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Thread: It feels like trion doesn't have any direction for the rogue calling

  1. #1
    General of Telara
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    Default It feels like trion doesn't have any direction for the rogue calling

    Talking primarily from a pve perspective, it seems like the rogue calling is mediocre at best in all aspects of the game. We are not the best dps, nor are we even close. We are not the best tanks, and we are not the best healers. The class is just stuck in this constant state of mediocrity. What is more disheartening is that our rogue developer is adamant in keeping us here. Once rogue receives any significant buffs, which isn't even top dps, it gets nerfed. The argument is that rogues should not be able to come close to warrior dps using a range spec. Why then are mages allowed to do it? Why are they not getting a nerfed? On top of this, there are no announcements to buff rogue melee specs.

    As a competitive player, I feel limited playing a rogue. Sure I can be a great rogue, or be a great player "even though I'm a rogue." In the grand scheme of things it is pretty insignificant when compared to top tier players from other callings. I guess what I'm really saying is that it would be nice to be the best class for something. I do not count bard. It's like saying b/c your calling cannot compete, then you should support the superior classes.

    Anyhow, I wish trion would give rogue a free reroll and be done with it. I honestly feel that trion, or at least our rogue dev, has no idea what to do with the calling. If it were not b/c of the amount of time invested in the AA system and gearing up, I would not be playing a rogue. The class is fun, but it is not competitive. Lets be honest, outside of being a bard, a rogues can be easily replaced in raids and it will probably be better for the raid overall. Mages and warriors are way better dps. Warrior are much better tanks. And as healers, rogues just flat out sucks. Sure we can splash minor heals around the raid to appear competitive in HPS, but in actuality it is insignificant buffering.

    [Edit]
    Last edited by GreatWhiteRhino; 12-27-2011 at 10:45 PM. Reason: Abusive and Disparaging Comments Directed at Trion Employees

  2. #2
    RIFT Guide Writer Gyle's Avatar
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    While i agree with the fact that rogues are not in a great place right now, your post is just filled with unnecessary hyperbole. Rogue are not be any means insignificant. For instance our guild ran 7 rogues for Sicaron last week, and came out with the number 4 parse on Riftlogs. A well played character of ANY calling is worth 2 mediocre players from the "OP" callings.

    Rogues are not the class with the top DPS potential, but unless you have some seriously skilled warriors and mages in your guild, the fact that you are not topping guild parses is your own fault. A great rogue can out parse a good warrior or a good mage 9 times out of 10 Single Target. If you feel like you are not able to be an asset it is not the rogue calling's fault, it is yours. Don't re-roll, get better.
    Last edited by Gyle; 12-18-2011 at 07:55 AM.
    Hastati (50 warrior), Tsar (50 cleric), Tsaritsa (50 Mage)
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    5/8 ID; HK Conqueror

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    RIFT Guide Writer Zyzyx's Avatar
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    So what you want is for the top rogue dps'ers in the world like qan and kokie to be doing similar numbers top dpsers from other classes?

    In single target or AoE or both?

    Quote Originally Posted by Daglar View Post
    When time allows I'll be looking at the issue with the class guys.

  4. #4
    RIFT Guide Writer Gyle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zyzyx View Post
    So what you want is for the top rogue dps'ers in the world like qan and kokie to be doing similar numbers top dpsers from other classes?

    In single target or AoE or both?
    This would be great, i think we would ALL love to see rogues be in that place right now. All I'm saying is that most guild don't have players even close to that good, but they don't have warriors as good as Rizaz, or mages as good as Skelos either. And in those guild, rogues are still good enough that if you are more skilled than your cross calling counterparts you really should be able to make up the difference inherent in the callings.
    Hastati (50 warrior), Tsar (50 cleric), Tsaritsa (50 Mage)
    Guides: 51 Bladedancer, Bloodstalker, Nightblade
    DPS Rogue <Trinity>
    5/8 ID; HK Conqueror

  5. #5
    General of Telara
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zyzyx View Post
    So what you want is for the top rogue dps'ers in the world like qan and kokie to be doing similar numbers top dpsers from other classes?

    In single target or AoE or both?
    Yes. I prefer single target dps to be equal for now. Ideally I would rather have both be equal.
    Last edited by xzaar; 12-18-2011 at 08:57 AM.

  6. #6
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    crossing fingers that 1.7 is our patch,

    if not... my mage is HK ready :P

  7. #7
    Plane Walker
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    Rogues are broken. Theres nothing a rogue can do that another class can't do better, in both pvp and pve.

