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Thread: Chloropyro vs. Chlorolock

  1. #1
    Rift Disciple
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    Default Chloropyro vs. Chlorolock

    Specs:

    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0z...dIh0h00oM.e.-7 30/28/8

    Glyphs of Power = 10%
    Dark Power: 10%
    Improved Mage Armor: 10%
    Sacrifice Life: 20%
    Entropic Veil: 19%
    Total: 49.5% (assuming 100% uptime between SL and EV)

    Perks:
    Opportunity
    More HP

    Primary Damage:
    VB + LL refresh/Vile Spores

    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0z....e0c0uucV0V.-7 34/32/0

    Improved Glyphs of Power: 15%
    Improved Flame Bolt: 10%
    Interalize Charge: 20%
    Total: 35% (assuming 50% uptime of IC)

    Perks:
    Flicker
    Fiery Resolve
    0.5 less GCD
    Burning Shield
    Essence Surge

    Primary Damage:
    Flame Bolt/Vile Spores

    While Chloropyro obviously has more utility, the claim that it parses higher than Chlorolock doesn't make sense to me. It has less overall damage modifiers, and given that we're mostly spamming Vile Spores, it wouldn't make sense to include stuff like Fire Armor or Neddra's Influence in the equation. The only real benefit I'm seeing is the cleanse factor, which applies mainly to fights like Silgen, but is otherwise worthless when most casts are longer than a 1.5 gcd (like Vile Spores or Fireball if that's being used).
    Last edited by Morank; 08-19-2012 at 02:35 PM.

  2. #2
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    dont think anyone ever said that the Sustained HPS of a chloro/pyro is better than chloro/lock. But if you actually look what 1 sec gcd brings to the table atleast I would rather go pyro/chloro.

    Healing-wise: Mostly you need burst healing in raids. Assuming you are in the middle of a Vile spores you wait till that cast is done then you can cast Ruin + Flourish + a Bloom. That to get the aoe healing and then spot heal one person. That would take 3 seconds in chloro/lock and 2 seconds in pyro/chloro. That difference can be life or wipe in a tough raid scenario.

    DPS-wise: That Chloro/lock is higher sustained HPS would seem to make it good on fights like Ituziel. That is mostly wrong though cause you can get Heatwave in pyro/chloro and since you dont have to heal before 30% assuming you have enough cleric healers, you can use Withering Vine, ruin and Nature's Fury to increase your DPS with the 1 sec gcd. With Heatwave this do 2k+ dps in good ID-gear. Also faster Radiant spores if you are doing that will increase your dps/healing aswell.

    So you are probably right that it's better looking at numbers since it should do more HPS Sustained, but considering pyro/chloro has better burst and spot healing AND Heatwave and Flicker most ppl choose pyro/chloro over chloro/lock.
    Last edited by mr3onion; 08-19-2012 at 03:58 PM.

  3. #3
    Ascendant Ianto Jones's Avatar
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    you're assuming those dmg modifiers are additive in that way

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ianto Jones View Post
    you're assuming those dmg modifiers are additive in that way
    which they are? Or what do you mean?

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    Ascendant Aguni's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ianto Jones View Post
    you're assuming those dmg modifiers are additive in that way
    They are additive damage modifiers.
    The only multiplicative modifier is that of Living Infusion if I remember right.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mr3onion View Post
    dont think anyone ever said that the Sustained HPS of a chloro/pyro is better than chloro/lock.
    I was thinking that due to the passives plus 100% uptime of bonus (SL + EV) it would have higher DPS and higher HPS.

    Quote Originally Posted by mr3onion View Post
    you can get Heatwave in pyro/chloro and since you dont have to heal before 30% assuming you have enough cleric healers, you can use Withering Vine, ruin and Nature's Fury to increase your DPS with the 1 sec gcd. With Heatwave this do 2k+ dps in good ID-gear.
    Heat Wave only increases cast time of fire spells, tho', so Nature's Fury, etc, wouldn't benefit from it. You would pretty much spam fireball, same as always.

