+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 11 of 11

Thread: Combining Marksman and Saboteur; A question

  1. #1
    Soulwalker
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    3

    Default Combining Marksman and Saboteur; A question

    I have Marskman and Saboteur as 2 of my 3 souls right now and I notced; the Charges for both classes are the exact same! I also noticed I can make all 5 charges with Swift Shot and use Detonate with them..but Blast Charge says it does extra damage when Detonated.

    So my question is thus; am I misisng out on that extra Blast Charge damage if I only use Swift Shot to build the charges and then use Detonate?

  2. #2
    Ascendant the_real_seebs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    16,859

    Default

    Charges are not the same thing as combo points.

    Most rogue abilities that build combo points do damage when triggered, and then finishing moves do additional damage.

    Saboteurs have an unusual mechanic, in that the "charge" abilities do no damage when used. Instead, they attach "charges" to the opponent, which are a special kind of debuff, in addition to building combo points. "Detonate" does damage, and also triggers the charges, so all the damage from the charges occurs at once.

    If you are using swift shot to build combo points, you are not applying charges to the enemy; you're just building combo points.

    If you use Blast Charge to build combo points, you will notice that it does no damage, but then when you use Detonate, it will do additional damage for each blast charge on the enemy. If you used Blast Charge to build combo points, then a power other than Detonate as your finisher, the Blast Charge power would be essentially wasted -- you would not get any damage for it.

    Does this make more sense now?
    You can play WoW in any MMO. You don't have to play WoW in RIFT. Oh, and no, RIFT is not a WoW clone. Not having fun any more? Learn to play, noob! I don't speak for Riftui, but I moderate stuff there. Just came back? Welcome back! Here's what's changed. (Updated for 2.5!)

  3. #3
    Soulwalker
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    3

    Default

    Not really. When I had Marksman and Saboteur, I decided to test the damage.

    5 Blast Charge did 19 damage upon using Detonate (I was still in the intro).

    5 Swift Shot did 19 damage upon using Detonate (on the same creature, in the same area, in the intro).


    So I am still quite puzzled!

  4. #4
    Soulwalker Tesma's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    11

    Default

    derp moment
    Last edited by Tesma; 05-25-2011 at 08:00 AM.

  5. #5
    Prophet of Telara
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    1,103

    Default

    Detonate itself won't do more damage, it'll make all the Charges you attached to the target explode for one big burst of damage.
    Sort of like doing 5 Quick Shots and a Detonate all at once.
    Does that make it more understandable?

  6. #6
    Rift Disciple
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    108

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Akisohida View Post
    Not really. When I had Marksman and Saboteur, I decided to test the damage.

    5 Blast Charge did 19 damage upon using Detonate (I was still in the intro).

    5 Swift Shot did 19 damage upon using Detonate (on the same creature, in the same area, in the intro).


    So I am still quite puzzled!
    That's Detonate doing the 19 damage. Detonate itself does damage. It also explodes all charges, so there should also be 5 "Blast Charge" hits as well when you Detonate with 5 charges on them.

  7. #7
    Soulwalker
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    3

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Nefai View Post
    That's Detonate doing the 19 damage. Detonate itself does damage. It also explodes all charges, so there should also be 5 "Blast Charge" hits as well when you Detonate with 5 charges on them.
    So I AM loosing out on the extra Blast Charge damage if I don't use blast charge at all. I am just not seeing a damage tick for it so I was assuming it was normally combined with Detonates damage, and not seperate?

  8. #8
    Telaran xIGGYx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    86

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Akisohida View Post
    So I AM loosing out on the extra Blast Charge damage if I don't use blast charge at all. I am just not seeing a damage tick for it so I was assuming it was normally combined with Detonates damage, and not seperate?
    Simple. Put 5 blast charges on a target. Up until there, you did no damage. You have now 5 combo points and 5 blast charges on your targets.
    Detonate, you will see the damage of your 5 charges, along with the damage or your detonate for 5 combo points.

