+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 7 1 2 3 4 5 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 92

Thread: How does something like this even happen

  1. #1
    Aus
    Aus is offline
    Banned
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    272

    Default How does something like this even happen

    A design which pigeon holes every rogue tree into needing Assassin or Night-blade to be competitive for pvp is Horrific. Let me be clear, Im talking about damage dealing roles. If you are a bard or something Im sure you can manage without one of these two souls and get your job done.

    Why should ranged souls, MM RNGR SAB, have to invest points into melee souls to make up for missing damage? Does anyone remember the videos about the class system? I bring it up because I know for me it was the main thing that drew me to the game. What was advertised and what has been implemented to date is so far apart Id ask for a refund if I could.

    Im not going to speak on the melee souls because I don't play them, I imagine the design cant be much better though

    does anyone know where all the missing damage is? did they give it to mages or something?

    Do I want to BE OP? no, but I will say this

    IF I SHOOT SOMEONE IN THE FACE WITH A GUN/BOW/BOMB....A FEAKIN EXPLOSIVE....HELLOOOOOO..... HE SHOULD TAKE ALOT OF DAMAGE

    how are these abilities under performing?

    hasted shot rank 6 gear 500-700 dmg average
    swift shot rank 6 gear 173-260 dmg average
    crossfire rank 6 gear 100-205 dmg average
    Fragmentation Bomb rank6 gear Bomb LOL
    Annihilation Bomb rank 6 gear 304-550 dmg average

    Build it how you like these abilities will not yield much better numbers if you are not heavy into some NB/SIN.... At the very least it's not at all what was projected before launch. I was heavily under the impression that I would have more options than two slightly similar melee souls.

    How does a bomb or a steel tipped missile, fired from a cannon or bow not do serious damage? How in the world do you gutt out the numbers on these trees without taking a look at the computer screen and thinking to yourself "well... .that just doesn't look right. It's what I say every time I see a warrior or mage or even cleric get shot in the face 30 times then waltz over to a rogue and beat the subscription out of him at the expense of very few resources
    Last edited by Aus; 04-26-2011 at 06:59 AM.

  2. #2
    Rift Disciple
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    174

    Default

    You have to take time frame into consideration. Take a mage for example, they have a cast time for their big hitting spells. Say it takes 6 seconds for them to land one.

    In the same 6-7 seconds you can:

    swift shot rank 6 gear 173-260 dmg average
    swift shot rank 6 gear 173-260 dmg average
    swift shot rank 6 gear 173-260 dmg average
    swift shot rank 6 gear 173-260 dmg average
    swift shot rank 6 gear 173-260 dmg average
    hasted shot rank 6 gear 500-700 dmg average
    Total 1365-2000 (based on your made up numbers)

    Add in pet damage for range/ dots/bleeds


    You dont HAVE to grab NB or AS.. that is a personal choice. Yeah, they will increase your damage output with the passives you gain, but again, your choice.
    Every so often words are spoken that alter the course of our lives....

    Well..my money dont lag, my money dont are nerfed, my money dont are bug, now Trion equlibrate souls or give me my money back!

    - Greegan

  3. #3
    Rift Master
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    614

    Default

    My Ranger/Saboteur/Bard(only used for cadence) does fine in PvP.

    With the Ranger ability to gain 1 CP after a finisher I do..
    Spike Charge x5 -> Head Shot -> Detonate -> Blast Charge x5 -> Head Shot -> Detonate -> Repeat

    If I am looking for some health I do
    Cadence -> Power Cord -> Head Shot

    Granted I get your point, most builds use either SIN or NB but it's not "needed".

  4. #4
    Champion
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    507

    Default

    another reason melee tends to hit harder is due to risk vs reward.

    sitting at the back of a group hurling projectiles is relatively safe compared to charging into the ball of nasty spiked objects that is the enemy.

  5. #5
    Koe
    Koe is offline
    Ascendant Koe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    3,198

    Default

    Because passives are what boost damage through the roof? You don't have to melee when you take a melee soul. At all. It's the passives.

    AuS, just go away.

    Edit: My Swift Shot hits 217-270 noncrit. Crits of 468. Hasted Shot is 700+ noncrit, 1358 crit.


    Idk what you're doing, but you're doing it wrong. Marksman is already a strong PvP soul. Can't wait for more burst with Rapid-Fire Shot change.
    Last edited by Koe; 04-26-2011 at 07:24 AM.

