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Thread: Rogues are NOT op

  1. #1
    Rift Disciple Phaetill's Avatar
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    Default Rogues are NOT op

    The people complaining must be horrid at the game,that's not an opinion it's a fact. There is no rogue build,no magic scinario you can cook up to where a rogue is unkillable,for every strength rogues have there is a weakness,if you can't find it & exploit it....you are just bad at a already comically easy game.

    This isn't a troll attempt,I just don't understand how dumb or bad or both,people can be....Rift might take the cake when it comes to highest **** ratio of any multiplayer game I have ever played.
    "I was a Rogue before the buffs,I'll be a Rogue after the nerfs"
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  2. #2
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    I agree here. I played a rogue in beta and since this game went live. I also played other classes. Either way you put it. Rogues got buffed and now we are "OP". I think it maybe that we are no longer overlooked so we look OP. That and we have had to be good even when our calling was horrible.

    If you want to blame someone for rogue "OP"ness then blame trion. They left us in the dark so long that we got good while being crappy and then buff us and now we are even better than intended because we all had to adapt in one way or another. Give it some time and we will be no different then anyone else. It will just take time for people to get used to the new specs and tactics we got in 1.5.
    Last edited by Razaden; 10-03-2011 at 08:11 AM.

  3. #3
    Rift Disciple Phaetill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Razaden View Post
    I agree here. I played a rogue in beta and since this game went live. I also played other classes. Either way you put it. Rogues got buffed and now we are "OP". I think it maybe that we are no longer overlooked so we look OP. That and we have had to be good even when our calling was horrible.

    If you want to blame someone for rogue "OP"ness then blame trion. They left us in the dark so long that we got good while being crappy and then buff us and now we are even better than intended because we all had to adapt in one way or another. Give it some time and we will be no different then anyone else. It will just take time for people to get used to the new specs and tactics we got in 1.5.
    There had been soul combo's/tactics that I just steamroll people with and there had been certain soul combo's that crushed me...the only thing that changed in 1.5 is tactics,I don't see rogues going around beating 4-5 people at once like people have claimed,I thought it was funny at first but now it genuinely rages me how slow people can be...Atleast you get it. +1
    "I was a Rogue before the buffs,I'll be a Rogue after the nerfs"
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    Champion Cinerus's Avatar
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    The problem is, people think their old specs will still work just as great vs rogues as they did in 1.4. They're too lazy or stubborn to try a different approach.
    - Kaboomium <The Unnamed> -

  5. #5
    Rift Disciple Phaetill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cinerus View Post
    The problem is, people think their old specs will still work just as great vs rogues as they did in 1.4. They're too lazy or stubborn to try a different approach.
    Exactly,rogues got a few new mechanics,& the dps went up by a little.. the mechanics can be nulled though,example the mm vamp arrows people actually complaining about them is a joke,they can be debuffed off first of all "and the person 95% of the time doesn't even notice" and all in all it doesn't make much of a diff,ppl say it's op when sprayed etc but when sprayed it does crap damage so it nulls itself. people just have to adapt,learn what to do to beat w/e rogue build is giving them problems.

    I never complained when certain warrior builds could kill me without attacking a while back,literally. or when certain ones could swat me down in 3-4 hits,I read as much as I could,adapted & stopped having problems with warriors. Why can't people just play & get better at the game instead of whining & whining....it's not just the forums it's all over in game chat as well & it's just old man.
    "I was a Rogue before the buffs,I'll be a Rogue after the nerfs"
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  6. #6
    Telaran Anachronite's Avatar
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    Amen! Rogues are meant for DPS... there is no such thing as an OP Rogue no matter how much we stomp down other classes.

  7. #7
    Ascendant Proclus_Lycaeus's Avatar
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    I love how people say Rogues are OP and unkillable. I've been playing one since the Alpha days, and while I may not be the best in PvP, I did kill my fair share of people in PvP yesterday (FINALLY, because Warriors and Clerics dominated it before) and I *STILL* died a lot.

    Rogues are the indestructible death machines that Clerics and Warriors are whining about. Clerics and Warriors are whining about Rogues because THEY want to be "the best class" ONCE AGAIN.
    Retired from the forum community 12/19/2017

  8. #8
    Plane Walker
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phaetill View Post
    The people complaining must be horrid at the game,that's not an opinion it's a fact. There is no rogue build,no magic scinario you can cook up to where a rogue is unkillable,for every strength rogues have there is a weakness,if you can't find it & exploit it....you are just bad at a already comically easy game.

    This isn't a troll attempt,I just don't understand how dumb or bad or both,people can be....Rift might take the cake when it comes to highest **** ratio of any multiplayer game I have ever played.
    Same thing can be said about warriors being "OP" but still the tears flowed....
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  9. #9
    Telaran heelmeh's Avatar
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    [WALL]

    Of course rogues can be killed. That doesn't mean they're not OP. Every class can be killed. OP really is ridiculously subjective and not really relevant. Isn't invisibility OP? Is wearing plate OP? No. Each class should have its particular strengths. Classes should not be exactly equivalent. I don't want to play my former rogue or mage that has now been nerfed into a vanilla white blob, against your former warrior or cleric vanilla white blob.

