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Thread: This is why we need DPS meters in game regarding mages

  1. #1
    Prophet of Telara Shhhh's Avatar
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    Default This is why we need DPS meters in game regarding mages

    I was running foul cascade as necro at level 31 and doing 206 dps sustained on single target fights (not aoe as aoe goes way up). After I left the party a guildmate ran it again later (hes a healer) and the party he was in had 2 mages in it specifically brought in to DPS that were level 34 (3 levels higher) and after wiping on bosses that seemed to take forever to kill he used the same dps meter and parsed them at averaging 44 dps per fight.

    After he explained this to them they made some changes in their rotation and were able to get it up to nearly 100 dps per fight. It was still pathetic but more than twice their original dps, and it was enough to actually kill the bosses.

    Had he not been able to parse that DPS the mages three levels higher who thought they were doing great dps wouldn't have learned to switch rotations to get higher dps to kill the boss.

    food for thought.

  2. #2
    Ascendant Rottweiler-STi's Avatar
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    i agree, but the bads who don't want it to be known they are doing 44dps will whine against damage meters forever

  3. #3
    Telaran
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    If you are concerned about dmg output you can use meters yourself. It can be a diagnostic tool but when it becomes the main focus of having a spot in a grp expecially when there is CC to be done or extra healing, it can be a bane to people who are trying to play properly.

    In other words those who understand the use properly will find it useful those who only care to see their high numbers without regard to how usefull you are to the grp would just continue to think they are awesome while they are terribad.
    Last edited by Rikam; 02-13-2011 at 02:20 PM.

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    Plane Walker Fayde's Avatar
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    The is no need for this kind of Mod at all.

    People will learn in time how to set up there skill chains to do the most damage they if they can not learn that then giving them a mod that tells them there DPS is not going to be much help to them.

    Mod are just there for the lazy who do not want or care to spend the time to learn to there class/souls and so what some thing or some one to tell them what to do so they can play with the IQ of a bot.

    That been said some UI mods to make healing abit easyer are welcome if you played a cleric in warhammer the stock UI was quite poor when trying to heal in a warband(raid party) and so you needed a mod to remove the cluter so you could target people.
    Death is great people are dying to get there.

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  5. #5
    Telaran Roarnak's Avatar
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    Seriously, take the meter/addon forum somewhere else. Do we really need to start a new thread about it?

  6. #6
    Rift Master bubulu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fayde View Post
    The is no need for this kind of Mod at all.

    People will learn in time how to set up there skill chains to do the most damage they if they can not learn that then giving them a mod that tells them there DPS is not going to be much help to them.

    Mod are just there for the lazy who do not want or care to spend the time to learn to there class/souls and so what some thing or some one to tell them what to do so they can play with the IQ of a bot.

    That been said some UI mods to make healing abit easyer are welcome if you played a cleric in warhammer the stock UI was quite poor when trying to heal in a warband(raid party) and so you needed a mod to remove the cluter so you could target people.
    Your post is so contradictory. I bet you didn't even convince yourself what you wrote. I certainly wouldn't be able to tell what other mages are casting and most players always think they are the best, so I doubt they will learn how to play if there is no monitor of their performance.

    FYI, parser or mod mod does more than just telling you the DPS number. I was hardcore raider in EQ2. ACT, EQ2 parser, tells you the hit number, crit percentage, hit percentage, spell rotation, highest to lowest spell damage overall, etc. lots of information for you to compare. If your spell hit number is low, it means you are slacking. If a higher dps mage has different spell doing most damage, then I should adjust and cast that spell more, etc.

  7. #7
    Soulwalker
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    You can't stop the internet. If the game can be modded, it will.

  8. #8
    Rift Master
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    you for sure kept in mind that you dont get the combat log from a other person if you are not close enough. Even me and a friend - grouped - killing the same stuff - get different numbers for our dps.
    Atm i only trust parsers if iam parsing my own damage.

  9. #9
    Plane Walker Fayde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bubulu View Post
    Your post is so contradictory. I bet you didn't even convince yourself what you wrote. I certainly wouldn't be able to tell what other mages are casting and most players always think they are the best, so I doubt they will learn how to play if there is no monitor of their performance.

    FYI, parser or mod mod does more than just telling you the DPS number. I was hardcore raider in EQ2. ACT, EQ2 parser, tells you the hit number, crit percentage, hit percentage, spell rotation, highest to lowest spell damage overall, etc. lots of information for you to compare. If your spell hit number is low, it means you are slacking. If a higher dps mage has different spell doing most damage, then I should adjust and cast that spell more, etc.
    They are for the lazy you want every thing given to you and thats what the mods do why bother to learn when you can get a nice mod to tell you every thing and save all the bother of learning how to play your class.
    Death is great people are dying to get there.