  7. #7
    Ascendant Pixel Monkey's Avatar
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    you have to ask yourself, with untrained glyphs, as a healer, are you able to withstand 5% more damage
    depends what youre up to i suppose
    fc is pointless unless youre standing in pbaoe enjoying the 5% extra damage on yourself, i would have gone for bf
    Last edited by Pixel Monkey; 08-19-2012 at 08:33 PM.
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  8. #8
    Prophet of Telara BrownsMageNerfDelivery's Avatar
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    Chloropyro because it sucks trying to AoE with Devouring Shadows and you don't have to respec for Silgen. Chlorolock just feels slow TBH though it's more sustained heals.

    Might as well just go 38/20/8 or something for more DPS in a chlorolock variant.

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  9. #9
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    Dunno about u guys, but I parsed higher with Pyro against a dummy.
    It wasn't a huge difference, but a dps gain none the less.
    Also yeah, that 1s gcd means you can react much faster, and since you have a fair few insta spells, that makes a huge difference.
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    I've personally had the best luck with 36/30/0 chloro/lock/chon. 100% sld or ev uptime, increased health, stats from pillaging and searing. Opp procs help with healing and I've never really stressed a GCD, the heals are consistently high enough it's almost like constant burst-level hps.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CreepyD View Post
    Dunno about u guys, but I parsed higher with Pyro against a dummy.
    It wasn't a huge difference, but a dps gain none the less.
    Also yeah, that 1s gcd means you can react much faster, and since you have a fair few insta spells, that makes a huge difference.
    Parsed higher using what spells / rotations? If you were just spamming fireball + flame bolt, then it probably would be higher, but spamming fireball isn't going to heal a raid due to the non-life loss.
    Last edited by Morank; 08-20-2012 at 01:15 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pixel Monkey View Post
    you have to ask yourself, with untrained glyphs, as a healer, are you able to withstand 5% more damage
    The answer is always going to be "yes" since chloros have significantly more hp than archons.

    Whether or not you can stay out of the fire is an entirely different story.

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    Pyro chloro is a healing utility build.. As such you should be using life damage abilities that offer healing most of the time w\ the option of contributing to aoe stuff w\ firestorm.

    Quote Originally Posted by BrownsMageNerfDelivery View Post

    Might as well just go 38/20/8 or something for more DPS in a chlorolock variant.
    Where are you suggesting those points are put? what would you be putting 8 points into?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Archemys View Post
    Pyro chloro is a healing utility build.. As such you should be using life damage abilities that offer healing most of the time w\ the option of contributing to aoe stuff w\ firestorm.

    Where are you suggesting those points are put? what would you be putting 8 points into?
    Using life damage all the time is wasting some of the pyro/chloros potential. All fights have downtime in aoe dmg when no healing is necessary. Thats when you use Fire spells as a Pyro/chloro. This is to maximize the things you can do to help the raid. Overhealing doesnt help anyone.

    I would ASSUME that is the thinking with 38/28 lock/chloro aswell. With 38 points in Warlock you get Defile which, again, doesn't do anything for your healing but it does increase your DPS. You can also use Life leech and Dark touch etc. This build is very good if you need for examle one ruin + flourish combo every 20 sec. Then you can use dps-rotation while waiting for the next healing-intensive moment.

    Edit: For example like this: http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=1z....xdI0VV0zoM.-7
    Last edited by mr3onion; 08-21-2012 at 07:36 AM.

  15. #15
    Prophet of Telara BrownsMageNerfDelivery's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Archemys View Post
    Pyro chloro is a healing utility build.. As such you should be using life damage abilities that offer healing most of the time w\ the option of contributing to aoe stuff w\ firestorm.

    Where are you suggesting those points are put? what would you be putting 8 points into?
    The whole point of hybrid builds is to offer more DPS, so using solely life damage abilities when there is not significant, constant damage going out across the raid somewhat defeats the purpose of using a hybrid.

    8 points would go into Fiery Concentration, Ignition.

    Regardless, the point of hybrid builds is to passively put out a few splash heals when you DPS (trying to keep Vile Spores + First DoT tick rolling, but mostly drastically reduced heals from non-Life damage) and then focus on Vile Spores when **** hits the fan.

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