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Thread: Reasonable Suggestions to Improve Backstab for Assassination

  1. #1
    Soulwalker Jinjiro's Avatar
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    Default Reasonable Suggestions to Improve Backstab for Assassination

    I've always favored backstab based specs, the incentive that you have to be crafty in order to do your damage was always appealing to me. That being said, I feel that backstab currently functions more fluidly than it did in any given point of WoW. Even if it doesn't kill cloth classes in two hits as it would've from a Vanilla WoW standpoint and even sometimes now in Cataclysm. That being said, it does feel like it's lacking a little something when compared to other abilities. There are some very simple changes that could be made to it in order to further reward the extra effort placed into it from the extra talent and backwards requirement. Here are multiple examples that could be used in case the developers like having their work cut out for them. Please note that I'm only making a list of changes that could be made to improve backstab, I'm not suggesting that all of these changes should be applied together.

    Direct Changes to Backstab:

    - Increase the base damage of the attack by 50~100%.
    - Increase the gain from attack power from 50% to 100%.
    - Cause Backstab to ignore 50~100% of the enemy's armor.

    Utility Changes:

    - Backstab slows the enemy's movement speed by 50%.
    - Backstab causes the enemy to take 20% more damage from bleeds for 10 seconds after landing.

    Related Talent Changes:

    Advanced Flanking (2/2): (Currently increases the Critical Hit chance of Backstab by 6%. Increases the Critical Hit chance of Assassinate, Jagged Strike and Paralyzing Strike by 50%.)

    - Increase the Critical Hit chance of Backstab to 10/20% or 15/30%.

    Subterfuge (2/2): (Currently increases the damage of your Assassinate, Paralyzing Strike and Jagged Strike by 20%. They also have a 100% of gaining an additional Combo Point on the enemy.)

    - Include Backstab into the functions of this talent.

    Honestly, you can take your pick of any one of these changes and it would make a vast improvement from where it stands now. My personal opinion on the fix would simply be to include Backstab into Subterfuge. That alone would be the most realistic improvement to give Backstab the extra edge to reward using an ability that has backwards requirements.

    You can thank me later. If anyone else can come up with suggestions that they want to add to this list, feel free to post them. If you have a reasonable change to suggest, I will include you and your suggestion into the list.
    Last edited by Jinjiro; 04-07-2011 at 06:36 AM.

  2. #2
    Soulwalker
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    Give Backstab (via Improved Flanking) the same +Critical bonus given to Savage Strike in the 51 assassin build (15% from t1 Improved Savage Strike) as an 8%/15% or 8%/16% talent and boom- the already superior ability (at least as 51 assassin) is even more superiorer.

    I dislike the idea of the utility changes and feel that those would be better implemented through other abilities and/or weapon enchantments.

    Possibly, improve Double Cross to "Increase backstab damage done from behind the target by 3/6/9% when behind the target" as well, but that might be overkill.

    On the whole, I'd rather that they work on coming up with more fun and less clicky ways to manage Expose Weakness (especially with the somewhat suboptimal buff/debuff UI), but that might just be me.

  3. #3
    Rift Disciple sazdek's Avatar
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    i agree with it ignoring armor as well as increasing bleed damage. both would make it optimal for pvp sins and pve as well. it really is just silly since, as it is, savage strike does pretty much the same damage with it's two talent modifiers. perhaps they could drop the poison talents WHICH NO SIN IN THEIR RIGHT MIND USES EVER (unless they're 51 pt sins), nerf sabs in the process, and add decent talents in their place. or hell at least let them scale with enduring brew.
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  4. #4
    Soulwalker Jinjiro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kytrarewn View Post
    I dislike the idea of the utility changes and feel that those would be better implemented through other abilities and/or weapon enchantments.
    I don't like the idea of additional utility to the ability either, it was a just a suggestion that would help Backstab improve if no other changes were taken.

    Possibly, improve Double Cross to "Increase backstab damage done from behind the target by 3/6/9% when behind the target" as well, but that might be overkill.
    I actually considered the idea of adding Backstab to the Double Cross talent, but figured that adding it to Subterfuge would be more than enough to fix everything wrong with it. If they did add it into Subterfuge, adding Backstab to Double Cross would be simply too much and unbalance it.

    On the whole, I'd rather that they work on coming up with more fun and less clicky ways to manage Expose Weakness (especially with the somewhat suboptimal buff/debuff UI), but that might just be me.
    The reason it feels clicky and awkward is because it's technically a clone of Subtlety's Hemorrhage ability. The only problem is that without the generation of a combo point and damage slapped onto the ability it becomes a chore to keep it up on a target.

    The best changes would be to make it a 30 second debuff that doesn't consume charges, or, considering the topic at hand, make Backstab refresh the duration and charges of the ability.

  5. #5
    Rift Chaser Khroul's Avatar
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    I think they should just take it out of the game.


    A.)Backstab is situational, and in most cases not possible because of PvE mechanics, and or enemy players strafing.

    B.)The only way to make it worth using, is for it's damage to be very high, which they'll never allow because rogues aren't allowed to have burst damage.


    Here is why they will never remove it, or make it worth a ****.
    C.)Trion hates rogues, and enjoys taunting them with talent that look good on paper, but suck in application.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tadzio View Post
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  6. #6
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    I have only rarely run into instance PvE situations where I was unable to use Backstab if I was able to use melee at all. Usually, bosses have a cleave or some such that prevents standing OTHER than behind the mob (As well as dragon tailwhips, but you can still get into backstab angle with those).

    The predominance of SCREWMELEE fights in Rift are a bigger concern than Backstab's positional requirements.

    AP scaling is terrible, which means that abilities that have additional AP scaling are 50% more terrible compared to those with higher base damage and/or crit.

    Fix the scaling, fix the SCREWMELEE encounters, and you (to large degree) fix Backstab as well.

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