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Thread: Sab/Sin/BD new top pve DPS-build

  1. #1
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    Default Sab/Sin/BD new top pve DPS-build

    I used to run the what could now be called the normal melee-saboteur spec with Sab/Sin/NB and parsed it at 730 dps on a dummy. Then I wanted to test some stuff out, namely how the different +dex abilities from sab and BD stack (additive, not multiplied) and ended up with this build: http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0M...VV0V0s.0VMcxcb

    I parsed it on the boss dummy with only buffs on me being Lethal Poison and Virulent Poison and got 790 DPS as a result. I parsed it for 7 minutes and it was stable. Dummy was not debuffed either by anyone. I repeated the test for 4 minutes a bit later with the same result. I did not use Blade Tempo cooldown ability or the dex buff since I wanted comparable results to the typical melee build and he dex buff gets overridden in party/raid. The rotations I used were 3*spike+blast+shrapnel+detonate, shrapnel+blast+splinter+embers+caltrop+detonate. I've used it for a couple of dungeons and noticed a performance upgrade there also. The DPS increase from BD comes mostly from Combat Efficiency since it helps a lot with our energy and energy is the limiting factor in our damage.

    Horrible for pvp but this is the highest dps pve build I have come across so far for rogue.

    There might also some improvement possibilities by taking Deadly Dance and weaving in Deadly Strike into the rotation but my first tests on that gave worse results although the ability does work on charges.

  2. #2
    Rift Disciple Marre's Avatar
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    really nice spec, running it now and it does around 800-900 in a t1 dungeon, hit capped ofc.

  3. #3
    General of Telara Tugrath's Avatar
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    I'm going to need 5,000 parses each from the training dummy from this and every single other possible combination of rogue specs before I will give it my blessing as the new top pve DPS-build.
    Don't mind me, I'm just being an idiot.

    What you did there, I see it.

  4. #4
    Telaran
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    My problem with this lies in that is requires melee. Most single-target dps for PvE is for boss fights, and there are VERY few boss fights that allow you to stand still melee'ing, keep constant damage + auto attacks. A dummy will allow this, but in practice, it won't happen. With the ranger/sab build, you can stay at ranged, and attack on the run 100% of the time and maintain 100% of your dps. Theorycrafting only goes so far, until you actually do a fight that requires any movement or avoiding of poop clouds, and your dps will drop substantially.

  5. #5
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    Going ranger is the opposite of fixing the problem of not being able to melee. Your pet will die and then you will lack its dps and the secondary benefits like prey on the weak. Meanwhile my spec can still pump out 640 dps even from range while running constantly and that is again unbuffed with the same test conditions. Autoattacks, weapon enchants and serrated blades only increase the damage, they are not required. Even Cruel Vengeance from assassin tree procs from charges and detonations and with the double dex from BD/Sab and the +critchance from sin I crit so often that it will actually be on most of the time even without being in melee.

  6. #6
    Shadowlander
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gery View Post
    Going ranger is the opposite of fixing the problem of not being able to melee. Your pet will die and then you will lack its dps and the secondary benefits like prey on the weak. Meanwhile my spec can still pump out 640 dps even from range while running constantly and that is again unbuffed with the same test conditions. Autoattacks, weapon enchants and serrated blades only increase the damage, they are not required. Even Cruel Vengeance from assassin tree procs from charges and detonations and with the double dex from BD/Sab and the +critchance from sin I crit so often that it will actually be on most of the time even without being in melee.
    While the Ranger/Sab build holds good numbers, as soon as the pet dies, or isn't able to stay on the boss you lose 200-300 dps due to lacking buffs and the pets dps, so not really viable in my eyes for any sort of content, 650~ dps is similar to what the sab/sin/nb can put out at ranged, so if you can prove your variant does more dps in melee with parses (simply run act over multiple 10-20 minute parses on the dummy and upload a screenshot of each seperately), looking forward to seeing some results.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gery View Post
    I used to run the what could now be called the normal melee-saboteur spec with Sab/Sin/NB and parsed it at 730 dps on a dummy. Then I wanted to test some stuff out, namely how the different +dex abilities from sab and BD stack (additive, not multiplied) and ended up with this build: http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0M...VV0V0s.0VMcxcb

    I parsed it on the boss dummy with only buffs on me being Lethal Poison and Virulent Poison and got 790 DPS as a result. I parsed it for 7 minutes and it was stable. Dummy was not debuffed either by anyone. I repeated the test for 4 minutes a bit later with the same result. I did not use Blade Tempo cooldown ability or the dex buff since I wanted comparable results to the typical melee build and he dex buff gets overridden in party/raid. The rotations I used were 3*spike+blast+shrapnel+detonate, shrapnel+blast+splinter+embers+caltrop+detonate. I've used it for a couple of dungeons and noticed a performance upgrade there also. The DPS increase from BD comes mostly from Combat Efficiency since it helps a lot with our energy and energy is the limiting factor in our damage.