  6. #6
    Isz
    Isz is offline
    Champion of Telara
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    1,300

    Default

    I think the extra range that the MM has is greatly underestimated in usefulness as far as PvP goes. I think the Sin and NB are the single target DPS souls for the rogue, so to me it makes sense that the passives to increase damage are found there.

    I think its pretty cool that you can take the bladedancer soul for instance and:

    Mix with assassin for DPS build
    Mix with Riftstalker for tank and questing builds
    Mix with bard for a split damage/healing build

    And so on. So of course some of them are going to me more geared towards single target dps and some aren't.

    As far as "IF I SHOOT SOMEONE IN THE FACE WITH A GUN/BOW/BOMB....A FEAKIN EXPLOSIVE....HELLOOOOOO..... HE SHOULD TAKE ALOT OF DAMAGE"

    The same could be said about getting hit with a giant 2 handed axe, or struck by lightning, or gored by a giant pig like thing. The realism of violence really has no place here.

  7. #7
    Shield of Telara
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    763

    Default

    NB and Assassin bonuses are very low in the tree. As a result to get major benefits from them you don't have to take very much of them. It is very obvious if you use a Marksman build like mine. I don't use a single melee strike with my current build.


    Yes, i could probably get more damage if I took ranger over Marksman but I hate managing pets. They die and your damage plummets.
    Tsarin - Sunrest (PVP-RP) - Eth DPS Cleric (50) - Static

  8. #8
    Telaran
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    78

    Default

    The REAL problem is that you're playing MM, and you're using hasted shot.

    Hasted shot is for the movement stat, and that's it, it's not a real DD skill.

    If you want to kill something, use Deadeye or Rapid fire. As usual, if you don't have anything in NB or SIN, you're screwed. Frankly, sub 20 point stats are way more useful.

    I deal more damage than this in my crappy lvl50 blue gear, even on a MM build (but not by much). Deadeye and Rapid fire both can crit for 1500+ (and often on mm/sin), and usually for 900-1000 regular. I don't see how you're doing so little damage at lvl6 gears unless you just can't build a soul tree to save your life.

    Using NB with RS for +15%AP, or Sab for +15%DEX gets you some serious damage stacks. If anyone's counting.. the +15% DEX is way more potent on crit than the sill SIN +5%. If you start out even at 300 Dex, you just added 45 Crit, 22.5AP, and 45 Dodge.

    I use primarily NB/ranger/Sab (as seen on TV!), with NB only up to 26 for scourge of darkness. As long as you can stay in a group and be ignored for a few seconds... you can build points, pop SOD, and then start eating a tank alive (bleed 100% procs FTW). Even if you don't kill him... you distracted the healer so much the line starts to collapse. Then it's up to your group. Even with the pet dead/unused this beats an MM by a long ways.

    BUT... defiants don't do premades so... whatever, still screwed. Point is your super-low damage is due in part to a sub-par build and use of skills, not because of how limited we currently are (and we ARE limited).

  9. #9
    Prophet of Telara Celestian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    DFW, Texas
    Posts
    1,037

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Sauceage View Post
    You have to take time frame into consideration. Take a mage for example, they have a cast time for their big hitting spells. Say it takes 6 seconds for them to land one.

    In the same 6-7 seconds you can:

    swift shot rank 6 gear 173-260 dmg average
    swift shot rank 6 gear 173-260 dmg average
    swift shot rank 6 gear 173-260 dmg average
    swift shot rank 6 gear 173-260 dmg average
    swift shot rank 6 gear 173-260 dmg average
    hasted shot rank 6 gear 500-700 dmg average
    Total 1365-2000 (based on your made up numbers)
    Not sure what you're going for here but I hate to burst your bubble, a pyro can lob one fireball and do the damage of all of that. During the same time he could do at least 3 fireballs, or multiple other options all of which will far out dps and out burst a marks.

    Not sure what you were going for here.
    Celestian, 50: Assassin(51), Faeblight/Guardian
    http://www.greycouncil.US/

  10. #10
    Ascendant
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    1,842

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Sauceage View Post
    You have to take time frame into consideration. Take a mage for example, they have a cast time for their big hitting spells. Say it takes 6 seconds for them to land one.

