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Thread: On observation from looking at the other class forums...

  1. #1
    Prophet of Telara
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    Default On observation from looking at the other class forums...

    Just wanted to point out something I have noticed while trying to help a RL buddy who plays Warrior do better in PvP. First of all, I'll point out that my BG is dominated by Rank 6 Warriors. There are only a few that are like this, but they will literally attack groups of 3-4 people, and kill at least half of them consistently. I've never seen any Warrior on my faction do anything even remotely like that. I can beat most of them 1v1, but it's 50/50 and will come down to ~500 life for the winner. But alas, this is not a 1v1 game, and when running with healers they become even more powerful and simply dominate everything in their path. One of them consistently starts every fight with ~2.5-3.5k burst(using some off-gcd abilities in the mix), which was even more than I could generally do pre-1.2.

    Anyway, look at the Warrior forums and you will see nothing but QQ about how bad they are. There are no helpful builds, no videos showing the power of said builds, and no discussion about playing the class better. Then last night, I realized that it is the same deal in-game. Some Warriors in one of the WF's asked about another(good) Warrior's build and was met with insults. Then other Warriors began trying to guess the build and were met with silence. There are at least three different builds that these guys are using to absolutely wreck everything in their path, and for the life of me I can't find any hint at how they are doing it to help my friend out.

    Now, compare that to the Rogue forums. Builds, parses, videos, and advice are given freely. The common goal seems to be to squeak every little ounce of juice out of this class. I frequently have friendly and opposing Rogues ask me about the builds that I use, and you know what? I tell them.

    This is where problems with balance come in. Rogues didn't run rampant pre-1.2, but there were certainly good Rogues. Now there are better Rogues, but I still don't witness them dominating everything in their path in this manner, and that's fine. The problem is, 99% of Warriors think they are gimped, and 1% of them have "figured it out", but don't want to share "it". If Trion were to make a balance decision based on what 99% of them think, that 1% would become the new Pyros, and eventually the build would make it's way out and we'd end up in 1.1 again, except with Warriors this time around.

    No real point to this I guess...just interesting observation, and really makes me appreciate everything Trion has to put up with "TRYING" to balance everything.

    *EDIT* Title should read "An observation...". I'm tired :P
    Last edited by Calo; 05-22-2011 at 10:06 PM.

  2. #2
    Champion of Telara Nnnxia's Avatar
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    Rogue forums are easily the best. As someone pointed out earlier, since Rogues were so weak prior to 1.2 the community banded together to find the optimal dps specs. As a result a rather major minority of elite rogues were endowed with the knowledge of building feasible high dps specs. Unlike other elites of other classes these few rogues were not hesistant in sharing their builds pubilcly and left them open for debate and improvement. Kudos to them.

    With the release of 1.2, it was simply a matter of mixing and matching prior tried and true builds to find the current dps king spec. Kinda disappointing that it only took a few days to uncover it since I personally find great joy in unravelling the puzzle to ultimate deepz, but oh wells...

    I do know of a few warriors/mages who keep their specs under lock and key, but ultimately do remember that these specs were found by them and usually with alot of work, plat and parses, therefore the advantage confered to them is by all means their right.

  3. #3
    Soulwalker thinkzalot's Avatar
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    A helpful blog for one particular style of warrior pvp is: http://taugrim.com/ He has all sorts of info there for aspiring warriors, with video guides at every level, and an in depth guide to how to pvp as a warrior. I hope this helps your friend.

    Beadle

  4. #4
    Prophet of Telara
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    Quote Originally Posted by thinkzalot View Post
    A helpful blog for one particular style of warrior pvp is: http://taugrim.com/ He has all sorts of info there for aspiring warriors, with video guides at every level, and an in depth guide to how to pvp as a warrior. I hope this helps your friend.

    Beadle
    Thanks Bud, I'll have him take a look at that. You are just another example of why the Rogue forum is superior.

  5. #5
    Rift Disciple
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    Default War pvp

    http://forums.riftgame.com/showthrea...e-spec-for-you!

    Most accurate thread from OP on the state of warrior pvp. Also I agree with his response to taugrims builds as I have followed both of their advices, augmenting and tweaking and respeccing 4+ times a day. The vk/champ/para is infinitely more satisfying and fun to play. Will never live without bloodthirst / bloodthirsty. Rank 4 and counting. Yes we depend on pocket heals against a premade, and run into problems solo, but strings of KBs are really fun.

    Sorry for the wall of text. On my phone at work

  6. #6
    Prophet of Telara
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flitch View Post
    http://forums.riftgame.com/showthrea...e-spec-for-you!

    Most accurate thread from OP on the state of warrior pvp. Also I agree with his response to taugrims builds as I have followed both of their advices, augmenting and tweaking and respeccing 4+ times a day. The vk/champ/para is infinitely more satisfying and fun to play. Will never live without bloodthirst / bloodthirsty. Rank 4 and counting. Yes we depend on pocket heals against a premade, and run into problems solo, but strings of KBs are really fun.

    Sorry for the wall of text. On my phone at work
    Hey man, thanks for the information, I'm going to read it in a bit here during my lunch break. It's really funny how when someone asks they get better Warrior information on the Rogue forums haha! I'm sure Taugrim is a good player, but after looking at his blog/videos, it just isn't measuring up to what I'm seeing on my BG to be honest. This looks promising though.

  7. #7
    RIFT Guide Writer Hokonoso's Avatar
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    tho im a rogue i at least know what these warriors are doing having grouped with them. the go the obligatory champion for the pvp stuff and healing debuff, then they go a decent amount into paragon for weapon master and some survivability talents, then the rest is in vk for the caster killer + highest off gcd move in game. they literally will kill someone in 1 gcd with having 3 trees with many off gcd abilities all at once. with a healer they are unstoppable, and if the healer is an r6 warden they can 2 v 10 objective points without too much trouble, it's pretty ridiculous!

    oddly enough, there are some r6 warrior threads with similar builds on the warrior forums, the problem is most of the abilities are situational/personal preference so there is no 1 cookie cutter build, they all are champ/vk/para however as any reaver/pally/riftblade build is simply for farming favor, once you want to start killing ppl you need to switch to a real build. tho if you are rank 1-3 you might wanna look into high survivability low kills reaver/pally/riftblade for the easier favor farming that is needed to get higher rank.

    my warrior is only 47 so i cant tell you how everything works perfectly but i can say there is a difference from dominating others and staying alive to farm favor. if you are knew and dont have a high dps weapon (38+) you will have a hard time as a warrior. fortunlatey you can buy a fleshripper (32.5dps) and still be halfway decent in pvp once your skill lvl goes up.
    Useful Rogue guides since I don't want to answer 50 billion questions anymore:
    Marksman, Ranger, Nightblade, Blink'Blade, Asstalker, Assdancer, and finally The Hoko Spec™
    Hoko, teaching noobs the way of rogue pve until 12/20/11.

  8. #8
    Prophet of Telara
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    Yeah, what I'm gathering is that it is maxing off-gcd abilities, good gear, and blood thirsty to stay alive while dominating people within the duration of 2 GCD's or so, rinse/repeat. Throw a healer in and it becomes ridiculous. I'd love it if there were Guardian Warriors on my shard we could simply have asked in game, but quite honestly we don't seem to have any decent ones, while Defiants have probably 3-5 of them. It's a small BG, so you really do see the same names over, and over, and over, and over again. It's pretty much at a point where I can glance at the scoreboard and guess with 80% accuracy who will win because I am familiar with the skill level of most people out there at any given time.

    Will pass this information on to buddy and see if his game improves. Maybe he can be our first decent Warrior.

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