    Now do 5 swift shots .You can see the damage you did with those 5 shots, and you have 5 combo points. Use detonate, and you will see the damage of your detonate for 5 combo points, but no damage from charges, since you didnt have any.


    Point is, Saboteur's "charge" mechanic is used mainly by itself. You can use buffs to enhance your damage and so on, but you need to use the charge/detonate mechanic together most of the time.

    Little trick though, when you'll be higher level, you can use Annihilation bomb instead of detonate. That will trigger all you charge's damage along with the bomb's and a stun. Then you're left with 5 combos points, that you can use with the finisher of your choice.
    Last edited by xIGGYx; 05-25-2011 at 09:14 AM.

  9. #9
    Champion
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    507

    Default

    Lets say your quick shot does 20 damage, your detonate does 40 damage at 5 combo points, your blast charges state they do 25 damage and your headshot does 50 damage at 5 combo points

    These will be over 6 seconds:

    If you use quickshot than detonate you get

    1s: Quick Shot, 20 total damage dealt 1 combo
    2s: Quick Shot, 40 total damage dealt 2 combo
    3s: Quick Shot, 60 total damage dealt 3 combo
    4s: Quick Shot, 80 total damage dealt 4 combo
    5s: Quick Shot, 100 total damage dealt 5 combo
    6s: Detonate, 140 total damage dealt 0 combo

    If you use charges than detonate you get

    1s: Blast Charge, 0 total damage dealt, 1 charge, 1 combo
    2s: Blast Charge, 0 total damage dealt, 2 charge, 2 combo
    3s: Blast Charge, 0 total damage dealt, 3 charge, 3 combo
    4s: Blast Charge, 0 total damage dealt, 4 charge, 4 combo
    5s: Blast Charge, 0 total damage dealt, 5 charge, 5 combo
    6s: Detonate, 165 total damage dealt, 0 charge, 0 combo (all 5 charges deal there damage at the same time as detonate rather then when you threw them)

    If you used charges then headshot you get

    1s: Blast Charge, 0 total damage dealt, 1 charge, 1 combo
    2s: Blast Charge, 0 total damage dealt, 2 charge, 2 combo
    3s: Blast Charge, 0 total damage dealt, 3 charge, 3 combo
    4s: Blast Charge, 0 total damage dealt, 4 charge, 4 combo
    5s: Blast Charge, 0 total damage dealt, 5 charge, 5 combo
    6s: Headshot, 50 total damage dealt, 5 charge, 0 combo

    meaning the 5 seconds of throwing your charges will have done no damage and your headshot would have done only its own damage, the charges will remain for another 54 seconds however and and detonate used in that time frame will detonate them (unless you throw more/different charges)

    When detonate is used on a target with charges attached (its the little orange counter underneath their bar rather than the white ones on their portrait) all the charges will detonate and should give a seperate number for each, so a 5 charge detonate should show 6 numbers pop up (put on move names/icons in options to differentiate)

    Now theres nothing wrong with using 5 charges, hitting headshot, throwing 1 charge/quickshot, and detonating, I used that a while to get the 5% damage from headshot in the ranger talents with my detonates, but your detonate will be weaker (though you'll get the damage from a full 5 point headshot instead)

  10. #10
    Prophet of Telara
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    1,103

    Default

    What might be happening to you is that your auto attacks are getting the mob low enough for the detonate itself to kill it, thus not showing any Blast Charge damage. I believe detonate damage happens first, then charges. Because if you do 5 charged then detonate you should see numbers all over your screen.

  11. #11
    Rift Disciple
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    108

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Digits View Post
    What might be happening to you is that your auto attacks are getting the mob low enough for the detonate itself to kill it, thus not showing any Blast Charge damage. I believe detonate damage happens first, then charges. Because if you do 5 charged then detonate you should see numbers all over your screen.
    Good point. It would be impossible to miss the Blast Charge spam.

+ Reply to Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts