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Thread: Rogue 1.5 OP bets

  1. #1
    Rift Master A Mage's Avatar
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    Smile Rogue 1.5 OP bets

    Taking bets that the rogue buffs are WAY over the top. Yes, I do feel that rogue buffs are needed, but with this many changes in one patch something is bound to be broken.

    Rogue new FotM inc!
    Xail - R41 Mage
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  2. #2
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    Apparently warriors aren't OP. Rogues are being brought up to the level of warriors.

    If rogues are OP, warriors are OP.

    But we've already established that warriors are not OP, so rogues wont be OP.

  3. #3
    Rift Master A Mage's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leslol View Post
    Apparently warriors aren't OP. Rogues are being brought up to the level of warriors.

    If rogues are OP, warriors are OP.

    But we've already established that warriors are not OP, so rogues wont be OP.
    Orly. 51 RB isn't OP?

    Am I missing the /sarcasm?
    Xail - R41 Mage
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  4. #4
    Rift Disciple Karnes's Avatar
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    From what I've seen so far its just going to give us more options than sabdancer, not actually buff us much as a whole, maybe a small amount, but I seriously doubt its going to put us in warrior territory, a lot of the parse numbers people are seeing put up is with full HK relics.

  5. #5
    Prophet of Telara
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    As far as PvP, there is some buffage going on. It'll help a lot, but I don't believe it will be as OP as many claim.

    As far as PvE, most parses I'm seeing just put other builds on par with the Sabdancer for ST dps. A few are a bit higher, but seem to give up their AoE option. Sabdancer will still be used the most at this point because it'll be able to do ST and AoE dps in one build. Also, the bomb changes won't affect the Sabdancer build in the least.

    Problem is, Warriors are still out-dpsing what we can do - even on the test server. It has been established by the dps buffs to Mages/Clerics that Warriors are being used as the benchmark of where everyone should be. Rogues aren't there yet.

    We got more options - not more DPS.

  6. #6
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    Since rogues still gets energy starved, our burst should be higher than warrior burst/sustained dmg, but since it wont happen, there is no way for rogues to be op.

    Survivability... don't think vampiric poisons helps that much to be op.

    Also warrior vs rogue 1vs1 warrior wins as vampiric poisons here doesn't helps at all.
    Adalie r8 Rogue - Icewatch
    Acex r6 Cleric - Icewatch
    Gran r8 warrior - Icewatch

  7. #7
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    I think people get a little bent out of shape and seem to think the felblades change is really going to revolutionize how long rogues survive. If we die in 2-3 seconds from a warrior we will still die in 2-3 seconds but maybe 2.2-3.5 seconds now.

    Maybe with the NB changes we might actually do some damage for a change but I still see that happening unless we pop defensive cooldowns.

  8. #8
    Soulwalker
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    ..In the meantime on all other class sub-forums...

    Does anyone know if us mages got some nice fixes?

    - I don't know yet man, haven't seen anything for my cleric either..

    But, like ZOMG, have you seen the rogue fixes? I've never played a rogue, but this patch is soooooo going to make them OP like wtfbqqpwnage!

    - Yeah, let's go complain on their forum!


    ...


    And now you are all here..****.

  9. #9
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    I'll be afraid once they nerf rogues after the patch... last time they nerfed warriors hard resulted in me hitting high-valor targets with 4k anytimers...

    well, the rogues will get what they wanted - be a warrior with stealth, immunity, selfheals and slip-away... (note that this is the same bs as a 51rb with lingering wounds - simply impossible, but since there is more than one warrior it feels like it)

    I hope the nerfs come cabba-style: early and devastating in pvp only ^^

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raitoken View Post
    I think people get a little bent out of shape and seem to think the felblades change is really going to revolutionize how long rogues survive. If we die in 2-3 seconds from a warrior we will still die in 2-3 seconds but maybe 2.2-3.5 seconds now.

    Maybe with the NB changes we might actually do some damage for a change but I still see that happening unless we pop defensive cooldowns.
    I completely agree, due to our lack of survivabilty you would think we would be able to burst someone incredibly fast, but that's never going to happen and im ok with that because it would probably be OP.
    The only way would be to boost our survivability, but relying on cooldowns doesnt cut it, and fel blades or munitions wont do the trick either as far as i can tell, although, we will need to see what we're working with once it hits live.

    I just cant help but feel people are getting overexcited and im sorry to say they will most likely be dissapointed.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cromagis View Post
    Warriors are on par with cleric and rogue tanking
    Quote Originally Posted by Cromagis View Post
    Rogues can out mitigate warriors damage (And they have 1 tanking soul, go figure.)

