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Thread: Marksman best DPS for instances/raid

  1. #1
    Soulwalker
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    Default Marksman best DPS for instances/raid

    I'm toying with the ZAM Soul Tree Calculator and I'm wondering what the highest MM DPS build is for instances/raids.

    I think it will be one of the following.

    Marksman/Ranger/Nightblade 33/19/14
    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0M...o.AM0buc.V0xzh

    Marksman/Nightblade/Assassin 35/15/8 (and 8 points I don't know where to put)
    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0M...AubR.0qM.V0xMh

    Marksman/Ranger/Assassin 33/25/8
    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0M....AM0buckcz.0qM

    Marksman/Assassin/Ranger 51/8/7
    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0M....AM0buckcz.0qM

    Or do you know a build with even better dps? Any comments are appreciated.
    Last edited by Persipnei; 06-10-2011 at 02:29 AM.

  2. #2
    Ascendant Naronas's Avatar
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    To the best of my knowledge, deep ranger>deep MM for PVE dps. MM is decent in PVP, but not so good in PVE right now.
    Quote Originally Posted by Walsingham View Post
    Yes, if you need to know, Vespera hit me with a big pointy spiky thing. It was immensely painful.

  3. #3
    Soulwalker
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    Quote Originally Posted by Persipnei View Post
    I'm toying with the ZAM Soul Tree Calculator and I'm wondering what the highest MM DPS build is for instances/raids.

    I think it will be one of the following.

    Marksman/Ranger/Nightblade 33/19/14
    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0M...o.AM0buc.V0xzh

    Marksman/Nightblade/Assassin 35/15/8 (and 8 points I don't know where to put)
    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0M...AubR.0qM.V0xMh

    Marksman/Ranger/Assassin 33/25/8
    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0M....AM0buckcz.0qM

    Marksman/Assassin/Ranger 51/8/7
    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0M....AM0buckcz.0qM

    Or do you know a build with even better dps? Any comments are appreciated.
    After some more toying, I realized Feral Instincts is to beautifull to not pick, so I changed the MM/RNG/*** (edit: now i understand why people say SIN, and not A S S :-) ) from 33/25/8 to 32/26/8.
    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0M....AM0bucksz.0qM

    I can't really see why I'd put more points into ranger... Is the bloodrapter worth it, to put 5 more points in it?
    Last edited by Persipnei; 06-10-2011 at 02:55 AM.

  4. #4
    RIFT Guide Writer Hokonoso's Avatar
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    so many threads, so many parses, so many guides.... im confused. are you wanting us to say that all 4 of your builds are bad? you wanting us to tell why you? you want us to hold your hand for you and post our builds/parses/rotations? oh wait we already did... in other threads all throughout the forum...

    to answer a few questions, none of those builds are worth anything in pve dps. the blood raptor is another 210 dps or so and the wolf is only 60dps so it is def worth "another 5 points" mm is horrible for pve dps, ranger is much better... saboteur is better than both due to mobility and super high aoe. 51sin is not good for pve tho has great burst for pvp, no matter your melee dps spec, you want deadly dance (13+ bladedancer) or you will fall way behind, you will also want fiery spike (nightblade) as well as 17 assassin for the 20% crit dmg.. yes this pigeonholes you to sin/bd/nb with only a matter of how you wish to play it... g'luck finding the build you are looking for.
    Useful Rogue guides since I don't want to answer 50 billion questions anymore:
    Marksman, Ranger, Nightblade, Blink'Blade, Asstalker, Assdancer, and finally The Hoko Spec™
    Hoko, teaching noobs the way of rogue pve until 12/20/11.

  5. #5
    Soulwalker
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hokonoso View Post
    so many threads, so many parses, so many guides.... im confused. are you wanting us to say that all 4 of your builds are bad? you wanting us to tell why you? you want us to hold your hand for you and post our builds/parses/rotations? oh wait we already did... in other threads all throughout the forum...

    to answer a few questions, none of those builds are worth anything in pve dps. the blood raptor is another 210 dps or so and the wolf is only 60dps so it is def worth "another 5 points" mm is horrible for pve dps, ranger is much better... saboteur is better than both due to mobility and super high aoe. 51sin is not good for pve tho has great burst for pvp, no matter your melee dps spec, you want deadly dance (13+ bladedancer) or you will fall way behind, you will also want fiery spike (nightblade) as well as 17 assassin for the 20% crit dmg.. yes this pigeonholes you to sin/bd/nb with only a matter of how you wish to play it... g'luck finding the build you are looking for.
    Yes, there are so many threads, so many guides, and they all say different things. I don't want you to hold my hand, just hear what you think about it... And thank you, you gave me the answers I needed, it's like you read my thoughts, it's magic :-p

  6. #6
    RIFT Guide Writer Hokonoso's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Persipnei View Post
    Yes, there are so many threads, so many guides, and they all say different things. I don't want you to hold my hand, just hear what you think about it... And thank you, you gave me the answers I needed, it's like you read my thoughts, it's magic :-p
    lol glad to help. for a few builds that i run this guide http://www.tophatgents.com/forums/vi...03634#25378218 is pretty good. the saboteur part is pretty much what i use for all instances and most raiding with minor variations on rotation based on buffs/energy. and the 27bd guide is VERY good dps.
    Useful Rogue guides since I don't want to answer 50 billion questions anymore:
    Marksman, Ranger, Nightblade, Blink'Blade, Asstalker, Assdancer, and finally The Hoko Spec™
    Hoko, teaching noobs the way of rogue pve until 12/20/11.

  7. #7
    Rift Disciple
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    I've played around with the MM, Ranger, and Sab builds and this is my opinion of them for PvE.

    MM - Does decent damage and has some nice burst abilities. Faces a serious problem of being energy starved. (ie. You run out of energy and have to wait on it to do your cool DPS abilites.) Must stay in one spot to do damage.

    Ranger - Requires the use of a Pet. If you do not like using a pet, look elsewhere.


    Sab - At the moment, is probably the best, Rogue, at range, soul. Only problem is the game mechanics are slightly different and take practice to get used too.

  8. #8
    Telaran
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    Quote Originally Posted by Persipnei View Post
    I can't really see why I'd put more points into ranger... Is the bloodrapter worth it, to put 5 more points in it?
    The blood raptor is worth it, but only barely and only if you have petcast macroed for all of your attacks.

    I've tested a 31/18/17 Rng/MM/Sin build and a 26/23/17 Rng/MM/Sin build. The second build was only 10 DPS less so it's viable but not optimal. The difference in DPS was entirely due to the Blood Raptor and petcast.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hokonoso View Post
    the blood raptor is another 210 dps or so and the wolf is only 60dps so it is def worth "another 5 points"
    These numbers are way off. I got significantly lower for the raptor and significantly higher for the wolf.

    Just telling the pets to attack, sitting back, and watching, the wolf was over 80 and the raptor was over 100. The big difference comes during your actual rotation with petcast macros included. The raptor gains close to 50% dps and the wolf barely over 10%. I think the main reason behind this is because the use of petcast macros allows the raptor to effectively stack rend, which works like fiery spike. It's too easy for the stacks of rend to drop without petcast.

    I've got some screenshots of all of this testing at home. There are a few other things I want to test and when I get the time I will be posting a better write up, but 210 vs 60 DPS is horrible information. I could believe one or the other depending on gear (how does gear affect pets?) and points in Ranger, but all things being equal, they are not that far apart.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hokonoso View Post
    saboteur is better than both due to mobility and super high aoe.
    I do agree with this, but Ranger/MM is worthwhile if you want to improve your single target damage for some DPS races. I was able to get about a 10% gain over Saboteur at least on the dummies. That may drop a little during a movement heavy fight, so Saboteur is my preferred build for the majority of encounters.

  9. #9
    Telaran
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    Quote Originally Posted by mavik View Post
    I've played around with the MM, Ranger, and Sab builds and this is my opinion of them for PvE.

    MM - Does decent damage and has some nice burst abilities. Faces a serious problem of being energy starved. (ie. You run out of energy and have to wait on it to do your cool DPS abilites.) Must stay in one spot to do damage.

    Ranger - Requires the use of a Pet. If you do not like using a pet, look elsewhere.