  8. #8
    RIFT Guide Writer Zyzyx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Emanresu View Post
    Rogues are broken. Theres nothing a rogue can do that another class can't do better, in both pvp and pve.
    What about dying? =P
    Last edited by Zyzyx; 12-19-2011 at 02:35 AM.

    Quote Originally Posted by Daglar View Post
    When time allows I'll be looking at the issue with the class guys.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Emanresu View Post
    Rogues are broken. Theres nothing a rogue can do that another class can't do better, in both pvp and pve.
    We can provide fervor better than any other class.

  10. #10
    Plane Touched SiliconShadow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kokie View Post
    crossing fingers that 1.7 is our patch,

    if not... my mage is HK ready :P
    Don't you dare young man you are better than that squeeze extra out of your rotations damnit, we won't be beaten we won't!

  11. #11
    Ascendant Archemys's Avatar
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    Meh... I'm close to the top dps in my guild w\ my rogue. I generally out-dps the better geared pyro mages.

    AOE dps is not top if you have somebody running storm caller... Hell, I was pulling 5500 AOE in some T2's last night on my fairly under-geared mage.

    And yes... I am good at dying.
    <Coriolis>
    Archemys

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kokie View Post
    crossing fingers that 1.7 is our patch,

    if not... my mage is HK ready :P
    What makes you think that 1.7 will be our patch?

    Isn't it the cleric patch?

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kokie View Post
    crossing fingers that 1.7 is our patch,

    if not... my mage is HK ready :P


    /10char

  14. #14
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    Just quit and a play a game that doesn't punish people for not being Warrior or Mage.

    I'm not being inflammatory. It is exactly what I have done.
    Raenryong@Deepwood R69 ~ Amathys@Zaviel (Rogue)
    Serefina@Deepwood R66 ~ Solserefina@Zaviel (Warrior)
    Seraena@Deepwood R80 ~ Seraena@Zaviel R70 (Cleric)
    Avalonia@Deepwood R66 ~ Avalonia@Zaviel (Mage)
    <Dauntless> ~ <Excellence>

  15. #15
    Ascendant Zazen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xzaar View Post
    Talking primarily from a pve perspective, it seems like the rogue calling is mediocre at best in all aspects of the game. We are not the best dps, nor are we even close. We are not the best tanks, and we are not the best healers. The class is just stuck in this constant state of mediocrity. What is more disheartening is that our rogue developer is adamant in keeping us here. Once rogue receives any significant buffs, which isn't even top dps, it gets nerfed. The argument is that rogues should not be able to come close to warrior dps using a range spec. Why then are mages allowed to do it? Why are they not getting a nerfed? On top of this, there are no announcements to buff rogue melee specs.

    As a competitive player, I feel limited playing a rogue. Sure I can be a great rogue, or be a great player "even though I'm a rogue." In the grand scheme of things it is pretty insignificant when compared to top tier players from other callings. I guess what I'm really saying is that it would be nice to be the best class for something. I do not count bard. It's like saying b/c your calling cannot compete, then you should support the superior classes.

    Anyhow, I wish trion would give rogue a free reroll and be done with it. I honestly feel that trion, or at least our rogue dev, has no idea what to do with the calling. If it were not b/c of the amount of time invested in the AA system and gearing up, I would not be playing a rogue. The class is fun, but it is not competitive. Lets be honest, outside of being a bard, a rogues can be easily replaced in raids and it will probably be better for the raid overall. Mages and warriors are way better dps. Warrior are much better tanks. And as healers, rogues just flat out sucks. Sure we can splash minor heals around the raid to appear competitive in HPS, but in actuality it is insignificant buffering.

    On a side note, I feel that Ailion is doing a terrible job with the class. I honestly believe if he is in charged of the rogue class, it will not get any better. At this point, I don't have any confidence in his ability as a class lead. Please trion, replace this guy for the good of the rogue community. I honestly have not seen any other class dev more publicly criticized than Ailion.

    Please enlighten us on the direction you would take rogues. Furthermore do that while keeping all game mechanics in mind and provide a detailed framework so that no particular player group feels disenfranchised.

    I expect the following:
    - Perfect solutions for all player archetypes so that they can equally and competitively fulfill all roles
    - Complete PvP and PvE balance
    - Maintain challenge for all player groups in all raid, rift, dungeon and sliver tiers

    This is just a small remit to get you started.

    Well? Chop chop!
    Last edited by Zazen; 12-19-2011 at 02:11 PM.

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