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Thread: Stealth:What exactly was the problem?

  1. #1
    Plane Touched
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    Default Stealth:What exactly was the problem?

    Someone with a very certain kind of attitude posted this:
    To be short:

    Stealth was always and has always been meant to be seen through by mobs and players when you are near them, or directly in-view. It was a bug that caused this to be ignored, it was fixed. It's been this way since beta and headstart, it was only recently "broken". People just now have an issue because they never learned how to properly play.


    It's stealth, not invisibility. Deal.
    Trolls, can you answer one little question?

    Now, I'm not interested in what was "intended" by some person at some time, maybe. I'm more interested in facts. What I would like is some facts on what Stealth was "breaking". On the exact nature of the problem with stealth, or full invisibility for that matter. And yes, I am aware that full invisibility, much like shooting fireballs out of your hands, isn't possible in the real world.

    The way a poster "wants it" is not the question. The question is the problem with Stealth. What it broke. Why such an extreme fix was required.

    Again, please try to avoid referring to how stealth being broken makes you feel happy. I don't care.

    I am interested in the game-balance, class-balance, or some objective reason not based on feelings as to why functional Stealth, or for that matter even Stealth so powerful it was effectively invisibility, was a problem.

    Again, "cause that's whats I wants" is not a valid answer.
    Last edited by Themistocles; 03-30-2011 at 11:26 PM.

  2. #2
    Soulwalker Lachesis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Themistocles View Post
    .....



    Why such an extreme fix was required.

    ....
    Lets not say its a fix cause its not mentioned in the patch notes.
    Until stated otherwise this is a bug.

  3. #3
    Rift Chaser Vokan's Avatar
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    There was an issue that rogues, specifically Assassins could stealth through dungeons and harvest the minerals there without dying. They could have just moved the minerals behind the first boss wall, but they didnt. Using different mechanics this technique is still obtainable.

    Secondly, there was an issue that if you got agro from a mob then stealthed before it hit you, you could retain the agro and walk around the dungeon. Because that one mob was agro to you, other mobs would become agro also. So they would all follow you around, but never take you out of stealth. I believe you could do the same thing by bieng in stealth and having a pet on passive. Not sure. But this was something that needed to be fixed because basically an assassin could go around and take every trash mob out of an area and then have the rest of the raid just kill the boss.

    I think the biggest problem now is that mobs will see you always if you are in their field of view, and sometime see you if you are behind them. Kinda makes being an assassin pointless if you cant open up with a stealth move. Assassins are already just a 1 mob wonder, if you can get a sap on another mob and then take the second down. It take a little bit more planning and waiting for pathing now to take down a single mob as to where other classes are complaining about not being able to take down 7 or 8 mobs at a time and can only take down 4 or 5 now.

    So yes, the FIXED stealth, but I think it was fine before, they just needed to correct the first two issues I states above by moving them, not be changing the class.
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  4. #4
    Plane Touched
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vokan View Post
    There was an issue that rogues, specifically Assassins could stealth through dungeons and harvest the minerals there without dying. They could have just moved the minerals behind the first boss wall, but they didnt. Using different mechanics this technique is still obtainable.

    Secondly, there was an issue that if you got agro from a mob then stealthed before it hit you, you could retain the agro and walk around the dungeon. Because that one mob was agro to you, other mobs would become agro also. So they would all follow you around, but never take you out of stealth. I believe you could do the same thing by bieng in stealth and having a pet on passive. Not sure. But this was something that needed to be fixed because basically an assassin could go around and take every trash mob out of an area and then have the rest of the raid just kill the boss.

    I think the biggest problem now is that mobs will see you always if you are in their field of view, and sometime see you if you are behind them. Kinda makes being an assassin pointless if you cant open up with a stealth move. Assassins are already just a 1 mob wonder, if you can get a sap on another mob and then take the second down. It take a little bit more planning and waiting for pathing now to take down a single mob as to where other classes are complaining about not being able to take down 7 or 8 mobs at a time and can only take down 4 or 5 now.

    So yes, the FIXED stealth, but I think it was fine before, they just needed to correct the first two issues I states above by moving them, not be changing the class.
    The second issue with being able to pull huge numbers of trash mobs is indeed a serious exploit that needed to be fixed. However, simply adding a "de-aggro" power to Conceal, so that Conceal sets aggro to zero five seconds after being activated would have fixed that. There are already abilities that lower aggro when used, like the Inquisitors Divine Pardon, so the code for this is already there. Having it fire off five seconds after going into stealth should "clear" that. For that matter, I believe that Elusiveness DOES de-aggro, so however it does that could also be copied.

    Again, the problem wasn't with stealth as stealth, it was stealth with a magic golden monster-controlling lasso tacked on. I think everyone agrees that the lasso had to go. But stealth wasn't the problem.

    Really, is easy resource collection it? That's it?

    Put all the dungeon nodes behind the first boss then. DONE.

    Now you would get griping on that, but really, it's fair. (Ignoring the fact that resource nodes are absurdly rare)

    So again, we are left with what exactly the problem is?
    Last edited by Themistocles; 03-30-2011 at 11:55 PM.

  5. #5
    Shadowlander
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    Devs are aware of this issue and are looking into it.

    Says the Dev Tracker

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