  11. #11
    Plane Touched
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    Yep these are changes we should have seen patches ago. As is were still behind everyone, not enough for me to resub unless they do more.

  12. #12
    Prophet of Telara
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oktabi View Post
    I'll be afraid once they nerf rogues after the patch... last time they nerfed warriors hard resulted in me hitting high-valor targets with 4k anytimers...

    well, the rogues will get what they wanted - be a warrior with stealth, immunity, selfheals and slip-away... (note that this is the same bs as a 51rb with lingering wounds - simply impossible, but since there is more than one warrior it feels like it)

    I hope the nerfs come cabba-style: early and devastating in pvp only ^^
    This is the exact kind of whining that just proves every other class wants Rogues at the bottom of the totem pole. Who complains about Fell Blades in it's current implementation? Now - let the Rogue steal 10% of a heal and it is suddenly OP? I don't think so.

    The only thing that could be construed as OP at the moment is Vampiric Munitions - it shouldn't hit 100% of the time. They went over the top with that - and not far enough with the rest. Rogues still won't be all that survivable with the changes. That's fine - they need to give the glass a cannon.

    *EDIT* As far as Cabby-style nerfs...DPS Clerics still top the damage boards. I find it funny how every class that complains they were "nerfed" is still one of the most competitive classes there are.
    Last edited by Calo; 09-10-2011 at 07:17 AM.

  13. #13
    Plane Walker
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    I already kill quite effectively with my rogue, and these changes will give me the extra boost to have a good chance to beat those god mode mage specs. I tend to think mm with eradicate and a healing debuff might be a bit over the top, but it is hard to say because no one but rogues are on the PTS every time I've checked.

    There are several specs being brought up to speed, and so there will be more useful, different types of rogues running around. I think it may even be possible to be useful as a ranger.

    On this note I also think it would be nice to see other callings get more options. Warriors are all running some variant of 51 rb because they say it is the only spec worth it. Most mages are running chloro/lock, or dom. I see some storm callers and pyros do well, but they tend to implode if you target them. Perhaps trading the 4k+ shots for a bit more survival would be a good idea? Would be nice to see elementalist on the battlefield being a bit more useful.

    I don't know much about clerics to be honest, and they seem to be in a decent place. I know both mages and clerics have the ability to be top damage and healing, but providing more versatility in the usefulness of various souls for each calling can only be a good thing.
    Last edited by tuluka; 09-10-2011 at 07:20 AM.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by tuluka View Post

    On this note I also think it would be nice to see other callings get more options. Warriors are all running some variant of 51 rb because they say it is the only spec worth it. Most mages are running chloro/lock, or dom. I see some storm callers and pyros do well, but they tend to implode if you target them. Perhaps trading the 4k+ shots for a bit more survival would be a good idea? Would be nice to see elementalist on the battlefield being a bit more useful.
    I understand your point, and would agree with it if it were true. Truth is, everyone assumes other classes don't have options because they don't use the ones available.

    Got some Warriors in my guild who were running the standard RB build like everyone else, who recently just tried going back to Champ. Now all I see in guild chat is about how many skulls they are cracking - how they just hit 4 people for 1500+ damage with one swing, etc etc. Warriors don't run RB because it is their only option, they run it because compared to what is in the game currently, it could easily be described as OP. The damage isn't over the top, but it is not proportioned right to the high defense.

    As far as Mages go, their glass cannons perform well on the DPS front. They are valid options. Like Warriors, the other side of the coin is that they can top DPS AND Healing as a Chloro/Lock, so why not play it?

    Other classes aren't lacking options, they are just choosing the option that over-performs while making them nearly invincible to 25% of the playerbase. Rogues currently don't have one of those options. Hopefully these options will be less appealing to them post-Rogue changes, but I'm not sure if the current changes are enough to do that or not. A lot of the stuff looks nice on paper, but if you actually look at what they did, they removed some damage here and threw it back in over here, etc etc...seems to me like they might just be shuffling cards on us.
    Last edited by Calo; 09-10-2011 at 07:36 AM.

  15. #15
    Plane Walker herlpderp's Avatar
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    A meele rogue dps should never be on par w/ a meele warrior dps, simply because warrirors have NO-OTHER-OPTION. Or, have a ranged DPS comparable to the meele DPS of either classes.

    ^That being said, if 1.5 goes in unchanged, enjoy the new warhammer.

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