    In the same 6-7 seconds you can:

    swift shot rank 6 gear 173-260 dmg average
    swift shot rank 6 gear 173-260 dmg average
    swift shot rank 6 gear 173-260 dmg average
    swift shot rank 6 gear 173-260 dmg average
    swift shot rank 6 gear 173-260 dmg average
    hasted shot rank 6 gear 500-700 dmg average
    Total 1365-2000 (based on your made up numbers)

    Add in pet damage for range/ dots/bleeds


    You dont HAVE to grab NB or AS.. that is a personal choice. Yeah, they will increase your damage output with the passives you gain, but again, your choice.
    In 3 seconds a pyro will have done more damage. Your point?

  11. #11
    Rift Disciple
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    104

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DTM300 View Post
    In 3 seconds a pyro will have done more damage. Your point?
    (and said pyro will if not instakilled you, have stunned you the entire time so you cannot fire that back)...

  12. #12
    Plane Touched
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    237

    Default

    I do wish there was more synergy b/w MM, RA, and SAB (the ranged DPS souls). SAB in particular doesn't mesh well with any other soul as a sub.

    The same goes for BD which is good for a defensive sub spec for RS but not for offense.

  13. #13
    Telaran
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    78

    Default

    Also.. I made a NB/ranger/sin build without the pet stats that gets only 25DPS short of a pet-heavy build. Again, NB up to Scourge, then up to trick shot in Ranger (get the bleeds), and all the crit stats from Sin. I've spiked up to ~550-600DPS on my lowly self, I'd love to see what a lvl6 could do with it.

    However, it does cost a few Plat for all the Ranger skills you probably don't have.

    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=1M...b0cz0z.0VMcx0b

    Rotation is quick shot x3, firey spike (when in range), SOD; repeat+headshot, (combo point with HS&Opportunity); 2xQs, 2xFS, Headshot till SOD comes back up. Replace Headshot with Concussive blast for healers and mages or a crowd, and replace Qs+Fs for Trick Shot in a crowd, of course, and use your CC's as necessary (such as we have of them). Watch for the melee rogues... they have a thing for killing us ranged ppl

  14. #14
    Telaran
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Northeast Ohio
    Posts
    88

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Phros View Post
    The REAL problem is that you're playing MM, and you're using hasted shot.

    Hasted shot is for the movement stat, and that's it, it's not a real DD skill.

    If you want to kill something, use Deadeye or Rapid fire. As usual, if you don't have anything in NB or SIN, you're screwed. Frankly, sub 20 point stats are way more useful.

    I deal more damage than this in my crappy lvl50 blue gear, even on a MM build (but not by much). Deadeye and Rapid fire both can crit for 1500+ (and often on mm/sin), and usually for 900-1000 regular. I don't see how you're doing so little damage at lvl6 gears unless you just can't build a soul tree to save your life.

    Using NB with RS for +15%AP, or Sab for +15%DEX gets you some serious damage stacks. If anyone's counting.. the +15% DEX is way more potent on crit than the sill SIN +5%. If you start out even at 300 Dex, you just added 45 Crit, 22.5AP, and 45 Dodge.

    I use primarily NB/ranger/Sab (as seen on TV!), with NB only up to 26 for scourge of darkness. As long as you can stay in a group and be ignored for a few seconds... you can build points, pop SOD, and then start eating a tank alive (bleed 100% procs FTW). Even if you don't kill him... you distracted the healer so much the line starts to collapse. Then it's up to your group. Even with the pet dead/unused this beats an MM by a long ways.

    BUT... defiants don't do premades so... whatever, still screwed. Point is your super-low damage is due in part to a sub-par build and use of skills, not because of how limited we currently are (and we ARE limited).
    Hasted Shot is actually on the higher end of MM finishers if not the highest.

  15. #15
    Rift Disciple kashaun's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    190

    Default

    I don't think he was asking for a guide on sin/nb/anything ells. His point, which is what I've run into trying to come up with other builds, specifically with BD and Inf, is that you pretty much have to bring in that sin or NB sub build. Not only for dps, but for reach if your main soul doesn't have it or a charge or planeshift. You can call it a choice, but it's not really a choice if you want to compete, which anyone who joins warfronts is interested in.
    "Never give up and never surrender!"

    So, it's just you 57 cops against KUNG FU JOE? Master of KUNG-FU, KARATE, JIU-JITSU, and all kinds of other shiz you ain't never heard of! HAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAA!

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 7 1 2 3 4 5 ... LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts