wrong on any of these, please correct me as I barely play Rift anymore, I log on for my daily dungeon/MMs twice a week, and to Raid)

    - Mages do not have to manage mana outside of Stormcaller
    - Clerics do not have to manage mana outside of some DoL builds
    - Warriors have ONE build which requires Living Energy
    - Rogues on the other hand, require Fervor for nearly every viable raiding spec.



    TL;DR - Why bring a rogue to the raid? When you can comp stack the other 3 callings and have LE/Run Speed.
    I would't call asking your archon for mana or using a Mana Tonic as resource management but whatever. I run SC/Pyro in dungeons, Have to drink 1-2 during a dungeon, no big deal or just pop a mana pot if im lazy.

    51 BD, the most efficient rogue build even requires LE to run.
    Gnarlwood - Belladonna - P50 Rogue
    Seastone - Puandro - P24 Mage
    Im here for the PvE, not the unbalanced subpar PvP.
    Just Waiting...

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