    Sab - At the moment, is probably the best, Rogue, at range, soul. Only problem is the game mechanics are slightly different and take practice to get used too.
    First off in raids MM doesn't have energy problems, 2 you donot need to be standing still, we have 15 seconds off pedastal to do dmg. I've found that if your going to do MM you're dumb not to do 38 and get imp hnr. The highest dps spec for MM(and I've done every logical spec imaginable) is 38MM/17sin/11nb. With a pet I've found any 31+R spec to be boring and lack burst which is needed in alot of fights, thus 38MM/24R/4RS is better pet spec as you recieve the Wolf pet, which as stated still adds around 100dps in raids, while raptor is slightly higher, the burst in MM makes up for it. As for a 51 point spec 51MM/5sabo/10RS is best MM51 point spec. I personally hate Sabo as its boring, and enjoy the burst dmg from MM(around 2k during HnR).

  10. #10
    Shadowlander
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    If you wanna raid as MM make sure to go deep MM getting both the eradicate and deaden this will make you usebole for some thing for the DPS loss from not beeing even close to the cookie cutter builds I have an MM build I use at times and only time I get to use it is for those 2 abilaties. For single target DPS I will lose 100dps and for a 8-9 min fight thats alot of damage.

  11. #11
    Rift Chaser Sharpshooter's Avatar
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    While my guild was trying to figure out the optimal setup for Uruluuk I've tried to make a MM build which is on one hand must be at least 44 points in MM for Eradicate as I was on purge duty and on the other hand
    do somewhat decent damage.

    I ended up with this build:

    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0M...qdAudR.VMsbz.z

    51 MM / 14 RNG / 1 NB

    Key abilities that I found useful:

    +30% Damage from 51pt. pedestal
    +35% Damage on ranger abilities from Shadowfire
    +5% Damage from Headshot
    +3% Damage on Combo builders
    As mobile as a pedestal user can be and not pet-dependant

    For rotations I used:

    1) Shadow Fire + Rotations similar to the common ranger build:

    Macro #1 - Combo builder

    cast Piercing Shot
    cast Crippling Shot
    cast Quick Shot

    Macro #2 - Finisher

    cast Rapid Fire Shot
    cast Head Shot

    2) Marksman burst abilities on weakened state or whenever its needed - Strafe/Bulls Eye/Imp. Hit and run/Emp-Deadeye Shot

    3) Purge Macro

    cast @Focus Eradicate

    Parsed around 800 dps on dummy with this build with a mix of t2/t3 gear

    Probably far from optimal MM build but certainly worked for me in this situation

  12. #12
    General of Telara Virchow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sharpshooter View Post
    While my guild was trying to figure out the optimal setup for Uruluuk I've tried to make a MM build which is on one hand must be at least 44 points in MM for Eradicate as I was on purge duty and on the other hand
    do somewhat decent damage.

    I ended up with this build:

    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0M...qdAudR.VMsbz.z

    51 MM / 14 RNG / 1 NB

    Key abilities that I found useful:

    +30% Damage from 51pt. pedestal
    +35% Damage on ranger abilities from Shadowfire
    +5% Damage from Headshot
    +3% Damage on Combo builders
    As mobile as a pedestal user can be and not pet-dependant

    For rotations I used:

    1) Shadow Fire + Rotations similar to the common ranger build:

    Macro #1 - Combo builder

    cast Piercing Shot
    cast Crippling Shot
    cast Quick Shot

    Macro #2 - Finisher

    cast Rapid Fire Shot
    cast Head Shot

    2) Marksman burst abilities on weakened state or whenever its needed - Strafe/Bulls Eye/Imp. Hit and run/Emp-Deadeye Shot

    3) Purge Macro

    cast @Focus Eradicate

    Parsed around 800 dps on dummy with this build with a mix of t2/t3 gear

    Probably far from optimal MM build but certainly worked for me in this situation
    I agree )

  13. #13
    RIFT Fan Site Operator Dunharrow's Avatar
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    The fewer your points in MM, the more damage you will do. The only trees with less damage are bard and riftstalker.
    Last edited by Dunharrow; 06-12-2011 at 09:47 PM.

  14. #14
    Soulwalker jonoadams72's Avatar
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    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=1M....0VMcx0b.V0x0o

    38mm/17sin/11nb

    best marksman dps spec imo.
    Otherside - 50 Rogue - Alsbeth

  15. #15
    Shadowlander
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonoadams72 View Post
    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=1M....0VMcx0b.V0x0o

    38mm/17sin/11nb

    best marksman dps spec imo.
    I agree, Been using this build since 1.2 released and I find it to be more effective than any other MM build. You will also see some really big critical numbers with this one!

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