    Horrible for pvp but this is the highest dps pve build I have come across so far for rogue.

    There might also some improvement possibilities by taking Deadly Dance and weaving in Deadly Strike into the rotation but my first tests on that gave worse results although the ability does work on charges.
    Been meaning to try this and the sin heavy version out -- thanks for posting your findings. I'll hit you with some parses comparing the 2 after tonight.

  8. #8
    Rift Disciple Upright's Avatar
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    You guys losing your pet to bosses in T2 are just really bad players. It does happen sometimes but then you pop HC and viola pet. If you need to reposition your pet that can also be done easily.

    Most fights I don't even need to use Rejuv because residual heals from the cleric/bard/chloro do the job nicely.

  9. #9
    Soulwalker
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gery View Post
    I used to run the what could now be called the normal melee-saboteur spec with Sab/Sin/NB and parsed it at 730 dps on a dummy. Then I wanted to test some stuff out, namely how the different +dex abilities from sab and BD stack (additive, not multiplied) and ended up with this build: http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0M...VV0V0s.0VMcxcb

    I parsed it on the boss dummy with only buffs on me being Lethal Poison and Virulent Poison and got 790 DPS as a result. I parsed it for 7 minutes and it was stable. Dummy was not debuffed either by anyone. I repeated the test for 4 minutes a bit later with the same result. I did not use Blade Tempo cooldown ability or the dex buff since I wanted comparable results to the typical melee build and he dex buff gets overridden in party/raid. The rotations I used were 3*spike+blast+shrapnel+detonate, shrapnel+blast+splinter+embers+caltrop+detonate. I've used it for a couple of dungeons and noticed a performance upgrade there also. The DPS increase from BD comes mostly from Combat Efficiency since it helps a lot with our energy and energy is the limiting factor in our damage.

    Horrible for pvp but this is the highest dps pve build I have come across so far for rogue.

    There might also some improvement possibilities by taking Deadly Dance and weaving in Deadly Strike into the rotation but my first tests on that gave worse results although the ability does work on charges.
    This sounds really great. Just one question, what stats do you go for w/this type of build? And what weapons do u look for? I am interested in this type of build but I've never done melee before so I don't know if it would be the same as my ranger or would focus more of a diff stat.

  10. #10
    Telaran RezaKhan's Avatar
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    I have a feeling that when you parsed this you were getting AE damage from shrapnel on one of the other dummies.

    From my quick tests it does not pull more dps than the other build.

  11. #11
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    While nothing really conclusive, as it's only over a semi short parse.

    http://img810.imageshack.us/i/sabsinbdtest.jpg/
    7~ minute fight, used Blade tempo on the first set of charges, used it off cooldown 3 times in total and ended combat when it was ready again.
    was holding 780dps until it dropped off at the end due to combat fading late.
    stats are:
    Phys Crit: 776
    AP: 443
    Hit: 149 (29.42%)
    running virulent / lethal poisons and combat pose buffs.

    At the very least, it seems slightly better than the sab/sin/nb spec, but more testing is still needed.
    Last edited by Restraint; 03-21-2011 at 03:48 PM.

  12. #12
    Plane Walker Anesthetics's Avatar
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    This is an interesting tank and spank spec. However, it will not work efficiently when most bosses in GS are mele unfriendly.
    Deliciousness of Addiction
    Rift Beta 5 PVP compilation by Anesthetics

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anesthetics View Post
    This is an interesting tank and spank spec. However, it will not work efficiently when most bosses in GS are mele unfriendly.
    You have 4 souls, discounting a potential top dps spec because it's melee unfriendly is ridiculous, have you done parses to see if this spec doesn't keep up with the nb variant at range?
    At the very worst, you make another soul for a more ranged based encounter.

  14. #14
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    The stats and gear I had for this:
    530 attack power
    716 phys crit

    I wear mostly tier 2 gear with a couple tier 1 pieces mixed in. Wielding Blackheart Blade (29.2dps), Blade of the Architect (29.2dps) and Corpse Maker bow (32.5dps).

    And no I was not hitting anything other than the boss dummy in sanctum on this test. If you do worse with this build then it might be that this is more gear intensive and needs good dexterity for it to scale. It is a very crit oriented build too and if your gear does not provide enough crit then it may not work for you.

  15. #15
    Soulwalker Sadal's Avatar
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    People posting logs from the Training dummies when it includes AoE dmg from Shrapnel charge is lulz.
    Do you know how to play your class, or do you just hit buttons randomly and hope for the best?

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