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Thread: Battle Bard Comparisons

  1. #1
    Telaran
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    Default Battle Bard Comparisons

    I just finished parsing some battle bard specs.

    During all of these parses, I maintained the 3 motifs for resonance and did not use any of my long cooldown abilities to keep things quick and simple. My gear is mostly from tier 1 dungeons and expert rifts.

    Melee Bard:

    32 Bard 18 BD 16 NB - 519.80 DPS

    32 Bard 18 Sin 16 BD - 562.96 DPS

    Ranged Bard:

    32 Bard 26 Ranger 8 Sin - 549.91 DPS (roughly 100 DPS is from the pet)

    My Current DPS comparison:

    44 Sab 20 Sin 2 Ranger - 637.72 DPS

    With these parses, I think the Ranger build wins for battle bards and is definitely a good spec for expert dungeons. It's only got a 90 DPS drop from the single target damage of my Saboteur build and less than a 15 DPS drop from the best melee battle bard I tested.

    I know I probably missed some alternative builds that could be good. I also tested a couple that I decided to not post. They were both 40 point bard builds and suffered about a 50 DPS drop-off from the 32 point build using the same secondary and tertiary souls.

    Whenever I get more time, I may look into other builds, or I may just be playing the ranger spec.

  2. #2
    RIFT Guide Writer Gyle's Avatar
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    Ranged bard looks interesting, i think i would like to try it out, can you post the build?

  3. #3
    Telaran
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    Here are the builds I used:

    32 Bard 18 BD 16 NB
    This was the lowest DPS of my parses but it has an extra burst ability that the other builds do not since it has ebon fury and I did not test that. Still, probably the worst of the builds I looked at.

    32 Bard 18 Sin 16 BD
    I think it was worth using Power Chord in this rotation, but I did not actually test without it. That is something to look at. The general theory is that using Power Chord, reduces the combo builders needed to get Deadly Strike out, so you have faster finishers and fewer attacks that don't benefit from Deadly Dance. This build did the best damage and was not dependent on a pet.

    32 Bard 26 Ranger 8 Sin
    This seems to be the best build since it does almost as much damage as the melee build while staying at range, but it does depend on a pet and would suffer a significant drop in DPS without it. I did test Power Chord in this build and it was not worth using compared to getting more Piercing Shots off so it is not used in the posted parse.

    *Edit* And the DPS Sab build for comparison:
    44 Sab 20 Sin 2 Ranger
    Last edited by Silatt; 05-27-2011 at 10:11 AM.

  4. #4
    Plane Touched manekineko's Avatar
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    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0M...VcbVV0skVz.0VR

    Wouldn't this be stronger for a ranged bard based on Sozu-ranger theorycrafting?

    Part of the beauty of a melee bard is not only their ability to DPS but also their ability to buff their cadence healing by a generous amount. I'll try this out but I'm not convinced that it improves on the BD Bard.

  5. #5
    Telaran
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    I think Prey on the Weak is up all the time with only the 66% chance so the extra point isn't really needed. At least one point in Piercing Shot is also worthwhile since it is higher damage than Quick Shot. Having more abilities to rotate through also gives more time for the Quick Shot bleed to tick. You could definitely remove Improved Trick Shot and put some points in Doubleshot for what's probably a minor DPS increase.

    I didn't test healing too thoroughly but I wasn't too impressed with the BD increase. It would probably still be better to just go Cadence -> Cadence -> Coda of Restoration for pure healing. The only advantage BD has is doing a little more damage while still healing. I'd rather go all out damage or all out healing for now, as needed, while staying at range.

  6. #6
    Shield of Telara
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    these look great for experts and raid rift type of stuff. pretty similar to one of the ones i used during leveling and before respecing after 50.

    you happen to parse the hps? just wondering how much healing is being put out while putting out a decent amount of dps (in comparison to other bard dps).

  7. #7
    Telaran
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    There's no healing with any of these DPS rotations. You could get a little in by getting the other two motifs up but it would be minimal.

    Any sort of HPS rotation is going to have a big DPS drop, even the BD deadly dance build. The main goal of these builds is to provide group buffs while not losing much DPS and still being able to off-heal as needed. You'll either be running a DPS rotation or the standard bard HPS rotation, but can't do both at the same time.

    I did try a HPS rotation when I was running the BD/NB spec. I didn't save the parse though and was only somewhere in the 200s DPS with it while having to stay in melee range. I've seen some write ups in the forums with more info on this and basically, the best geared bards are only able to do healing/damage equivalent to a new level 50 chloro without all the gear upgrades.

    I know it would probably be best to make a mage for the play-style I'm trying to create with the battle bard, but I prefer rogues for the versatility of other builds and don't want to take the time for an alt yet.

  8. #8
    Rift Disciple
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silatt View Post
    I think Prey on the Weak is up all the time with only the 66% chance so the extra point isn't really needed. At least one point in Piercing Shot is also worthwhile since it is higher damage than Quick Shot. Having more abilities to rotate through also gives more time for the Quick Shot bleed to tick. You could definitely remove Improved Trick Shot and put some points in Doubleshot for what's probably a minor DPS increase.

    I didn't test healing too thoroughly but I wasn't too impressed with the BD increase. It would probably still be better to just go Cadence -> Cadence -> Coda of Restoration for pure healing. The only advantage BD has is doing a little more damage while still healing. I'd rather go all out damage or all out healing for now, as needed, while staying at range.
    I haven't tested it or anything, but theoretically the BD build should substantially outheal the ranger build. Your rotation would be something like Riff -> Deadly Strike -> Cadence -> Cadence -> CoR -> Cadence -> Power Chord/Cadence -> Deadly Strike. Three cadence casts at double damage should heal quite a bit more than one CoR every rotation, and Assassin increases all crit heals by 20%

  9. #9
    Plane Touched Siendra's Avatar
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    The ranged battle bard idea sounds pretty good, really. With neither T1's or T2's need the OH from a Bard, it sounds like a good way to have your cake and eat it too - be a bard without getting squeaked at to change roles. It wouldn't be difficult to macro cadence/restoration/riff/virtuoso in with the Ranger skills. Hell, Riff is probably a good skill to throw into regular rotations (Although holding it for riff -> Virtuoso -> Restoration spam is probably a good idea)
    Last edited by Siendra; 05-27-2011 at 12:27 PM.

  10. #10
    Plane Touched Siendra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silatt View Post
    32 Bard 26 Ranger 8 Sin
    This seems to be the best build since it does almost as much damage as the melee build while staying at range, but it does depend on a pet and would suffer a significant drop in DPS without it. I did test Power Chord in this build and it was not worth using compared to getting more Piercing Shots off so it is not used in the posted parse.
    I played this in a bunch of T1's and a couple T2's earlier. It's actually works out remarkably well. Properly macro'd I didn't have a problem switching tracks from blowing stuff up to OH. My DPS was also comparable to the dedicated DPS while providing motifs/fanfare/Anthem.

    The Direwolf by itself seems to put out like half or more the dps I typically do in my 51 point spec.

    Overall, really effective and a GREAT solution to the current state of support in T1/2.
    Last edited by Siendra; 05-27-2011 at 07:32 PM.

  11. #11
    Plane Touched manekineko's Avatar
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    So I finally got around to trying this out.

    WOW.

    I can easily pull 6-700 ST and 9-1000 AOE running xDSM with 36bow/29.2 daggers (these numbers include wolf DPS) while running DPS motifs, powersong, fervor, etc.

    I think that for 5-mans, this is my go-to. I thought battlebard would be the answer, but a good healer doesn't really need backup in most 5-mans except for a few fights, and in those fights, 44bard/17sin/5nb is more applicable than battlebard.

    I'll keep my battlebard for solo healing and fun times, but 44bard/17sin/5nb and 32bard/26ranger/8sin are my current go-tos.
    Last edited by manekineko; 06-01-2011 at 08:53 AM.

  12. #12
    Rift Disciple
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    Little addition to the "Ranger based Battlebard" for Experts:

    If you specc Imp Trickshot and Coda of Fury it's the destruction for blowing up trash faster (and it only costs you 2 points)

  13. #13
    Soulwalker
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    while I like the look of the build, it doesnt include the Rez.

    Will play this to see how it looks but losing the Rez is an issue for expert runs. I could use this but would still need a soul spec with rez in.

  14. #14
    Plane Touched manekineko's Avatar
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    The rez is out of combat. Besides, you usually need a 44/51 build for raids, so use this as your 4th/5th role.

  15. #15
    Telaran
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    I've also played around with a 40 Bard / 26 Ranger spec.

    It's been a while since I parsed but I think it only lost about 50-60 DPS for me compared to the 32/26/8 spec. It did have a few advantages though:
    - can buff with both fanfares
    - has the res so I don't need a 2nd bard build for now
    - has better AoE with Improved Trickshot / Coda of Fury / Deafening Music

    If you're going for pure damage, stop at 32, but for a little extra utility this build isn't bad. I need to try swapping the 0 point Sin for 0 point NB. I think working Fiery Spike into the rotation would be a little DPS boost compared to just the poison in Sin.

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