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  10. #10
    Telaran Daratan's Avatar
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    I love the fact that some people claim the only reason people dont want dps meters is because they are bad?
    The only reason I dont want dps meters in the game is because it adds an element of competition to the game. If there is a meter you wanna be on top.
    But this is a MMO, its build around cooperation not around you stroking your own Epeen. Some might believe that the dps meter will make people try harder. Yes, they will try harder to be at top spot and forget about more important things, such as mechanics, CC etc.
    Allow parsers that show people their own dps but do not allow parsers that show others. It will be a stupid flamefest, just like wow is now.
    Besides...it was never hard to top damage meters. Being a good player is something very different then simply knowing what 3 buttons to press when and in what order.
    If you cannot tell whether your doing the right thing without a meter telling you so, well then you sir are pretty bad.

  11. #11
    Rift Master bubulu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fayde View Post
    They are for the lazy you want every thing given to you and thats what the mods do why bother to learn when you can get a nice mod to tell you every thing and save all the bother of learning how to play your class.
    How do you know you are performing? As I said earlier, most people have high opinion of themselves. I examine parser b/c I am lazy? I spent extra time after every raid and I am lazy? You are learning your class but have no clue what other similar classes are doing?

    Get a grip. Learning =/= randomly guessing during raids. ACT in EQ2 is nothing but a compilation of your combat log, so basically I am examining combat log after every fight while you just randomly "learning."

    You might be confused parser with deadly boss mod in WoW.
    Last edited by bubulu; 02-13-2011 at 09:45 AM.

  12. #12
    Rift Disciple Mucera's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shhhh View Post
    I was running foul cascade as necro at level 31 and doing 206 dps sustained on single target fights (not aoe as aoe goes way up). After I left the party a guildmate ran it again later (hes a healer) and the party he was in had 2 mages in it specifically brought in to DPS that were level 34 (3 levels higher) and after wiping on bosses that seemed to take forever to kill he used the same dps meter and parsed them at averaging 44 dps per fight.

    After he explained this to them they made some changes in their rotation and were able to get it up to nearly 100 dps per fight. It was still pathetic but more than twice their original dps, and it was enough to actually kill the bosses.

    Had he not been able to parse that DPS the mages three levels higher who thought they were doing great dps wouldn't have learned to switch rotations to get higher dps to kill the boss.

    food for thought.
    Oh my , game not out yet and people complain that some havent figured out the mechanics yet.
    I am usually trying to be sympathetic but that tool and parse whining makes me sick. Pathetic people with the always reoccuring excuse of trying to help people improve when all it is is the selfish thought of someone not living up to your standards and wasting your time.

    Some are at least honest about it. And guess what, games that dont use tools, people still beat the content and had fun, isnt that a bummer.

  13. #13
    Zac
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    mhh... there is '/combatlog', which writes all the combat stuff in the games directory on your hdd and there is this act thingy, is there really a need for an ingame in-fight one?

    If /combatlog is a bit bugged and has a low range, then let's fix it.

    And it's still a beta, most ppl try to figure out a good build for themselves... no reason to insta-kick someone, just help him find a 'better' build, if it's not good for party/raiding.

  14. #14
    Rift Chaser OdinTGE's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fayde View Post
    The is no need for this kind of Mod at all.

    People will learn in time how to set up there skill chains to do the most damage they if they can not learn that then giving them a mod that tells them there DPS is not going to be much help to them.
    No they won't. There are people out there who simply will not do anything but mash whatever buttons they want and have no clue they're doing 1/6th the dps they should be doing. Meters are a requirement for group and raid play.


    Quote Originally Posted by bubulu View Post
    You might be confused parser with deadly boss mod in WoW.
    It does sort of seem that way. However it can't be that so many people are confusing DPS meters with DXE/DBM/Big Wigs etc.


    There is honestly no argument against DPS meters other than 'I don't want people to know I'm bad'. Having a way to tell who's pulling their weight is vitally important to end game raiding and anybody who says using a meter makes you bad or lazy has it backwards.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mucera View Post
    Oh my , game not out yet and people complain that some havent figured out the mechanics yet.
    Why not? We're playing a group based game in which my fun and success require the input of others. Why should I not expect that they'll be competent? I'm not saying they need to be the greatest DPS ever but in the case of this guy's story you're dealing with people performing at something like 1/5th of their potential and drastically holding their group back. That's the kind of thing other sin the group need to be aware of.
    Last edited by OdinTGE; 02-13-2011 at 10:02 AM.

  15. #15
    Plane Touched Xiomaro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rikam View Post
    it can be a boon to people who are trying to play properly.
    A boon is a good thing (Just so you know )

    On topic:
    I think any diagnostic tool in an RPG is a good thing. People are going to min / max whether you like it or not. That's one of the defining features of an RPG. And competitiveness is a defining feature of any online game. Rift, being an MMORPG, can only benefit from tools that make this kind of diagnostic easier.

    The problem lies in peoples' interpretation of this data. Parsers don't measure how well you play, they measure statistics. You don't judge a sportsman on his or her playing statistics, you judge them on their performance! The same should apply to games.

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