    We all know that in these games, often soon after a player dies in pvp combat, much of the time he/she/it runs to the forums to whine about how the class that killed him/her/it must be op. Sometimes these players even take the trouble to configure long posts which attempt to simulate intelligence through the use of pseudosmarts (aka theorycrafting) in order to build a case. Then there's the forums effect, observable in most online forums, where complainers tend to outweigh everyone else, and where a single complaint can turn into a 20 page thread and remain very active for weeks, seeming to gain consensus when it's only really a small segment of the population chiming in. All this leads developers to believe that something needs to be nerfed.

    All that said, I do believe Trion tinkered way too much with rogues this last patch. In my view, changes ought to be rolled out incrementally so their effects and consequences can be measured more carefully.

    Still, as tends to be the case when you express an opinion these days, many folks will try very hard to do everything BUT see your point of view. Back in the day we used to try to understand even those we disagreed with; today, express any opinion and you're likely to get ridiculed, attacked, character assassinated, or simply called names.

    [/WALL]

    yay

  10. #10
    Plane Touched
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phaetill View Post
    The people complaining must be horrid at the game,that's not an opinion it's a fact. There is no rogue build,no magic scinario you can cook up to where a rogue is unkillable,for every strength rogues have there is a weakness,if you can't find it & exploit it....you are just bad at a already comically easy game.

    This isn't a troll attempt,I just don't understand how dumb or bad or both,people can be....Rift might take the cake when it comes to highest **** ratio of any multiplayer game I have ever played.
    Being overpowered doesn't have to mean you're unkillable. Being overpowered means you are too strong in too many areas.

  11. #11
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    pre-15, MM were doing well enough for themselves. They had respectable spike dps and fair survivability, every other soul was meh at best.

    1.5 bumped thier consistent dps to the lvls of their old 'hit and run' spike dps. 1.5 added in a heal debuff on a ranged soul with the best rogue utility. It also made it leach...

    melee, prepatch, was suffering, they needed a buff and the dps bonus to assassin might be a tinge over the top but the only noticable buff NB got was fell blades... the soul's dps is still meh, its survivability (otherwise) is absolutely nothing besides 3 2 minute CDs but the fell blades buff pulls the soul into line and makes other souls, like bladedancer, that got forgotten with the patch, usable and Riftstalker into a good PvP tanking soul.

    From what i have seen adding that aoe applyable leaching heal debuff onto a top notch dps soul with utterly fantastic utility is an easy way to make a soul OP. Adding it to a mediocre dps soul on the other hand is fine.
    Last edited by garethh; 10-03-2011 at 12:50 PM.

  12. #12
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    Vampiric Munitions being AoE spammable is definitely OP'd, and trust me.. it'll get tuned down. The healing VM does isn't showing on the Scoreboard, but some players are showing parses of 150k healed through VM over the course of one Port Scion fight, etc.

    Trust me, Vampiric Munitions nerf is coming. If you search the forums you will find dozens of rogues admitting it's too extreme of an ability to put on a ranged DPS spec. Enjoy it while you can.

    Here's a link to one thread where plenty of Rogues agree on it's OP-ness...

    http://forums.riftgame.com/rift-gene...-balanced.html
    Last edited by nocks; 10-03-2011 at 12:53 PM.

  13. #13
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    For an example of a relatively simple/common situation where VM becomes stupidly overpowered, let's imagine:

    A rogue is spamming his Fan Out, a mediocre-damage ranged AE attack, on a group of 5 players. One of those 5 players is a cleric healer, and he is spamming his AE heal to keep his team from slowly dying from Fan Out.

    Every person that cleric heals gets 1000 health per second (just an example to make it easier to imagine). The rogue, who has used Fan Out at least 5 times has VM on every one of the five players. As each of the five players gets his 1000 health (now 500 thanks to VM) the Rogue gets 500 health x5, giving him 2.5x the healing that any one player would have alone. Now the Rogue is getting 2500 HPS, and when you get into big group situations like the new Library or like Port Scion, you can easily get more healing as a Rogue than you could get as a Cleric focus-healing yourself, etc. Does that sound rational for a class that is also one of the top ranged DPS specs?

    I'm sure they will nerf VM to work like EM and have a cooldown on AE attacks.
    Last edited by nocks; 10-03-2011 at 01:02 PM.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by nocks View Post
    As each of the five players gets his 1000 health (now 500 thanks to VM) the Rogue gets 250 health x5, giving him 1.25x the healing that any one player would have alone. Now the Rogue is getting 1250 HPS
    Corrected your numbers.

    But yeah, VM is a bit too strong when it is applied to multiple people.

  15. #15
    Soulwalker
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    what a rediculous post. rogues are op atm , no doubt. i die in both stuns (assasin) without being able to do anything and just getting farmed isnt exactly balanced in my eyes, and no, i concider myself a good mmo player after playing at 2,5k rating as ele shaman in wow, so im used to playing an underdog class, but this is shocking. im a cleric btw. ofc you will say everything about your class not being op when your enjoying it cus you just want it to last. 1 rogue is all it takes to exit the game while trying to do the daily pvp quests, and just log back on at a later point just hoping that there isnt a rogue arround anymore. i dont feel any healing class should be able to die 1 on 1 without any proper use of cd's/cc and interuption and a functioning brain, thats just wrong.

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